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Boanerges(Inactive)
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Bassmassa you have hit the nail on the head brother- it is about His goodness being revealed in us !
Are Sins Equal?
- Thread starter matark
- Start date
templaris, contrary to what you are saying, the Bible does not contradict itself, one cannot just pick and choose arbitrarily between contradictory statements as to which one you decide you want to obey....
a contradiction is a very very specific thing.... one of the things that troubles me most is to hear people say that the Bible contradicts itself.... they often say such things rather carelessly, without much thought as to where exactly or how exactly the Bible is supposed to be contradicting itself. Most often it is a cop out to dismiss the Scriptures. And most often a person saying such a thing can be silenced by simply asking them to show where exactly it is that the Scripture contradicts itself.
Contradictions are precise in nature; the law of non-contradiction says that a thing cannot be both A and non-A ____ at the same time and in the same relationship ___ thats the key area most often overlooked... a contradiction has to say that something is, and that this very exact same thing is not....
suppose, as an example, someone said that his wife was pregnant and also that she was not pregnant.... what would we make of such a statement? Such a person saying this can be said to be very confused, they are definitely contradicting themselves, because a woman cannot both be pregnant and not pregnant at the same time and in the same relationship. She is either pregnant or she is not, she may be 4 months pregnant or 8 months pregnant, but to say she is both pregnant and not pregnant is a contradiction.
So, in regard to this subject, e.g. degrees of sin, all sin is equal in the sense that it all separates us from God. However, neither the subjective or objective consequences of sin is equal. It certainly is not the same thing for me to lie to someone as it is for me to kill someone. Both sins equally separate me from God, but the civil or temporal penalty for these sins is not the same.
Lastly, I would encourage you to do a little more research before saying that the Scripture contradicts itself, or that you know what the Bible says on a given subject. It simply will not do for you to tell someone what the Bible says, i.e. that it contradicts itself, and then to have us find out that you are actually basing this on what you think you youth pastor told you one time!!! You must NOT confuse "what my youth pastor told me" with "the Bible says X,Y or Z". These are far from being the same thing. You are going to be held responsible for every word you say, and the Bible says that those who teach will be held to a higher standard of accountability yet. When you claim to be telling others what the Bible says, you had better be very sure of what you are saying.
James 3:1 NIV James 3:1 Not many of you should presume to be teachers, my brothers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly.
blessings,
Ken
a contradiction is a very very specific thing.... one of the things that troubles me most is to hear people say that the Bible contradicts itself.... they often say such things rather carelessly, without much thought as to where exactly or how exactly the Bible is supposed to be contradicting itself. Most often it is a cop out to dismiss the Scriptures. And most often a person saying such a thing can be silenced by simply asking them to show where exactly it is that the Scripture contradicts itself.
Contradictions are precise in nature; the law of non-contradiction says that a thing cannot be both A and non-A ____ at the same time and in the same relationship ___ thats the key area most often overlooked... a contradiction has to say that something is, and that this very exact same thing is not....
suppose, as an example, someone said that his wife was pregnant and also that she was not pregnant.... what would we make of such a statement? Such a person saying this can be said to be very confused, they are definitely contradicting themselves, because a woman cannot both be pregnant and not pregnant at the same time and in the same relationship. She is either pregnant or she is not, she may be 4 months pregnant or 8 months pregnant, but to say she is both pregnant and not pregnant is a contradiction.
So, in regard to this subject, e.g. degrees of sin, all sin is equal in the sense that it all separates us from God. However, neither the subjective or objective consequences of sin is equal. It certainly is not the same thing for me to lie to someone as it is for me to kill someone. Both sins equally separate me from God, but the civil or temporal penalty for these sins is not the same.
Lastly, I would encourage you to do a little more research before saying that the Scripture contradicts itself, or that you know what the Bible says on a given subject. It simply will not do for you to tell someone what the Bible says, i.e. that it contradicts itself, and then to have us find out that you are actually basing this on what you think you youth pastor told you one time!!! You must NOT confuse "what my youth pastor told me" with "the Bible says X,Y or Z". These are far from being the same thing. You are going to be held responsible for every word you say, and the Bible says that those who teach will be held to a higher standard of accountability yet. When you claim to be telling others what the Bible says, you had better be very sure of what you are saying.
