Speculation
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Greater then Michael? he wanted to be above God. That's what got him thrown out.
What are you driving at?
With the title speculation and your replies I must ask where are you going with this?
If it does not follow scripture then forget it.
Blessings
Speaking of the enemy, Isaiah said:
But you said in your heart, ‘I will ascend to heaven; I will raise my throne above the stars of God, And I will sit on the mount of assembly In the recesses of the north. ‘I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will make myself like the Most High.’
Isaiah 14:13-14
In the 5 "I wills" the enemy declares his intent
But you said in your heart, ‘I will ascend to heaven; I will raise my throne above the stars of God, And I will sit on the mount of assembly In the recesses of the north. ‘I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will make myself like the Most High.’
Isaiah 14:13-14
In the 5 "I wills" the enemy declares his intent
Where does it say he was already fallen when he tempted Eve? I disagree only because why would what God gave to Adam go to the devil if he too had sinned. Therefore, I believe his fall was because of his ability to get the power of the universe from Adam, and because of that elevated his pride, causing his fall. Lucifer was Michael's boss and why he told him may the Lord rebuke you, Jude 1:9, knowing that all authority is given by God.
Not sure I understand your question. There are kingdoms of this world and there is the Kingdom of God. Can you give the passage of where you are referring?
When satan was tempting Jesus in the wilderness he showed him he all the kingdoms of this world and said he would give them to Jesus if Jesus fell down and worshiped him. Of course Jesus said he wouldnt as he only worshiped the Lord. See Matthew 4:8-10
Satan, the devil (or lucifer) is said to be the prince of the power of the air, the god of this world. See 2 corinthians 4:4 and ephesians 2:2
However the Lord is in charge of Heaven also known as the Kingdom of God.
When satan was tempting Jesus in the wilderness he showed him he all the kingdoms of this world and said he would give them to Jesus if Jesus fell down and worshiped him. Of course Jesus said he wouldnt as he only worshiped the Lord. See Matthew 4:8-10
Satan, the devil (or lucifer) is said to be the prince of the power of the air, the god of this world. See 2 corinthians 4:4 and ephesians 2:2
However the Lord is in charge of Heaven also known as the Kingdom of God.
Lucifer would not have been working against God's plan if he was not in a fallen condition.
And we are certainly in disagreement when you suggest Lucifer was Michael's boss...
My understanding is that there is only one boss and owner of everything everyone else are stewards, and it says 'Michael's' kingdom.
I guess what I was saying 'what/where were the condition in which Lucifer fell.
Was it the time and space that we are familiar with or did it I initiate within the realm of eternity?
Understanding that in the finite realm we are constantly in a condition striving to become... which Satan is locked in because he no longer has eternal life.
Getting a little long winded but it may be pointing in the direction of the question.
first time I heard or imply the highlighted in red:
1. a kingdom referred to?
2. wanted to be greater than Michael?
kindly provide related bible verse...
I found that interesting, am trying to reconcile it with the Revelation verse REV 12:3-9
Will gather more information before making a conclusion : )
REV 12:3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
REV 12:4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
REV 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.
REV 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.
REV 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
REV 12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
REV 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
that verse is very clear, as to motive or intent.
meaning:
as far as my post no. 12 is concerned, unless related bible verse is quoted:
the intent is NOT to be "wanted to be greater than Michael" but rather "I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will make myself like the Most High"
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Hi 2404.
One very brief and simple example....
Satan was cast to earth due to his attempts of influencing perfect angels into following his path of, well, evilness, as you will know.
I could offer you Chapter and Verse but, I feel it would be beneficial for you to search the Bible for the answer
ie "Prove all things" to yourself......(and the advice to) hold fast that which is good.
Shalom.
weewillie.
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Your joking right?
Spirits can not be killed.
he will dwell in hell and the lake of fire for eternity.
Didnt Jesus say, he saw Satan fall to earth like lightening. I will look up in the Bible as not clear on when exactly that happened but see eternity before time was created is a different realm from the space time we inhabit on earth. We measure time by days, months and years, because earth and moon revolves around the sun, but for God, who created the sun, moon and planets, He has eternity in His hands and is outside of time.
Jesus was with God from the beginning, but was manifested for a specific period on earth for just thirty three years.
Jesus was with God from the beginning, but was manifested for a specific period on earth for just thirty three years.
Some scholars believe lucifer fell before man was created.
Some believe lucifer fell after man was created out of jealousy of man and all the attention God gave man.
God gave man Dominion and Authority over the earth and the things in it. Lucifer did not have that.
Man was clothed in God's Righteousness and looked just like God standing there. Again lucifer did not have this.
Sooo, he wanted it all and decided to take man's authority (The Blessing) and rise even higher then God.
So before you all dismiss what Brother Abdicate wrote, you might seriously study this out.
Blessings
FCJ
Some believe lucifer fell after man was created out of jealousy of man and all the attention God gave man.
God gave man Dominion and Authority over the earth and the things in it. Lucifer did not have that.
Man was clothed in God's Righteousness and looked just like God standing there. Again lucifer did not have this.
Sooo, he wanted it all and decided to take man's authority (The Blessing) and rise even higher then God.
So before you all dismiss what Brother Abdicate wrote, you might seriously study this out.
Blessings
FCJ
Think about what you said here. It's quite comical.
It was the FACT lucifer went against God that caused him to fall. Is not working against God's plan not going against God?
Wow we really need to think about things here.
Blessings
Wasnt the serpents punishment that he would crawl on his belly...? I imagine before he got cursed by God he might have had legs or wings or something.
Are you trying to ask when did the fall happen? The fall of mankind or the fall of the angels? Or the fall of angels that became demons? or both? We know there was a war in heaven. And that manifested itself on earth.
Are you trying to ask when did the fall happen? The fall of mankind or the fall of the angels? Or the fall of angels that became demons? or both? We know there was a war in heaven. And that manifested itself on earth.
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