Don't waste your education

Dec 19, 2014
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Was thinking on this topic, would like your thoughts.
How many of us are university educated? It wasnt till recent times that this was within reach of everyone, it used to be that females were never educated as was seen as a waste of time. So its really sad to see that some girls dont value the opportunity.

You can be smart, I just want to encourage anyone thats studying that its totally worthwhile even if its just reading from library books...now youve got open university and Ted talks and its free so there is no excuse.

Its really not that much fun to have a conversation with someone who doesnt want to learn and doesnt value learning. What do you end up talking about..nothing much and nothing new to learn. God has so much wisdom for us to find out if we seek we will find. What I find sad is people who dont bother seeking and prefer to stay in the dark.
 
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Let me give you a brief synopsis of my education history, and then my observations...

After High School in the early 1970”s, I entered the city college in my town.

I was working nights as a janitor and going to school part time. I had no idea what I wanted to do as a profession and decided to join the military and have them train me in something useful.



I have had training in Junior College followed by Military Tech school and after my service, in Universities. Although I have spent a lot of time and done well in a lot of courses throughout the years, I never rolled it up into a degree. I was too much focused on learning what I needed for my Job and not the broad spectrum required for a degree. Besides, I am too lazy. But I was always taking some kind of course, either in local colleges and universities, or correspondence courses, or courses taught by my employer. At times I taught some of those courses employer offered courses.

As you indicated, it is often more stimulating to talk to the well educated, but I find that to dismiss someone who dropped out in their early teens and then developed and had a career in skilled labor is to miss a lot of hard won wisdom and work ethic. Many times they have had to learn on the run what they missed in school. They may not sound as articulate, but they can be very wise. It is worth the effort to talk with them.

As for what is going on today, I have seen too many young people indenture themselves with student loans learning things that will not help them in their lives, either in their work, or in their relations with others. But either a basic associates or bachelor's degree seems to become a prerequisite to very basic unrelated jobs. I have also seen too many with advance degrees that do not understand that even when they are fortunate enough to obtain work in that field does not mean that they 'have it made'. One needs to always upgrade and update their skill set, particularly in any technology related field, and technology is becoming an increasing part of any job. Ask any farmer. Ask anybody in construction.
 
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Ive worked on farms and in trades and you still need to learn on the job, problem is the people meant to train you actually dont want to do it. That was hard for sometone who loves to learn to have someone hold you back. Because they were just too lazy to bother teaching you (while disguising it as busy-work) Then you get relegated to the menial tasks which are dead boring.

If youve gone to university like many people have, you can always teach, and pass on your wisdom to others. My former boss had gone to this agricultural college and I was always asking him for about stuff but he would get annoyed about it for some reason and tried to keep me from learning.
 
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The thing with student loans is you have to be smart about paying them back, but now there are free courses so, no excuse. Everyone can learn something.

When the govt did away with apprenticeships it left such a big gap in skilled trades that homes being built in the 90s were shoddy and leaky. That was complete short sightedness on their part.
 
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Ive talked with some people who dropped out of high school and then did absolutely nothing...i feel like its a waste.
They got into things like drugs or got pregnant and actually stopped learning. Or they felt that learning was only for younger people which is NOT true you can still learn things when you are older.

The value of university is it helps you become disciplined to study. Even if there seems to be no value job wise it helps with independent learning and history. It helps you become an inquirer and not take things for granted. There is always something to learn for everyone. Some people become specialists although for me I want to be an all rounder...I kind of have to be because Im the librarian lol...so the entire dewey decimal system is my oyster. Of course that doesnt mean I read every single book. But I know where to find it. There is immense value in that. And everyone can go to the pulbic library and borrow books for free. If you know how to read, you can learn. You will learn things by reading that you can never get from tv.

The bible says that there were so many books written about Jesus that the world could not contain them. Everyone will have a testimony about the goodness of God and being alive at some point, thats why people write books. They want to share something they have learned, not just to immediate friends and family, but across the world and generations even.
 
