Why are there so many churches?

[Major]

Hello Pastor;

Here is a thought I wanted to share with you. Do we have too many churches in one community for the wrong reasons? Instead of 50 small churches, wouldn't it be wise to consolidate some of these churches and merge for (a lack of better word) practical reasons?

What are your thoughts? I always enjoy reading your posts.

God bless you, Major, and your family.

Yes it would be...IMO.

My experience over the years of why there are so many churches is that a "click" or group of people in a church do not like something that is being done or not done. So instead of following the leadership of the church, they take there anger and go down the road and form their own church. Then after a few years, the same process plays out again and again.

So instead of the !st Baptist church in a small town, you have the 2nd and 3rd and so on. That is not always the reason but it is a large reason and uselly you can tell because the new church will not be too far from the one it split off from.

 

[rtm3039]

Yes it would be...IMO.

My experience over the years of why there are so many churches is that a "click" or group of people in a church do not like something that is being done or not done. So instead of following the leadership of the church, they take there anger and go down the road and form their own church. Then after a few years, the same process plays out again and again.

So instead of the !st Baptist church in a small town, you have the 2nd and 3rd and so on. That is not always the reason but it is a large reason and uselly you can tell because the new church will not be too far from the one it split off from.

Ok, here is what I found, in the form of data, for my county (Miami-Dade, FL)

Leading Christian Denominations in Miami-Dade County Florida

Evangelical Denominations	158,052​
Catholic Church	542,984​
Assemblies of God	12,637​
Christian Church (Disciples of Christ)	682​
Christian Churches and Churches of Christ	576​
Christian Reformed Church	699​
Church of the Nazarene	6,134​
Episcopal Church	13,065​
Evangelical Lutheran Church	7,121​
International Church of the Foursquare Gospel	823​
Presbyterian Church	4,870​
Seventh-Day Adventist Church	17,564​
United Church of Christ	5,410​
United Methodist Church	16,963​

Non-Denominational Christians in Miami-Dade County Florida

Independent, Charismatic Churches	3,428​
Independent, Non-Charismatic Churches	3,000​

Note: The data was downloaded from the Association of Religion Data Archives, and were collected by Association of Statisticians of American Religious Bodies.


About Miami-Dade County Florida - Background Information

Total population	2,402,208
Population per square mile	1157.9 people
Births	32,066
Median income	$34,682
Average travel time to work	30.1 minutes
Number of companies	297,458
Size of Miami-Dade County Florida	1946.06 square miles

 

[Major]

Yes it would be...IMO.

My experience over the years of why there are so many churches is that a "click" or group of people in a church do not like something that is being done or not done. So instead of following the leadership of the church, they take there anger and go down the road and form their own church. Then after a few years, the same process plays out again and again.

So instead of the !st Baptist church in a small town, you have the 2nd and 3rd and so on. That is not always the reason but it is a large reason and uselly you can tell because the new church will not be too far from the one it split off from.

The more I thought about this I felt like I needed to expound it a Little.

Sometimes people need to move and start a new church. If the old one is NOT teaching the Bible and its doctrines and the church is either unable or unwilling to ask the pastor to leave, then yes, I would say that starting a new church where the Bible is taught and Jesus is Lord would be a good move.

Liberalism is the cancer of the New Testament church and when it becomes entrenched in the leadership of the church it will bring a lot of heart ache and problems in the church. Sometimes it is better to start fresh than it is to cause a war.

Another thought is that way too many churches have given way to men and women who are simply not knowlegable in the Scriptures to be their pastor.

They are excited, wonderful people, and hard workers for the Lord but did not take the next step and increase their Bible knowledge by attending a seminary or higher education. That uselly leads to problems down the road as the enthusiasm wear off and the lack of Bible "Doctrine" shows up.

I do not mean to offend anyone who is in that position today reading this as I am just giving my observations.

 

[Major]

Ok, here is what I found, in the form of data, for my county (Miami-Dade, FL)

Leading Christian Denominations in Miami-Dade County Florida

Evangelical Denominations	158,052​
Catholic Church	542,984​
Assemblies of God	12,637​
Christian Church (Disciples of Christ)	682​
Christian Churches and Churches of Christ	576​
Christian Reformed Church	699​
Church of the Nazarene	6,134​
Episcopal Church	13,065​
Evangelical Lutheran Church	7,121​
International Church of the Foursquare Gospel	823​
Presbyterian Church	4,870​
Seventh-Day Adventist Church	17,564​
United Church of Christ	5,410​
United Methodist Church	16,963​

Non-Denominational Christians in Miami-Dade County Florida

Independent, Charismatic Churches	3,428​
Independent, Non-Charismatic Churches	3,000​

Note: The data was downloaded from the Association of Religion Data Archives, and were collected by Association of Statisticians of American Religious Bodies.


About Miami-Dade County Florida - Background Information

Total population	2,402,208
Population per square mile	1157.9 people
Births	32,066
Median income	$34,682
Average travel time to work	30.1 minutes
Number of companies	297,458
Size of Miami-Dade County Florida	1946.06 square miles

Those are numbers. Now if you go a little deeper I think you will find that there are many unclassified churches who do not fall into one of those denominations.

Under the heading of "Baptist" for example are many churches who use the name "Baptist" but are not affliated with the Southern Baptist denomination.
And there are just as many Pentecostal churches that are not affliliated with the Assembly of God denominatiuon.

 

[Major]

Saul Mine, can you elaborate on your closing comment? "Only the anti-christ wants everybody in one big church. "

rtm3039

There is nothing wrong with a large church. I have been in one and I have been in very small ones.

