Separating Separator

Oct 8, 2011
1,114
301
83
Winfield, Mo.
#1
Peace with God on our side can be unnecessarily interrupted when we think there could be times He may not be at peace with us on His side, which could never be. In Christ, He punishes not out of anger but rather disciplines out of love. Thus, everything a believer encounters and does is merely that which has to do with Him manifesting His love for us.

God is completely clear of all that we may think could interfere with His unbroken love and peace concerning His—and His desire is the same for us—to rest assured that we can always walk in peace toward Him. We may find disappointment in ourselves, but God is never disappointed in us (neither should we be), for He knows our “will” (regardless of the sin) is always to “please” (Phil 2:13) Him.
NC








Separating Separator

Our acceptance with the Father on the ground of the work of the Son (Eph 1:6) has been done perfectly, and is therefore unimprovable. It never alters, and it is very important for us not to mix our acceptance itself with our enjoyment of it. The acceptance is “in Christ,” and therefore unchangeable; the experiential enjoyment is “by the Spirit,” and therefore often hindered (because of the working of the indwelling old man).

In Romans 5 we have the truth presented on the Father’s side: the terms He is on with us. There is another vital point for us to consider, namely, how we are before Him. This we get in chapter 8. The prodigal could have no doubt as to his father’s feelings towards him, when he covered him with kisses. His trouble was his own unfitness for the place—his unsuitability. He says, “I am no longer worthy to be called thy son.”

It is at this point that serious and protracted troubles arise in souls. The knowledge of grace and forgiveness is an assured reality; and then, too often, the effort is to make the flesh (old man, not the body—NC) subject to the law of God, which (we read) it “neither indeed can be” (Rom 8:7). The prodigal had the grace of forgiveness when His father embraced him; but he had to be made fit to enjoy this grace, and this also is effected for him. The best robe is put on him; he is no linger in his rags. In Christ there is no condemnation; everything of the old man is renounced. “If any man be in Christ, he is a new creation.” “Giving thanks unto the Father, who has made us to fit to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light” (2 Cor 5:17; Col 1:12).

How blessed to know that you are not connected in God’s sight with the man (original nature; old man—NC) under judgement, but with the Man who bore the judgement, and who has been raised from among the dead by the glory of the Father! What a blessed utterance for you in Romans 8:2: “The law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.” You have changed from Adam to Christ (concerning your nature—NC).

As before the Father, positionally, we are clear by faith through Christ (this is Romans 4 and 5), but as to yourself, your condition, it is not by faith that you get experientially clear, but by the Spirit of Christ (faith is the medium for transfer of power—NC). This is exceedingly important. No one is in liberty who is trying to improve the old man. He (it—NC) cannot be improved; you must be apart from him altogether. The death of the Cross is the separation; the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus is the Separator. In the end of Romans 7 you get experientially clear of him, and in the beginning of Romans 8 you are set free “in Christ” (while the old man yet indwells—NC). In Romans 5 we have the love of God shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who has been given unto us; but in chapter 8:2 it is not love but life.

The love of God is shed abroad in our hearts first: then life in Christ is known and enjoyed; ability by the Spirit to behold the Lord’s glory—all the Father’s satisfaction according to all His attributes expressed in Him. It is “the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ” (2 Cor 4:6). The growing result of our thus “beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, (is that we) are changed in to the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord” (2 Cor 3:18). Thus, in our growth, we become here descriptive of the Man seated at the right hand of the Father, not of the fallen, sinful and earthly man—Adam.

- J B Stoney







Excerpt from MJS devotional for August 21:

“The love motive is not adequate to carry the believer through to fruitful walk and service. Few seem to be able to face up to this fact, possibly because they see no higher alternative. But there is one: the life motive. “For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death” (Rom. 8:2).

“The law (i.e. of sin and death—NC) is for the man who departed from God—that man has been removed from God’s sight in the Cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, and I rejoice that now by the ‘law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus’ I am ‘free from the law of sin and death’ (Rom. 8:2).”

http://www.abideabove.com/hungry-heart/
 
Feb 5, 2018
26
20
3
Florida USA
#2
Very uplifting words indeed. We have regained our image of God through his continual giving of grace and faith support, lifted up high in his perfect human image of God, Jesus Christ.

NC, your words can only build up my confidence and my faith concerning the promises of God to me and every believer in his son.