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Greetings:

The end purpose of Education......there is no God.Christ hung with UE's;had to knock off an HE from his horse.U.S.A is now post-christian.My LE mother was a saint.My two kids with college degrees are Pagan.

bye
 

rtm3039

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Let me give you a brief synopsis of my education history, and then my observations...

After High School in the early 1970”s, I entered the city college in my town.

I was working nights as a janitor and going to school part time. I had no idea what I wanted to do as a profession and decided to join the military and have them train me in something useful.



I have had training in Junior College followed by Military Tech school and after my service, in Universities. Although I have spent a lot of time and done well in a lot of courses throughout the years, I never rolled it up into a degree. I was too much focused on learning what I needed for my Job and not the broad spectrum required for a degree. Besides, I am too lazy. But I was always taking some kind of course, either in local colleges and universities, or correspondence courses, or courses taught by my employer. At times I taught some of those courses employer offered courses.

As you indicated, it is often more stimulating to talk to the well educated, but I find that to dismiss someone who dropped out in their early teens and then developed and had a career in skilled labor is to miss a lot of hard won wisdom and work ethic. Many times they have had to learn on the run what they missed in school. They may not sound as articulate, but they can be very wise. It is worth the effort to talk with them.

As for what is going on today, I have seen too many young people indenture themselves with student loans learning things that will not help them in their lives, either in their work, or in their relations with others. But either a basic associates or bachelor's degree seems to become a prerequisite to very basic unrelated jobs. I have also seen too many with advance degrees that do not understand that even when they are fortunate enough to obtain work in that field does not mean that they 'have it made'. One needs to always upgrade and update their skill set, particularly in any technology related field, and technology is becoming an increasing part of any job. Ask any farmer. Ask anybody in construction.
Greetings all, there does appear to be a variety of positions here. When I ventured off into my career, there was a requirement of a minimum of a bachelor's degree. Almost all federal special agent positions require a "four year degree." This is not the case with local police departments; however, some are asking for at least an Associate's degree.

Once in the system, there comes a time when you are competing for promotions and positions of leadership. During this competitive phase, careers are pretty equal, as well as work experience. Once again, education is seen as what make you different and, if you do not have a master's degree, you are just not considered competitive.

My educational history is interesting. I dropped out of school in 7th grade. I did so, to get a job and help my parents financially. I ended up getting a GED and enlisting in the Army. I really wanted to be a special agent, so I started attending night college courses and got my bachelor's. After around 10 years or so, it was time to look for promotions, so I earned a masters (MPA) and got promoted. Later on, I returned to school and received a second master's (MMIS) and a third master's (MBA). I went back to school because (1) I like learning and (2) I had the post 911 GI Bill and it was not going to cost me anything.

At the end of the day; however, formal education is NOT what makes you interesting or wise. It is a combination of education, experience, and your own attitude that does that. I mean, let's be honest. I have an MBA in Business Intelligence and Analytics - who wants to have a conversation about that? On the other hand, I have lived in numerous countries, saw the Berlin Wall fall, responded at the Pentagon during 911, and have been in three wars - that we can make an interesting conversation of.

I still continue to learn, but not through formal education. We have the entire world's knowledge at our fingertips. As Lanolin points out, there are free educational opportunities all over the place. You can go to college on line and you can find other interesting sources of knowledge.

As for education and faith, I am not sure what krossquad was trying to say, but I do not believe that education and faith have to clash. Yes, you will come across courses that speak of evolution. You will come across professors that do not believe. You will come across students that will not believe (at one point in my life, I was one of them myself). At the end of the day; however, it is YOU that makes the final call on your faith. Here is an example: Right now, my bible group is dealing with the book of Jonah. As part of my own studies, I have read many articles on this "great fish." I learned that the largest fish we have is the Whale Shark. It has a mouth that is approximately 5 feet wide (able to swallow a man); however, a throat that is around 4 inches wide (not able to swallow a man). This kind of explains why they only eat small shrimp. This knowledge did nothing to support Jonah being swallowed by a fish; however, I was not looking for a biblical answer from National Geographic. Jonah was wallowed by a great fish because the Bible tells me so - period. The other stuff is just knowledge of other things.

