Baptism

[2404]

Our atonement is through Jesus Christ. Should we not then identify with that name in Baptism, instead of the titles as stated in Mt. 28:19? (Father is not a name...)
Then why does Jesus command us such in MT. 28:19? The answer is quite simple if we look at His 'personal' references in His ministry. He would make references to Himself in 3rd person to the point where the people would say 'tell us plainly' or as in Lk. 23:3 letting them draw their own conclusions.
We know that His church is built by revelation and Baptism is no different.
As I understand it...

 

[Major]

Our atonement is through Jesus Christ. Should we not then identify with that name in Baptism, instead of the titles as stated in Mt. 28:19? (Father is not a name...)
Then why does Jesus command us such in MT. 28:19? The answer is quite simple if we look at His 'personal' references in His ministry. He would make references to Himself in 3rd person to the point where the people would say 'tell us plainly' or as in Lk. 23:3 letting them draw their own conclusions.
We know that His church is built by revelation and Baptism is no different.
As I understand it...

Yes we should. As long as we do not think that being baptized saves us. It is an outward sign of an inward change.
The word "in" is better translated "into." At our baptism, we are immersed into the name of the Father. We now bear that name and all it implies! As sons of God. , we bear our Father's name. "God" is our spiritual family name!

 

[2404]

Thank you Major for your reply.
Agreed baptism doesn't save you it is an outward expression of what happened on the inside.
I also believe immersion is correct.
I cut my teeth in Baptist theology and attended a Baptist church for a good number of years however since then I have come to understand that the 'NAME' (Singular) of the Father and the Son and the Holy Ghost is the Lord Jesus Christ. I believe that it is significant to be baptised just the way scripture says. It is not my intention to criticize another person's convictions. As a Christian I simply want to share what I've found what happens after that is not my responsibility.
I expect you are comfortable where you are at so all I want to say is God bless you.

 

[Major]

Thank you Major for your reply.
Agreed baptism doesn't save you it is an outward expression of what happened on the inside.
I also believe immersion is correct.
I cut my teeth in Baptist theology and attended a Baptist church for a good number of years however since then I have come to understand that the 'NAME' (Singular) of the Father and the Son and the Holy Ghost is the Lord Jesus Christ. I believe that it is significant to be baptised just the way scripture says. It is not my intention to criticize another person's convictions. As a Christian I simply want to share what I've found what happens after that is not my responsibility.
I expect you are comfortable where you are at so all I want to say is God bless you.

I am agreeing with you my brother!

Yes sir.....immersion is the preferred method. I have however done "sprinkling" due to the extreme health of the person wanting to be baptized.

 

[Foundsheep]

Mark 16:16
15He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. 16Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

The verse does not state that if you are not baptized you are condemned, which corroborates elsewhere in the bible where it talks about salvation by grace through faith alone.

I think Catholics have a term for this, it's called baptism of intention.

 

[Major]

Mark 16:16
15He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. 16Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

The verse does not state that if you are not baptized you are condemned, which corroborates elsewhere in the bible where it talks about salvation by grace through faith alone.

I think Catholics have a term for this, it's called baptism of intention.

Welcome!

I agree with your post!

 

[2404]

Mark 16:16
15He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. 16Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

The verse does not state that if you are not baptized you are condemned, which corroborates elsewhere in the bible where it talks about salvation by grace through faith alone.

I think Catholics have a term for this, it's called baptism of intention.

True, baptism in itself doesn't save anyone and I believe there is a measure of truth to what you said but I don't think we dare cheapen the grace and just take things as we please. I believe the price paid is far greater than we can imagine and if I have any good sense I want to do exactly what is required 'working out my salvation with fear and trembling'. God is not mocked so if He says be baptised I don't want to second guess it, if it is at all possible for me to do it. There may be some room for discussion with the Lord but I don't intend to try it, lol.