Your salt is pure and effective...keep on preaching the truth

APAK
 

Fish Catcher Jim

<>< Radically Saved ><>
Staff member
Senior Moderator
Feb 7, 2015
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#3
Thus, everything a believer encounters and does is merely that which has to do with Him manifesting His love for us.
Greetings,
There you go again with this untruth of...Thus, everything a believer encounters and does is merely that which has to do with Him manifesting His love for us.

That's simple foolishness!
A believer can get off course by making their own choices and ignoring God and the consequences are purely of their own doing.
God and His Love had nothing to do with it.

You teach a what ever happens must be accepted because it's God Orchastrated.
There is no truth in that.
You teach that a believer is always where God wants them and that has no truth in it.

Sir I am not angry nor upset the slightest.
I just do not agree with your interpretation but I still Love You!!
Have a great day
Blessingso
FCJ
 
Amens/Likes: Cturtle
Oct 8, 2011
1,114
301
83
Winfield, Mo.
#4
Greetings,
There you go again with this untruth of...Thus, everything a believer encounters and does is merely that which has to do with Him manifesting His love for us.

That's simple foolishness!
A believer can get off course by making their own choices and ignoring God and the consequences are purely of their own doing.
I've always appreciated your replies Jim because you never try to compete but just want to get at the truth, and I'll always love you too Brother in Christ! Back to the grind, I would have to accept that God is not always successful in one who is reborn if he could desire something more than His "work" (Phil 2:13) in him. It's much more sensible to conclude that one who would ever choose to live against God's pleasure was never His to work in!
 
Oct 8, 2011
1,114
301
83
Winfield, Mo.
#5
Very uplifting words indeed. We have regained our image of God through his continual giving of grace and faith support, lifted up high in his perfect human image of God, Jesus Christ.

NC, your words can only build up my confidence and my faith concerning the promises of God to me and every believer in his son.

Your salt is pure and effective...keep on preaching the truth

APAK
As always APAK your expressions concerning your desires for these articles are encouraging to see! Thanks and God bless!
 

Fish Catcher Jim

<>< Radically Saved ><>
Staff member
Senior Moderator
Feb 7, 2015
10,586
12,942
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#6
I've always appreciated your replies Jim because you never try to compete but just want to get at the truth, and I'll always love you too Brother in Christ! Back to the grind, I would have to accept that God is not always successful in one who is reborn if he could desire something more than His "work" (Phil 2:13) in him. It's much more sensible to conclude that one who would ever choose to live against God's pleasure was never His to work in!
Thank You Sir,
It would be easy to write it off as sensible thinking that if one chose to do something against God's direction that God was never in them in the first place. However that now would make us judge on who is or is not saved and that's something that we have no authority to do.

Scripture says...For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Key here is Working.....this is far from being Perfected. God is always working but not all are as Receptive as others. Again He is Working in one to do His Will. Working means incorporating into.

So His Working in us is an ongoing event and until perfected believers are still making foolish choices which God has nothing to do with.

Blessings
FCJ
 
Amens/Likes: Cturtle
Oct 8, 2011
1,114
301
83
Winfield, Mo.
#7
Scripture says...For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.
Key here is Working.....this is far from being Perfected. [/QUOTE ]
I see the primary issue being what He is working in the believer--the will to do what pleases Him. Anyone not finding that always first in their life have never had Him, because He works this in all who are reborn.
 

Fish Catcher Jim

<>< Radically Saved ><>
Staff member
Senior Moderator
Feb 7, 2015
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12,942
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#8
Scripture says...For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.
Key here is Working.....this is far from being Perfected. [/QUOTE ]
I see the primary issue being what He is working in the believer--the will to do what pleases Him. Anyone not finding that always first in their life have never had Him, because He works this in all who are reborn.
There is error in your judging those who have yet transformed even the slightest as to never had Him.

He is Working .... that is correct.
Working is not Perfected.
Working in not an instant change nor is the depth of His work showing , dictate if He has ever been in Him.

The Depth or Speed of His Working Depends on each individuals willingness to submit, listen, grasp and do. Many are to caught up in making a living or doing good in Jesus name looking for favor.
Blessings
 
Amens/Likes: Cturtle
Oct 8, 2011
1,114
301
83
Winfield, Mo.
#9
There is error in your judging those who have yet transformed even the slightest as to never had Him.