You all have a blessed day and I am off to make the doughnuts.

rtm3039
 

AtomicSnowflake

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How many of us are university educated?
When the govt did away with apprenticeships it left such a big gap in skilled trades that homes being built in the 90s were shoddy and leaky. That was complete short sightedness on their part.
I am not university educated, but in the U.S., there are still trade unions with apprenticeship programs. I am a union electrician, (IBEW). The apprenticeship term was for 5 years. I can now work anywhere I choose!

For the past 9 years I have worked only at nuclear power plants. It's been great. The pay is the same for me, as it is for any of the guys. The work is fun and challenging.

Now our government is trying to stick it's fingers into apprenticeship programs of it's own... which will probably only have negative results. You know how it goes... if something is good, and works well, the gov. can't stand it, and has to mess things up!

Anyway... just saying- apprenticeship programs are still a great option where they are available. No loans to repay... full benefits, insurance, retirement, etc.
 
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Ive worked on farms and in trades and you still need to learn on the job, problem is the people meant to train you actually dont want to do it. That was hard for sometone who loves to learn to have someone hold you back. Because they were just too lazy to bother teaching you (while disguising it as busy-work) Then you get relegated to the menial tasks which are dead boring.

If youve gone to university like many people have, you can always teach, and pass on your wisdom to others. My former boss had gone to this agricultural college and I was always asking him for about stuff but he would get annoyed about it for some reason and tried to keep me from learning.
A good skilled worker who is also a good teacher is a rare blessing.

I have always made it a point to learn as much as I could any way I could about the subject area. I also conducted lunch time brown bag training to help those who were new to the environment.

I was a software developer. I learned early on that knowing how to program is not all that was required. When I was supporting Army logistice, I obtained Army logistics training material. When I was developing medical diagnostic artificial intelligence software, I got all I could on the tests that the software used to determine hidden causes, etc. When I worked on a weather program for the FAA I learned all I could about weather maps and forecasting.

A worker needs to keep their eyes open and observe how various tasks are done and especially how problems are dealt with. Spending additional time learning in the off-times is also the responsibility of a dedicated worker.

If the skilled worker should also look toward the development of the new and less experienced, but most employers do not make schedule allowances for informal training.
 
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Yea sadly employers are too busy, just expect you to know everything already and dont want to bother to train you.
When I studied for my library degree it was at the same time I was working, in tertiary libraries they didnt pay you to get this training, but the public library reimbursed me for my studies. So it was a no brainer that I switched.

I found that with apprenticships they paid you the lowest rate and it was up to the supervisor to mark you but if the supervisor was too busy you would be languishing on your job waiting for them to teach you something so you could complete the module, as it needed to be signed off by them. Plus you never got time, on the job to incorporate your training. A good teacher will actually incorporate this in to your work schedule, or at least understand it actually takes time to learn.

Some people seem to have this attitude that book learning is useless, but I always made sure that we had plenty of books around in the staff rooms. I mean what else are you going to do on your lunch break, sit around and gossip?
 
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I also came across this attiude that seems rather self sabotaging that people resent anyone thats university educated. Well,hello I am human just like you, i am not superior please dont resent me for wanting to learn or being academic and wanting to do something with my brain.
 
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Formal education is a tool, and yes ive got letters after my name but I hardly ever bandy them about. Nobody really wants to know that I have a masters or diploma in this or that in general conversation, but I think there is immense value in knowledge because even the Bible says without knowledge we will perish.

Many of the great disasters and tragedies came about because people were ignorant! Titanic! Dont sail a huge ship into iceberg strewn area! Have enough lifeboats for everyone (use your maths skills) Pike river mine..dont build a mine where its unsafe, and have at least two exits!

Babies..they dont just come about after a night of drunkeness between the opposite sex.
 
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I think its good the military give free tertiary education to anyone that enlists, the greatest barrier to higher education is the costs involved and after youve served your time you actully do need to keep your brain engaged in something.

Now theres free courses and for many schools you can apply for scholarships so dont let that stop you from obtaining an education. When I was teaching we held free classes for anyone wanting to learn english. And also dont forget that sunday school is free - all bible teaching is free it costs you nothing.

