How do we reopen and get back to normal.

Mar 27, 2010
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Florida
The beaches are opening...
Florida beaches open: A list of reopens, restrictions, hours

The stores and restuarants are opening...
Omaha restaurants pleased they can open back up

Kendra Scott, Allens Boots among Texas stores reopening Friday with retail to-go

The offices are planning their opening back up and getting business running..
How the biggest companies in the world are preparing to bring back their workforce

The states are opening back up....
These Are the States Opening Back Up for Business

So what do we need to set up so we can eat, work, play, and socialize at a normal level, even if a new normal
 
Feb 10, 2015
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We need to know where the virus is and how it is spreading even among non symptomatic population.

That means testing the non symptomatic population.

Rather than reporting how many total cases there are, we need to know how many active cases there are on a per capita basis and in finer detail than simply state per state.

Then we can understand how it is moving and make more reliable predictions about the near future.

We also could use effective treatment, which takes some time, even after the treatment is developed.

For myself. staying home is only an inconvenience. I am retired, so I am not losing work time. But I miss traveling to see my sons. I live in a less populated area (Garrett county Maryland) which is not a hot-spot. According to the Maryland Corona Virus website Garret county has only had 4 confirmed cases (and this has been at 4 for weeks).

Others are much more impacted, Jobs are being lost and businesses arr in peril. My younger son works at a Walmart in northern Virginia where there is a much higher rate of infection, he also has a 2nd job at Home depot. He is concerned and he sees people he works with being tested positive. We used to go visit him about twice a month. We want to go, but we need the infection rate to be very low before we go.

So, I will let the state governments weigh what is medically prudent against the economic harm being done. I just want them to have real information to work from.
 
Dec 19, 2014
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yea. I don't know how it is in america but hardly anyone's going back to school even though they were told to reopen at level 3 yesterday.
Parents have enough sense to protect their children, even though govt is always going on how it's older people that are vulnerable. They don't actually know how the virus infects children and what their symptoms might be, over a longer period of time. It can even mutate. Teachers don't want to risk it either, and we already have effective distant learning in place.
 
Dec 19, 2014
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When people only look at one thing eg business, and don't count the cost of people actually dying or being sick and how that affects work, they are really not taking into account being a good employer. And self employed people can only protect their best asset, which is themselves! If they get sick or everyone gets sick they would have no customers anyway. So people need to learn new ways of doing things.

In nz tourism was big business, but now tourism needs to rethink itself. Hotels are now used as quarantine, and domestic travel has replaced international travel. People used to gathering in large numbers need to think smaller and utilise tech to hold meetings.

People need to learn how to garden and grow their own food. They need to make themselves a home they can live in and find new occupations that are practical and not pie in the sky. I know lots of people just gamble their future income away. Well you can't do that without affecting others around you. You need to put food on the table, food you grow and harvest yourself by planting a seed. You need to learn how to save that seed. Everyone can do their bit but it starts with each person taking that responsibility. If one person is lazy and decides to not do the right thing, it actually harms everyone else.
 

rtm3039

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Feb 5, 2019
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Miami, FL
The beaches are opening...
Florida beaches open: A list of reopens, restrictions, hours

The stores and restuarants are opening...
Omaha restaurants pleased they can open back up

Kendra Scott, Allens Boots among Texas stores reopening Friday with retail to-go

The offices are planning their opening back up and getting business running..
How the biggest companies in the world are preparing to bring back their workforce

The states are opening back up....
These Are the States Opening Back Up for Business

So what do we need to set up so we can eat, work, play, and socialize at a normal level, even if a new normal
Well, most of Florida. Miami-Dade (me), Broward, and Palm Beach, were not invited to the party.

Ray
 

rtm3039

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Feb 5, 2019
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When people only look at one thing eg business, and don't count the cost of people actually dying or being sick and how that affects work, they are really not taking into account being a good employer. And self employed people can only protect their best asset, which is themselves! If they get sick or everyone gets sick they would have no customers anyway. So people need to learn new ways of doing things.

In nz tourism was big business, but now tourism needs to rethink itself. Hotels are now used as quarantine, and domestic travel has replaced international travel. People used to gathering in large numbers need to think smaller and utilise tech to hold meetings.

People need to learn how to garden and grow their own food. They need to make themselves a home they can live in and find new occupations that are practical and not pie in the sky. I know lots of people just gamble their future income away. Well you can't do that without affecting others around you. You need to put food on the table, food you grow and harvest yourself by planting a seed. You need to learn how to save that seed. Everyone can do their bit but it starts with each person taking that responsibility. If one person is lazy and decides to not do the right thing, it actually harms everyone else.
I'm trying to picture millions of people growing their crops on their balconies. Hm, just can't picture it. What is a "pie in the sky" occupation?

rtm
 
Apr 9, 2020
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I agree, that the 1st thing we need are some very accurate tests that are readily available and either inexpensive or free. We need to be able to test for both being Covid positive at the time of testing and whether or not a person had been infected but somehow fought it off. With me, my doc thought I was infected and that I'm a little to no symptoms, case. But then we need to know if having been infected once means a person is then safe from reinfection. I know we had thought so, but I read a post from a man who heard that you can be reinfected and that reinfections are much more serious than the initial infection. This means we also need a better understanding of this virus. I want to be able to get out again but I don't want to constantly have to wear a mask & gloves. I also don't want to have to be concerned that groceries I bring home have a virus on them. I don't worry about this but I'd be lying if I said I don't even think about it. Since I'm highly resistant to the annual flu viruses I'm assuming I'll be resistant to this virus as well, but I think about it. Maybe it's ironic that I don't seem to be resistant to bacterial infections, but they are easily treated.

To sum up, we need more accurate tests and better knowledge on how this virus behaves.
 