He is Working .... that is correct.
Working is not Perfected.
Working in not an instant change nor is the depth of His work showing , dictate if He has ever been in Him.

The Depth or Speed of His Working Depends on each individuals willingness to submit, listen, grasp and do. Many are to caught up in making a living or doing good in Jesus name looking for favor.
Blessings
I agree that it requires time to learn to show this desire, but it's the desire and not the manifestation of it to which I refer. The desire precedes the learning to live it, and learning to show it always in a deeper way, is lifelong.
 

Fish Catcher Jim

<>< Radically Saved ><>
Staff member
Senior Moderator
Feb 7, 2015
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#10
I agree that it requires time to learn to show this desire, but it's the desire and not the manifestation of it to which I refer. The desire precedes the learning to live it, and learning to show it always in a deeper way, is lifelong.
Right!!
Now until this Working is in full manifestation. .... a believer is more likely to make some choices outside of God's Will or Desire for them at that time and get out there some place they were never intended on being, thus reaping the consequences of their actions and God was not in it.

Blessings to you and your family
FCJ
 
Amens/Likes: Cturtle
Oct 8, 2011
1,114
301
83
Winfield, Mo.
#11
Right!!
Now until this Working is in full manifestation. .... a believer is more likely to make some choices outside of God's Will or Desire for them at that time and get out there some place they were never intended on being, thus reaping the consequences of their actions and God was not in it.

Blessings to you and your family
FCJ
I think we're slowly drifting apart from what we both think is the issue, but that's certainly okay!

God's blessing to your Family too Brother, and thanks again for your site labors in Christ!
 

Fish Catcher Jim

<>< Radically Saved ><>
Staff member
Senior Moderator
Feb 7, 2015
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#12
I think we're slowly drifting apart from what we both think is the issue, but that's certainly okay!

God's blessing to your Family too Brother, and thanks again for your site labors in Christ!
Thank you for not getting an attitude just because we are not saying the same thing.
Anger and frustration have no place in a forum or us as believers really.
Any way thank you again.
FCJ
 
Amens/Likes: Cturtle
#14
Peace with God on our side can be unnecessarily interrupted when we think there could be times He may not be at peace with us on His side, which could never be. In Christ, He punishes not out of anger but rather disciplines out of love. Thus, everything a believer encounters and does is merely that which has to do with Him manifesting His love for us.

God is completely clear of all that we may think could interfere with His unbroken love and peace concerning His—and His desire is the same for us—to rest assured that we can always walk in peace toward Him. We may find disappointment in ourselves, but God is never disappointed in us (neither should we be), for He knows our “will” (regardless of the sin) is always to “please” (Phil 2:13) Him.
NC









Separating Separator

Our acceptance with the Father on the ground of the work of the Son (Eph 1:6) has been done perfectly, and is therefore unimprovable. It never alters, and it is very important for us not to mix our acceptance itself with our enjoyment of it. The acceptance is “in Christ,” and therefore unchangeable; the experiential enjoyment is “by the Spirit,” and therefore often hindered (because of the working of the indwelling old man).

In Romans 5 we have the truth presented on the Father’s side: the terms He is on with us. There is another vital point for us to consider, namely, how we are before Him. This we get in chapter 8. The prodigal could have no doubt as to his father’s feelings towards him, when he covered him with kisses. His trouble was his own unfitness for the place—his unsuitability. He says, “I am no longer worthy to be called thy son.”

It is at this point that serious and protracted troubles arise in souls. The knowledge of grace and forgiveness is an assured reality; and then, too often, the effort is to make the flesh (old man, not the body—NC) subject to the law of God, which (we read) it “neither indeed can be” (Rom 8:7). The prodigal had the grace of forgiveness when His father embraced him; but he had to be made fit to enjoy this grace, and this also is effected for him. The best robe is put on him; he is no linger in his rags. In Christ there is no condemnation; everything of the old man is renounced. “If any man be in Christ, he is a new creation.” “Giving thanks unto the Father, who has made us to fit to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light” (2 Cor 5:17; Col 1:12).

How blessed to know that you are not connected in God’s sight with the man (original nature; old man—NC) under judgement, but with the Man who bore the judgement, and who has been raised from among the dead by the glory of the Father! What a blessed utterance for you in Romans 8:2: “The law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.” You have changed from Adam to Christ (concerning your nature—NC).