 

[forgiven61]

baptism follows salvation it is important but how ever if one gets saved and passes away before being baptized it will not keep them out of heaven . ino baptism is a type work .the most important baptism is the baptism of the Holy spirit . by one spirit are we baptized into the Body of Christ

1 Corinthians 12:13​

“For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.” if you come tto the churcch i pastor my question from the pulpit are you born again

 

[YeshuaFan]

Yes we should. As long as we do not think that being baptized saves us. It is an outward sign of an inward change.
The word "in" is better translated "into." At our baptism, we are immersed into the name of the Father. We now bear that name and all it implies! As sons of God. , we bear our Father's name. "God" is our spiritual family name!

There is where Jesus Only and other cults err, as they say one must be saved by just baptizing into name of Jesus alone, but the water baptism into Jesus as in Acts refers to Him being the source of the salvation, not a formula how to get baptized!

 

[Lanolin]

Well the name of Jesus is the only name by which anyone is saved, so it is appropriate that this is the name mentioned upon baptism.

See Acts 2…11This Jesus is ‘the stone you builders rejected, which has become the cornerstone.’ 12 Salvation exists in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved.”

Romans 10
But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,”d that is, the word of faith we are proclaiming: 9that if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For with your heart you believe and are justified, and with your mouth you confess and are saved.

11It is just as the Scripture says: “Anyone who believes in Him will never be put to shame.”e 12For there is no difference between Jew and Greek: The same Lord is Lord of all, and gives richly to all who call on Him, 13for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”f

Note: Jesus is Lord

When someone is a brand new believer, they not necessarily going to discern who 'Father, Son and Holy Spirit' are, or that the Lord IS Jesus Christ.
Father could mean...their earthly dad, their own son, and holy spirit could be any old ghost! Lord could mean their landlord. God could mean any god, like Thor, or Allah or whoever. Especially if they come out of another religion. People call the Pope 'Father' when he's not actually, and some believe in Father Christmas!

You need to be specfic and mention the name above all names Jesus Christ as Lord. That is WHO we believe in.
I understand people are lazy about this and think the trinity just is self evident. Yes the trinity is important but that is a WITNESS to Jesus' name. Jesus means 'salvation'. That is why His name is important. None of us get baptised 'in the name of God'

Anyway, I always thought it was curious that ministers were lazy and did this when in the Bible, Acts 2:38 mentions Jesus name very specifically and on many other occasions.

If I see someone doing this (lazily saying 'I baptise you in the name of the Father, Son and Holy spirit' I want to shout to them YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG...don't fake baptise people! Its not about YOU (the baptiser! and how good you sound with an incantation) it's about JESUS.

And the very sad thing is...now there are so many 'believers' who think they are baptised when they were not..and that is why so many have problems with their walk. I was even fake baptised. I had to do it again properly when God reminded me that the baptism I had at 17 was church ritual baptism that had no effect! (they didn't even check if you understood the gospel back then, it was like, do you want to become a christian? Ok we're going to dunk you in the fountain).

 

[forgiven61]

If I see someone doing this (lazily saying 'I baptise you in the name of the Father, Son and Holy spirit' I want to shout to them YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG...don't fake baptise people! Its not about YOU (the baptiser! and how good you sound with an incantation) it's about JESUS.

how you figure ? the great commission

Matthew Chapter 28​

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

and holy spirit could be any old ghost!---------------- " may i ask where you get this from? "

while the Book of acts often called the acts of the spirit . Jesus gave the command to baptize in the name of the father son Holy ghost / spirit . your getting in to apostolic teaching

 

[2404]

Well the name of Jesus is the only name by which anyone is saved, so it is appropriate that this is the name mentioned upon baptism.

See Acts 2…11This Jesus is ‘the stone you builders rejected, which has become the cornerstone.’ 12 Salvation exists in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved.”

Romans 10
But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,”d that is, the word of faith we are proclaiming: 9that if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For with your heart you believe and are justified, and with your mouth you confess and are saved.