Feb 10, 2015
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Maryland
You don't think it will follow the path of the 1918 Flu Pandemic and fade out?
Generalizations we thought we knew a month ago are proving unreliable.

At this point, too many 'knowns' are suspect. This appears to be much more infectious and with a substantial mortality rate but it can be killed from surfaces fairly easily. If new infections surpass our decontamination efforts it profits little.

There is contradictory evidence concerning whether having this confers reliable immunity making any vacine develipment a longer shot.

Also, our world is vastly more interconnected.

So it appears to be following its own path.
 
Mar 27, 2010
90
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Florida
Generalizations we thought we knew a month ago are proving unreliable.

At this point, too many 'knowns' are suspect. This appears to be much more infectious and with a substantial mortality rate but it can be killed from surfaces fairly easily. If new infections surpass our decontamination efforts it profits little.

There is contradictory evidence concerning whether having this confers reliable immunity making any vacine develipment a longer shot.

Also, our world is vastly more interconnected.

So it appears to be following its own path.
Well it seems to have followed the flights out of China, as when we were in Italy, there were numerous Chinese groups of tourist everywhere, more so than all the others. I commented to my wife about it, and kind of kept track, so I wasn't totally surprised when Italy became one of the first hotspots.

It seems to be fading now very quickly, whether from the heat or more sunlight, not quite sure. But we shall see by fall, whether it resurges or disappears altogether.
 

rtm3039

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Feb 5, 2019
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Well it seems to have followed the flights out of China, as when we were in Italy, there were numerous Chinese groups of tourist everywhere, more so than all the others. I commented to my wife about it, and kind of kept track, so I wasn't totally surprised when Italy became one of the first hotspots.

It seems to be fading now very quickly, whether from the heat or more sunlight, not quite sure. But we shall see by fall, whether it resurges or disappears altogether.
Don't sure I buy into the fading away very quickly. This is what it looked like this past week:

1588387140098.png
 
Dec 19, 2014
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China had a second wave after quite a big decline in deaths. Thing is viruses mutate.
So whether it mutates into something benign or even more deadly, we aren't sure. Uk reported that more children were having concerning symptoms that needed ICU but they weren't sure if it was related to the virus, as they weren't dying (yet).

All those who've recovered from it now will have antibodies, so they can provide a vaccine. However the tricky part is convincing everyone to get immunised. As many people are like no, which is pretty silly to me but they believe that it's like the mark of the beast or something.
 
Dec 19, 2014
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When Cuba was embargoed they spent a year or two growing their own food and they had barely any land to grow it on but they learned how to be self sufficient..and they are an even hotter climate than Florida. So it can be done.

Thing is do YOU want to do it or just think it can't be done. There will always be naysayers who don't want to change anything.
 
Mar 27, 2010
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Florida
When Cuba was embargoed they spent a year or two growing their own food and they had barely any land to grow it on but they learned how to be self sufficient..and they are an even hotter climate than Florida. So it can be done.

Thing is do YOU want to do it or just think it can't be done. There will always be naysayers who don't want to change anything.
We were there not long ago as my family had a house there back in the day, we lost everything except the clothes on our backs and my mothers iron (She wasn't going to give that to Fidel). Anyway, we sent our friends in Cuba a seat to fit their toilet, and they charged them $300 dollars to get it. Their neighbors came over just to see the seat as in the money the Cubans use is $1 USD = 25 CUP. So the $300 came out to 7500 CUP for a toilet seat for them. And this was a seat from Walmart....
 
Apr 9, 2020
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Don't sure I buy into the fading away very quickly.
I agree. I was looking at a website with charts and graphs, here in NY we have managed to slow the virus down by employing severe isolation techniques coupled with masks & gloves for everyone. But as soon as the curve dipped, it spiked again. I assume that folks were happy the virus slowed up so they relaxed the precautions they were taking so the curve spiked again.

IMO the only way we'd be rid of this quickly would be a world wide move to call on God, and I tend to doubt that will happen. I'm not yet hearing many people speak of God, more than a month ago, but not enough.
 

rtm3039

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Feb 5, 2019
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Lanolin, while I understand what you are saying, it's just not workable. Cuba has a population of 11 million, we have a population of 331 million. In places like Miami, no one has enough available land to grow enough of anything to sustain a single person for a year, but less the 2.7 million that live in Miami-Dade alone.

This sort of self-sufficiency is possible in rural areas, but it is not in urban areas and that is where most people are. When you factor in land needs, irrigation, livestock, feed, water, etc, it just does not work. The fact is that we have evolved beyond that option and for us to move back in that direction will require that COVID-19 come with zombies.

Our population density of around 1,500 people per square mile. "Research in the 1970s by John Jeavons and the Ecology Action Organization found that 4000 square feet (about 370 square metres) of growing space was enough land to sustain one person on a vegetarian diet for a year, with about another 4000 square feet (370 square meters) for access paths and storage – so that’s a plot around 80 feet x 100 feet (24m x 30m)." (https://www.growveg.com/guides/growing-enough-food-to-feed-a-family/). So, with a mile being around 63,360 square feet, and each person needing around 8,000 square feet, it comes out to about 8 people per square mile and that leaves us short by around 1,492 people per square mile.

Now we have special people here called "preppers." They too are into self-sufficiently; however, their game plan includes storing packaged food, not growing it.

rtm
 
Sep 7, 2019
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Ultimately the only person responsible for my health is me. I will remain as safe as I possibly can with limited public interactions, and PPE's.
What is open and what is not remains irrelevant at this point (for me with an autoimmune disease). In NC we are forced preppers due to the weather.
Between hurricanes and tornado plans most homes which can afford it are well stocked (including ammo).
 
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