As before the Father, positionally, we are clear by faith through Christ (this is Romans 4 and 5), but as to yourself, your condition, it is not by faith that you get experientially clear, but by the Spirit of Christ (faith is the medium for transfer of power—NC). This is exceedingly important. No one is in liberty who is trying to improve the old man. He (it—NC) cannot be improved; you must be apart from him altogether. The death of the Cross is the separation; the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus is the Separator. In the end of Romans 7 you get experientially clear of him, and in the beginning of Romans 8 you are set free “in Christ” (while the old man yet indwells—NC). In Romans 5 we have the love of God shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who has been given unto us; but in chapter 8:2 it is not love but life.

The love of God is shed abroad in our hearts first: then life in Christ is known and enjoyed; ability by the Spirit to behold the Lord’s glory—all the Father’s satisfaction according to all His attributes expressed in Him. It is “the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ” (2 Cor 4:6). The growing result of our thus “beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, (is that we) are changed in to the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord” (2 Cor 3:18). Thus, in our growth, we become here descriptive of the Man seated at the right hand of the Father, not of the fallen, sinful and earthly man—Adam.

- J B Stoney







Excerpt from MJS devotional for August 21:

“The love motive is not adequate to carry the believer through to fruitful walk and service. Few seem to be able to face up to this fact, possibly because they see no higher alternative. But there is one: the life motive. “For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death” (Rom. 8:2).

“The law (i.e. of sin and death—NC) is for the man who departed from God—that man has been removed from God’s sight in the Cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, and I rejoice that now by the ‘law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus’ I am ‘free from the law of sin and death’ (Rom. 8:2).”
http://www.abideabove.com/hungry-heart/
I think what is said about the best robe is important...with the story of the prodigal son..that we are to be clothed in Christ. If we are clothed in Christ we are made righteous. We remove our rags and are clothed in Christ. Thats the separation...we dont try and mend our rags or even wash them we are given brand new clothes. Our own fig leaves cannot cover our shame. Only if we put on Christ.

We dont go try and put on our best clothes we have either in an attempt to impress Him. We wear what He gives to us.
 
#15
In thinking on this our Father is not an absentee parent who just leaves us to fend for ourselves or gets us to compete for his attention. If this is our experience then we might think we have to make our own way and make our own choices without ever really knowing what is the right one. Like trial and error.

But Jesus has given us the way and believers will walk in it. If we are reading the Bible there will always be guidance and direction right at our disposal. He is just a prayer away. The thing is even if we somehow miss this and stumble and fall if we admit our wrong God is just and faithful to forgive us. Many believers when starting out dont make reading the Bible a priority. Or later on they may fall in to a trap of that they think they know it all already. Well pride comes before a fall.

But see even ifa believer makes the wrong choice. GOd in his mercy has hands that are stretched out still. He's not going to leave you in a hole if you cry out to Him.
 

Fish Catcher Jim

<>< Radically Saved ><>
Staff member
Senior Moderator
Feb 7, 2015
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#16
But see even ifa believer makes the wrong choice. GOd in his mercy has hands that are stretched out still. He's not going to leave you in a hole if you cry out to Him.
Amen!! That's Big.....repentance or turning back to God
Blessings
 
Amens/Likes: Cturtle
Oct 8, 2011
1,114
301
83
Winfield, Mo.
#17
One of the encouraging concepts I find concerning “made us meet” is that of God lifting us above ourselves in our thoughts of unworthiness. The significance here is that though we realize we are unworthy apart from Christ, we learn that we are made (meet) worthy in Him; and the imputation of His righteousness unto us gives us one of among many divine attributes, so that we can see ourselves relating to Him in the holiness which He stands. Understanding that we are holy because He is holy provides for us a shameless union concerning our conscience, resulting in ourselves being more open towards God in the joy of our fellowship with Him; and this is what God joys in—our joy in Him!
 
#18
The holy part of us...which Jesus has given when we are saved, is complete and perfect. When you have the holy ghost dwelling in you nothing can ever separate this from God I.e, you can cannot separate that from Gods love.

If we grasp this we can understand why we are raised and why Jesus couldnt stay on earth and why we (believers) can be in the world but not of it. Heaven is our home its not this world which is flesh and blood.

A problem that people have is that there are times when a saved believer acts in ways that demonstrate they dont believe! You need to be singleminded (i,e mind of Christ) about what you believe to recieve anything from God. You cannot be doubleminded tossed there and there by every new wind of doctrine.

