We know somethings about the spiritual walk, and about God.
We know that the new birth is a spiritual event. It can't be seen, or manipulated. It is truly invisible, and belongs not in the physical realm, but the spirit realm. It may or may not be accomplished by your belief, by doing good things, agreeing with my doctrines, or by sacrificing your life to God.
This new birth is orchestrated ONLY by God. We respond to His offer of mercy and grace. Without Him it can't take place. Religious actions will not effect this event
Those who the new birth happens to from outer appearances look like the rest of us, and we to them.
The one who REALLY knows, that this new birth has occurred to you, me, and the persons next to us, or all over this world is God. He is the only one who truly knows, because he is building the house.
This event and these people that it has happened to are in a spiritual way invisible to us. (Unless a great discernment is given to us, by God, and this "usually" doesn't happen.
ALL OF THIS (The above) causes some very meaningful questions to arise.
1) Fellowship. Is fellowship not the same as the new birth, I mean it is a spiritual event. It is not a physical one (necessarily). It's not defined by a potluck. In fact you could go to church, find your pastor, you and he could talk about heavenly things and in God's opinion NOT have fellowship. My premise is, ONLY the ecclesia can fellowship with God and thus with each other.
2). These people while physically visible and present, and are in a way invisible to us, we don't know for sure who they are. We also can not gather with all of them, because we don't know who they are, nor where they are at.
3). Have these people ever gathered together on this earth? Yes, the first local and universal church in the book of Acts. Has it happened since that time? No! What effect did they're gathering in one place bring? A huge spiritual dynamic, life altering change.
*What leads me to believe these people are unknown by us, or only by great discernment?
I remember during the Jesus movement, going out to street minister, you met all kinds of people, the question usually arose "Are you born again".
There were occasions when people would say yes, and those of us in the group, would look at each other and say to them again, "are you sure". Why? Because we didn't bare witness to the spirit in us, being in them.
Lastly the scripture say God will say "depart from me for I never knew you"... But Lord we healed , preached, ETC.... Also Paul says "examine yourself", and in another place ... "If you have been taught by Him"
*Anyway these are just things I am pondering.
We know that the new birth is a spiritual event. It can't be seen, or manipulated. It is truly invisible, and belongs not in the physical realm, but the spirit realm. It may or may not be accomplished by your belief, by doing good things, agreeing with my doctrines, or by sacrificing your life to God.
This new birth is orchestrated ONLY by God. We respond to His offer of mercy and grace. Without Him it can't take place. Religious actions will not effect this event
Those who the new birth happens to from outer appearances look like the rest of us, and we to them.
The one who REALLY knows, that this new birth has occurred to you, me, and the persons next to us, or all over this world is God. He is the only one who truly knows, because he is building the house.
This event and these people that it has happened to are in a spiritual way invisible to us. (Unless a great discernment is given to us, by God, and this "usually" doesn't happen.
ALL OF THIS (The above) causes some very meaningful questions to arise.
1) Fellowship. Is fellowship not the same as the new birth, I mean it is a spiritual event. It is not a physical one (necessarily). It's not defined by a potluck. In fact you could go to church, find your pastor, you and he could talk about heavenly things and in God's opinion NOT have fellowship. My premise is, ONLY the ecclesia can fellowship with God and thus with each other.
2). These people while physically visible and present, and are in a way invisible to us, we don't know for sure who they are. We also can not gather with all of them, because we don't know who they are, nor where they are at.
3). Have these people ever gathered together on this earth? Yes, the first local and universal church in the book of Acts. Has it happened since that time? No! What effect did they're gathering in one place bring? A huge spiritual dynamic, life altering change.
*What leads me to believe these people are unknown by us, or only by great discernment?
I remember during the Jesus movement, going out to street minister, you met all kinds of people, the question usually arose "Are you born again".
There were occasions when people would say yes, and those of us in the group, would look at each other and say to them again, "are you sure". Why? Because we didn't bare witness to the spirit in us, being in them.
Lastly the scripture say God will say "depart from me for I never knew you"... But Lord we healed , preached, ETC.... Also Paul says "examine yourself", and in another place ... "If you have been taught by Him"
*Anyway these are just things I am pondering.