James 3:1 NIV James 3:1 Not many of you should presume to be teachers, my brothers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly.
blessings,
Ken
Those two chapters are very interesting!
The bonus part is, there are a lot of ready-to-be-read books in that website's library.
They're all here: http://worldinvisible.com/library/bookcat.htm
The bonus part is, there are a lot of ready-to-be-read books in that website's library.
They're all here: http://worldinvisible.com/library/bookcat.htm
B
Boanerges(Inactive)
Guest
Yes TLC I am finding alot of good reading there too!
I think the big danger in deciding if there are big sins and little sins is we do it with human minds and not God's. Yes I can say that getting drunk is not as bad as stealing, that adultery isn't as bad as murder, but God says all are sins and God can not tolerate sin. Now is it right for us to have degrees as human? Sure. We can say under man's laws that stealing $5 of gas doesn't deserve the same punishment as murder, but God will not accept either, they are both sin. The great thing is God made a way for us to be forgiven of them all, whether we are drunks, theives, murderers or all of the above. If we accept the Lord as our Savior we are presented before God as perfect and sinless, not because we are but because he paid for them all and took our sins.
thanks for the link Boanerges!!! some good stuff there.... IMHO, the only book that seemed out of place is Wesley's "A Plain Account of Christian Perfection".... one of the deepest flaws iin Wesleyan theology is the idea of a second blessing where a Christian can be, this side of heaven, perfect. One would be far better off reading John Bunyan's book "Grace Abounding to the Chief of Sinners"... in fact anything and everything that Bunyan wrote is awesome!! Project Gutenberg has many excellent online Christian books http://www.gutenberg.org/catalog/, Bunyans complete works (9 volumes I think!!!!( are avaialable there for free there at http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/6049
also, if anyone doesn't know about CCEL (Christian Classics Ethereal Library) it has hundreds of complete online books as well.... http://www.ccel.org/
also check out monergism's selection of full online books at http://www.monergism.com/
also John Piper has graciously allowed some of his books that are currently selling in books stores around the country and indeed around the world for free at http://www.desiringgod.org/ResourceLibrary/OnlineBooks/ByTitle/
some books are there in thier entirity..... others just have a few chapters....
godrules is another awesome site just packed with stuff that should you buy in print what they have available...you would very quickly be into thousands of dollars.... they have John Owens Works, John Calvin, Martin Luther, AW Pink, John Gill, a bunch from Spurgeon.... just tons of great stuff... and some not so great like Adam Clarke, Ellen White and John Wesley for instance
but hey... thats just my theological bias speaking no offence to anyone who's theology is in line with a Charles Finney, Clarke or Wesley... http://www.godrules.net/authors-index.htmlthe best place for Spurgeon on the web, as well as there being lots of other good stuff, is Phil Johnson's site "The Hall of Church History or "Theology From a Bunch of Dead Guys" lol!!!
http://www.spurgeon.org/ and http://www.spurgeon.org/~phil/hall.htm
blessings,
Ken
It is my opinion that if you lie once in your life and live a perfect life afterwards, and do not believe in Jesus' death and ressurrection, God will punish you. If you murder, change your ways and become a great person, but still not believe in Jesus' death and ressurrection, God will punish you.
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Boanerges(Inactive)
Guest
Correctamoondo fanofnb !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Otetiani
Inactive
Jesus was asked a similar question, His answer
Others answered your question well, but here is another approach coming at it from the opposite direction. Instead of asking is one sin greater than another, ask like the scribes did, “Is one commandment greater than another?
Matthew 22:36 (NASB)36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” 37 And He said to him, “ ‘YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.’ 38 “This is the great and foremost commandment. 39 “The second is like it, ‘YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.’ 40 “On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets.”