A large church has the opportunity to minister to a large area of people in the city it is in. IF.....IF the finances are handeled correctly, then the church can feed the needy and put shoes on the poor, and make sure children have their teeth fixed and glasses to wear.

A small church just does not have the finances to do all of that. After they pay the salary of the pastor, electric and water bills there is uselly not enough to do anything else with. However, they can do other things like set up a food bank and give out food to those who are hungry.

Everyone has canned goods stuck in the closet and an donate to such a cause and cost the church nothing but the space to house it.

 

[Major]

Saul Mine, can you elaborate on your closing comment? "Only the anti-christ wants everybody in one big church. "

rtm3039

That is a good question!

 

[rtm3039]

There is nothing wrong with a large church. I have been in one and I have been in very small ones.

A large church has the opportunity to minister to a large area of people in the city it is in. IF.....IF the finances are handeled correctly, then the church can feed the needy and put shoes on the poor, and make sure children have their teeth fixed and glasses to wear.

A small church just does not have the finances to do all of that. After they pay the salary of the pastor, electric and water bills there is uselly not enough to do anything else with. However, they can do other things like set up a food bank and give out food to those who are hungry.

Everyone has canned goods stuck in the closet and an donate to such a cause and cost the church nothing but the space to house it.

This is true. Below are the financial statement for my church, period ending Dec 21, 2017. (2018 not yet available). In 2017, they did cell some land, for close to $26 million. Also, a few weeks ago, they did donate $10,000 to a local children's hospital.

Now, granted, this is a really large church, not so much for the number of worshipers (10,000), but for the number of campuses (7). They have over 200 employees and the main campus (Palmetto Bay) is several city blocks long.

Revenue
Cash Donations	$11,434,680
Noncash Donations	$0
Other Revenue	$12,329,304
Total Revenue	$23,763,984
Expenses
Total Expenses	$15,275,795
Excess (or Deficit)	$8,488,189
for the Year
Other	$0
Total Change	$8,488,189
in Net Assets
Total Assets	$42,696,496
Total Liabilities	$470,975
Net Assets	$42,225,521

 

[Saul Mine]

Saul Mine, can you elaborate on your closing comment? "Only the anti-christ wants everybody in one big church. "

rtm3039

Luke 4:5 And the devil, taking him up into an high mountain, shewed unto him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time. 6 And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it.

"Delivered unto me," get it? Satan is the god of wordly authority. He wants everybody under his thumb and making constant war on each other.

 

[rtm3039]

Luke 4:5 And the devil, taking him up into an high mountain, shewed unto him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time. 6 And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it.

"Delivered unto me," get it? Satan is the god of wordly authority. He wants everybody under his thumb and making constant war on each other.

Ah….ok. It takes a little muscle to connect these two dots, but I get it.

Rtm3039

 

[Major]

Ah….ok. It takes a little muscle to connect these two dots, but I get it.

Rtm3039

Please do nnot misunderstand my position. I am not putting down super big churches. They are wonderful and most do a great work.

If you like being a small fish in a big pond...….they are for you.

However, if you like being big fish in a small pond, then smaller is the way to go.

The important thing is to know that the church you choose is a Bible believing and teaching church.

 

[rtm3039]

Please do nnot misunderstand my position. I am not putting down super big churches. They are wonderful and most do a great work.

If you like being a small fish in a big pond...….they are for you.

However, if you like being big fish in a small pond, then smaller is the way to go.

The important thing is to know that the church you choose is a Bible believing and teaching church.

I get it. For as large as Christ Fellowship is, it just does not feel that way. I think the reason for this is that there are so many small group activities. On Friday evenings, while there is no service, the area is open and this is when most small groups meet. The place is jumping, until at least 9.

Maybe, my perception is a little different because I am on the church's security team and have access to the entire campus and see the "behind the scene" stuff. The lead pastor is very accessible to everyone and you run into him all over the place. Actually, the same can be said about all the other pastors and directors.

Not sure how to pin this down, While I have the gift of being able to count and know it is big, it really feels like a small close community.

 

[Major]

I get it. For as large as Christ Fellowship is, it just does not feel that way. I think the reason for this is that there are so many small group activities. On Friday evenings, while there is no service, the area is open and this is when most small groups meet. The place is jumping, until at least 9.

Maybe, my perception is a little different because I am on the church's security team and have access to the entire campus and see the "behind the scene" stuff. The lead pastor is very accessible to everyone and you run into him all over the place. Actually, the same can be said about all the other pastors and directors.

Not sure how to pin this down, While I have the gift of being able to count and know it is big, it really feels like a small close community.

That tells me that the pastor of your church has done an excellent job of delegating the work load to his assistant's, deacons and so forth.

 

[rtm3039]

That tells me that the pastor of your church has done an excellent job of delegating the work load to his assistant's, deacons and so forth.

Yes. Rick is the lead pastor; however, every campus has its own pastor. There are also pastors responsible mostly with teaching. Some of these are in other states and some to do guest sermons. My favorite is Dr. Ed Stetzer, Chair of Church, Mission, and Evangelism at Wheaton College and Executive Director of the Billy Graham Center at Wheaton College.

 

[Major]

Yes. Rick is the lead pastor; however, every campus has its own pastor. There are also pastors responsible mostly with teaching. Some of these are in other states and some to do guest sermons. My favorite is Dr. Ed Stetzer, Chair of Church, Mission, and Evangelism at Wheaton College and Executive Director of the Billy Graham Center at Wheaton College.

It seems to me that you have found the place the Lord wants you to serve in. May He bless you and prosper you in all that you do!