11It is just as the Scripture says: “Anyone who believes in Him will never be put to shame.”e 12For there is no difference between Jew and Greek: The same Lord is Lord of all, and gives richly to all who call on Him, 13for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”f

Note: Jesus is Lord

When someone is a brand new believer, they not necessarily going to discern who 'Father, Son and Holy Spirit' are, or that the Lord IS Jesus Christ.
Father could mean...their earthly dad, their own son, and holy spirit could be any old ghost! Lord could mean their landlord. God could mean any god, like Thor, or Allah or whoever. Especially if they come out of another religion. People call the Pope 'Father' when he's not actually, and some believe in Father Christmas!

You need to be specfic and mention the name above all names Jesus Christ as Lord. That is WHO we believe in.
I understand people are lazy about this and think the trinity just is self evident. Yes the trinity is important but that is a WITNESS to Jesus' name. Jesus means 'salvation'. That is why His name is important. None of us get baptised 'in the name of God'

Anyway, I always thought it was curious that ministers were lazy and did this when in the Bible, Acts 2:38 mentions Jesus name very specifically and on many other occasions.

If I see someone doing this (lazily saying 'I baptise you in the name of the Father, Son and Holy spirit' I want to shout to them YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG...don't fake baptise people! Its not about YOU (the baptiser! and how good you sound with an incantation) it's about JESUS.

And the very sad thing is...now there are so many 'believers' who think they are baptised when they were not..and that is why so many have problems with their walk. I was even fake baptised. I had to do it again properly when God reminded me that the baptism I had at 17 was church ritual baptism that had no effect! (they didn't even check if you understood the gospel back then, it was like, do you want to become a christian? Ok we're going to dunk you in the fountain).

Some good points there Lanolin.
Thank you.

 

[forgiven61]

I believe in the same Baptism that Abraham experienced; the Baptism of Spiritual Circumcision:

Colossians 2:11-13 NLT - "When you came to Christ, you were "circumcised," but not by a physical procedure. Christ performed a spiritual circumcision--the cutting away of your sinful nature. For you were buried with Christ when you were baptized. And with him you were raised to new life because you trusted the mighty power of God, who raised Christ from the dead. You were dead because of your sins and because your sinful nature was not yet cut away. Then God made you alive with Christ, for he forgave all our sins."

we place to much emphasis on dos and don'ts--than we do baptism if the spirit

 

[forgiven61]

I place a personal emphasis on obedience in my life because it testifies whether or not my heart has been

that is very important simply because the holy spirit leads us.. if we do it of our own effort then it becomes law and of no avail

 

[forgiven61]

I don't know how it is for other people, but when I was Baptized by the Holy Spirit, this was the moment that Christ Circumcised my unregenerate heart of the Curse of the Lord; the Adamic Curse as described in Romans chapter 4. The moment that my heart was Circumcised by Christ, this was the moment that Christ lifted of the Veil of Moses, or, the Spiritual Confusion that comes with an uncircumcised heart, so that I could Spiritually "see."

everyone has there own way of saying things what you said is bible he gives us a new heart and a heart to know him. change is a progress

 

[forgiven61]

I wish that all Christians" had a standard way of explaining things . . . which would mean that we use Biblical phrases to explain Biblical principles.

i use words phrases that brings it down to a way of understanding... i dont cheapen it i sometimes paraphrase not everyone understands the bible. so i bring it down so they can

 

[crossnote]

Yes, I have been slowly changed so that I reflect more and more of the Lord's Glorious Image, but I have also obtained freedom, just as the passage above states. But freedom from what? I was set free from all worldly laws that might judge me. If I were Jewish, I have been set free from the Law of Moses, but as a Gentile, I am set free from all worldly laws that judge my person; my character . . . thus I am Truly Confident. Paul showed me this concept in the below text:

When it comes to our freedom, would you say the growth is in our realizing our freedom in Christ rather than progressively becoming free?
IOW we were just as free as we were the day we were born again, but now we have grown to realize more and more that freedom.