Mark 12:28 (NASB) 28 One of the scribes came and heard them arguing, and recognizing that He had answered them well, asked Him, “What commandment is the foremost of all?” 29 Jesus answered, “The foremost is, ‘HEAR, O ISRAEL! THE LORD OUR GOD IS ONE LORD; 30 AND YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND, AND WITH ALL YOUR STRENGTH.’ 31 “The second is this, ‘YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.” 32 The scribe said to Him, “Right, Teacher; You have truly stated that HE IS ONE, AND THERE IS NO ONE ELSE BESIDES HIM; 33 AND TO LOVE HIM WITH ALL THE HEART AND WITH ALL THE UNDERSTANDING AND WITH ALL THE STRENGTH, AND TO LOVE ONE’S NEIGHBOR AS HIMSELF, is much more than all burnt offerings and sacrifices.” 34 When Jesus saw that he had answered intelligently, He said to him, “You are not far from the kingdom of God.” After that, no one would venture to ask Him any more questions.
I observe all laws within the context of these. If my understanding of a law does not jive with these, I do not follow that understanding and continue to search for the truth. Beware of laws that Jesus fulfilled. For instance, I do not slaughter a lamb for my sins. Jesus was the final Lamb sacrifice. I do not want to insult my G-d by ignoring that. Also, I observe Kashroot ( kosher laws ) But because I will not offend my brother who may be weaker in understanding I will eat pork if he serves it. I may want to throw up but I still hold love over the other law and since Paul’s words and dream back this up I also still honors G-d.
Others answered your question well, but here is another approach coming at it from the opposite direction. Instead of asking is one sin greater than another, ask like the scribes did, “Is one commandment greater than another?
Matthew 22:36 (NASB)36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” 37 And He said to him, “ ‘YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.’ 38 “This is the great and foremost commandment. 39 “The second is like it, ‘YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.’ 40 “On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets.”
Mark 12:28 (NASB) 28 One of the scribes came and heard them arguing, and recognizing that He had answered them well, asked Him, “What commandment is the foremost of all?” 29 Jesus answered, “The foremost is, ‘HEAR, O ISRAEL! THE LORD OUR GOD IS ONE LORD; 30 AND YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND, AND WITH ALL YOUR STRENGTH.’ 31 “The second is this, ‘YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.” 32 The scribe said to Him, “Right, Teacher; You have truly stated that HE IS ONE, AND THERE IS NO ONE ELSE BESIDES HIM; 33 AND TO LOVE HIM WITH ALL THE HEART AND WITH ALL THE UNDERSTANDING AND WITH ALL THE STRENGTH, AND TO LOVE ONE’S NEIGHBOR AS HIMSELF, is much more than all burnt offerings and sacrifices.” 34 When Jesus saw that he had answered intelligently, He said to him, “You are not far from the kingdom of God.” After that, no one would venture to ask Him any more questions.
I observe all laws within the context of these. If my understanding of a law does not jive with these, I do not follow that understanding and continue to search for the truth. Beware of laws that Jesus fulfilled. For instance, I do not slaughter a lamb for my sins. Jesus was the final Lamb sacrifice. I do not want to insult my G-d by ignoring that. Also, I observe Kashroot ( kosher laws ) But because I will not offend my brother who may be weaker in understanding I will eat pork if he serves it. I may want to throw up but I still hold love over the other law and since Paul’s words and dream back this up I also still honors G-d.
Otetiani
Inactive
Neighbors, people you run into every day. Also, remember Jesus even included our enemies as part of this commandment. http://bible.cc/matthew/5-43.htm Matthew 5-43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR and hate your enemy.’ 44 “But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven; for He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 “For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? 47 “If you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? 48 “Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.
As for love of other nations would this not spell it out.Mathew 28:19 “Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.â
Wow! What better way to answer a question than using the scriptures isn't it? Thanks Otetiani.
We did a study on this once, and I remember comming to the conclusion that ALL commandments really come down to just those two. While the "ten commandments" deals with specific actions, Love, love for self, love for others, and love for God is always the common bond. Some sin is against ourselves, some against others, and all against God. If our heart is right, and we love others, and we love God, then we simply will not desire to do things that would hurt those we love.