Kurt..........to respond to your 1st thought, may I say Many Christians are shocked when they read Romans 9:13.............. “Just as it is written: ‘Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.’”
But this as is the case in most situations just needs a little more intense study than just what is stated.
A more careful reading of this passage indicates that the subject is not individual salvation, but Israel’s national role in redemptive history. Paul is actually quoting from Mal. 1:2-3 and when we read those verses in the context of Malachi’s book clearly indicates that Malachi is using the word “Jacob” to refer to the nation of Israel and the word “Esau” to refer to the nation of Edom.
It is also important to explain that the word used for “hate” in Malachi 1 is a Hebrew idiom which actually means to “love less.” Dr. Oliver B. Green explains..............................
“This is evident from Gen. 29:30: The phrase ‘loved Rachel more than Leah’ is used as the equivalent of ‘Leah was hated’ (cf. also Matt. 10:37).”
God does not hate anyone, but he does bless some nations more than others.
Now having understood that we can see that makes perfect sense because Romans 9, 10, and 11 are all about national Israel and her role in redemptive history. Romans 9 refers to Israel’s past, Romans 10 refers to her present, and Romans 11 refers to her future. It is a serious exegetical mistake to interpret Romans 9 to be referring to individuals’ salvation.
Major, thanks again for your reply.
I'm going to have to do some more research into what you're saying about "loved less," etc. Respectfully, I'm not ready to buy into that right away. Just looking at my Strong's concordance, the word "hate" from Romans 9:13 is transliterated "miseo" and means "to hate, pursue with hatred, detest."
Even so, your point the passage referring to national salvation instead of individual salvation is noted, but I'm not sure what difference that really makes. Unless God just "loves them less" (which I'm not ready to accept yet) He just hates national Edom instead of just Esau, right? I guess I'm failing to see how your expansion from individual to nation strengthens your argument.
I understand "ALL & ANY" to mean the salvation of ALL and ANY who will trust in Christ.
Kurt, please note that the word ....."any" = Greek word tis = someone, certain one & in the plural here = "certain ones" which is the so-called "individualizing plural" which speaks of God's desire for men individually to not perish, and is not a generalization about certain groups or classes of people which would include the "Elect".
All (3956) (pas, plural = pantas) means all with no exceptions.
So then my brother, the plain thrust of Peter's teaching in this section that you have posted is that after the second coming, ushering in the judgment of fire/war, there will be no further opportunity for repentance. You must also note what is clearly NOT being taught in passages like this -- There is absolutely no indication of a "secret decree" by God
which predestinates certain souls to eternal damnation
That thought, I must agree, having deceptive attraction, and having a false look of truth, argument is not substantiated in the current text nor anywhere else in the Scriptures. We must look deeper at the Word and ask the Holy Spirit for guidence so as to grasp these things of higher thought.
Well, I wasn't really using this verse to support my argument. Rather, I was dissecting it to show that it doesn't support the opposing side. But yes, I'm aware that not every verse in the Bible is going to support predestination. I'd like to talk about that too, but that's probably a topic for another thread entirely.