What it comes down to, and this is very basic core gospel. JEsus christ, son of God died for our sins on the cross and was raised to life.

This is what every believer must know.
It is no good half believing Jesus died for our sins and thats it. Or he was a good man. There are plenty of good people still in their graves. No, he was raised to life again. Nothing could separate him from Gods loved. Christ is risen!

I was watching a video of story of the Jews. Of course they know God, they remember his miracles they know the prophets from Moses and they hold to all the traditions God specified but the thing is do they actually BELIEVE. That is the question. Who do you say I am? JEsus asked...and it was a very good question. Even when Jesus came back to life many of his disciples were slow to believe...and Jesus upbraided them!

Have you ever had someone doubt you...you told them the truth and they just didnt believe you. You say to someone the sun will come up tomorrow but you have a doubter just doesnt believe you. Well you cannot convince them otherwise if they stubbornly wont believe even when the sun does come up. They will try and explain that it doesnt. Or there are clouds or theres rain I dont see it. You might have to take them to a mountaintop in the east early in the morning and say LOOK! Behold the sun does come up. Then they might believe you. But blessed are those who have not seen yet believe.
 
Oct 8, 2011
1,114
301
83
Winfield, Mo.
#19
The holy part of us...which Jesus has given when we are saved, is complete and perfect.
Nice reply with some good instructional comments Lan! I believe you make a significant mention here concerning "the holy part of us," which can only refer to our new nature, because it is divine (of course not making us divine but only "partakers" of it - 2 Pet 1:4), it being created "after the image" of Christ (Col 3:10). This is that part of Paul's "I" in Romans 7:17, 20, 22 that does not sin, and it is that part of the believer in 1 John 3:9 referred to as the "seed," which "cannot sin."

A problem that people have is that there are times when a saved believer acts in ways that demonstrate they dont believe! You need to be singleminded (i,e mind of Christ) about what you believe to recieve anything from God. You cannot be doubleminded tossed there and there by every new wind of doctrine.
Within the last 50 years or so a vast many believers have not grown much spiritually due to the nearly absent teaching in churches concerning the rudiments of spiritual growth, but I have no doubt that God eventually corrects this babe-in-Christ maturity in all who are His--given earthly time of course.
In my opinion, those who never grow may not be in the faith of the Gospel of Christ! Hence their disinterest in Church and Bible study, which could evince they've yet to "hear" His voice in the Word of God (John 10:16, 27; Heb 3:7, 15; 4:7).

I believe of all that God "works" in the believer concerning His "pleasure" (Phil 2:13), the desire for finding a church and Bible study would be His first priority that He would put in them, because one cannot be efficient enough in witnessing apart from them! So I would think a true believer would have these desires in them.
 
#20
Nice reply with some good instructional comments Lan! I believe you make a significant mention here concerning "the holy part of us," which can only refer to our new nature, because it is divine (of course not making us divine but only "partakers" of it - 2 Pet 1:4), it being created "after the image" of Christ (Col 3:10). This is that part of Paul's "I" in Romans 7:17, 20, 22 that does not sin, and it is that part of the believer in 1 John 3:9 referred to as the "seed," which "cannot sin."


Within the last 50 years or so a vast many believers have not grown much spiritually due to the nearly absent teaching in churches concerning the rudiments of spiritual growth, but I have no doubt that God eventually corrects this babe-in-Christ maturity in all who are His--given earthly time of course.
In my opinion, those who never grow may not be in the faith of the Gospel of Christ! Hence their disinterest in Church and Bible study, which could evince they've yet to "hear" His voice in the Word of God (John 10:16, 27; Heb 3:7, 15; 4:7).

I believe of all that God "works" in the believer concerning His "pleasure" (Phil 2:13), the desire for finding a church and Bible study would be His first priority that He would put in them, because one cannot be efficient enough in witnessing apart from them! So I would think a true believer would have these desires in them.
Yes thats a tricky one because you can half-heartedly believe something or you can truly believe something. You could profess to believe and confess with your mouth but your heart may not follow. but God want you to love Him with ALL your heart. And all of your mind and all of your strength.

Many people compromise their faith, and lots of people say when they get married they have to learn to compromise. But if you believe and your spouse doesnt somewhere along the way something has got to give.