God actually had me go back to primary school to learn about Him lol. I didnt really get it the first time. Also I remember christians being active at universities, some formed groups like student Life and theres many in pastoral care there. So I wouldnt say all universities are hot beds of secularism. They just take a more academic approach to the Bible, and yes not all professors believe, but then thats like in all schools you will find believers as well as unbelievers. Thank God we have minsitries that go into schools, as well a prisons. (Some schools can actually be like prisons! )

The thing with university is, generally, nobody is forcing you to go. You are by then an adult and can make your own decisions, and its not compulsory for you to be there like it is in school if you under 12.
 
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Greetings all, there does appear to be a variety of positions here. When I ventured off into my career, there was a requirement of a minimum of a bachelor's degree. Almost all federal special agent positions require a "four year degree." This is not the case with local police departments; however, some are asking for at least an Associate's degree.

Once in the system, there comes a time when you are competing for promotions and positions of leadership. During this competitive phase, careers are pretty equal, as well as work experience. Once again, education is seen as what make you different and, if you do not have a master's degree, you are just not considered competitive.

My educational history is interesting. I dropped out of school in 7th grade. I did so, to get a job and help my parents financially. I ended up getting a GED and enlisting in the Army. I really wanted to be a special agent, so I started attending night college courses and got my bachelor's. After around 10 years or so, it was time to look for promotions, so I earned a masters (MPA) and got promoted. Later on, I returned to school and received a second master's (MMIS) and a third master's (MBA). I went back to school because (1) I like learning and (2) I had the post 911 GI Bill and it was not going to cost me anything.

At the end of the day; however, formal education is NOT what makes you interesting or wise. It is a combination of education, experience, and your own attitude that does that. I mean, let's be honest. I have an MBA in Business Intelligence and Analytics - who wants to have a conversation about that? On the other hand, I have lived in numerous countries, saw the Berlin Wall fall, responded at the Pentagon during 911, and have been in three wars - that we can make an interesting conversation of.

I still continue to learn, but not through formal education. We have the entire world's knowledge at our fingertips. As Lanolin points out, there are free educational opportunities all over the place. You can go to college on line and you can find other interesting sources of knowledge.

As for education and faith, I am not sure what krossquad was trying to say, but I do not believe that education and faith have to clash. Yes, you will come across courses that speak of evolution. You will come across professors that do not believe. You will come across students that will not believe (at one point in my life, I was one of them myself). At the end of the day; however, it is YOU that makes the final call on your faith. Here is an example: Right now, my bible group is dealing with the book of Jonah. As part of my own studies, I have read many articles on this "great fish." I learned that the largest fish we have is the Whale Shark. It has a mouth that is approximately 5 feet wide (able to swallow a man); however, a throat that is around 4 inches wide (not able to swallow a man). This kind of explains why they only eat small shrimp. This knowledge did nothing to support Jonah being swallowed by a fish; however, I was not looking for a biblical answer from National Geographic. Jonah was wallowed by a great fish because the Bible tells me so - period. The other stuff is just knowledge of other things.

You all have a blessed day and I am off to make the doughnuts.

rtm3039
I am reluctant to post what my education is. I just do not feel as though it would be helpful to anyone and experience has taught me that in some cases it can be used against you by those who are jealous or just do not like you for one reason or another.

I can say that I have learned a lot of stuff in my life, but the best thing I have learned is that I am a sinner and God still loves me anyway. So much so that He gave up His Son to pay for my sins so I could be with Him in heaven.

Every thing else is just snow on the mountain top.
 

rtm3039

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I am reluctant to post what my education is. I just do not feel as though it would be helpful to anyone and experience has taught me that in some cases it can be used against you by those who are jealous or just do not like you for one reason or another.

I can say that I have learned a lot of stuff in my life, but the best thing I have learned is that I am a sinner and God still loves me anyway. So much so that He gave up His Son to pay for my sins so I could be with Him in heaven.

Every thing else is just snow on the mountain top.
That's how I felt, when I was putting together my resume for the job hunt. I ended up only listing the minimal education. The good news is that, when I applied to work for the school board, they had no issues with how much time I have spent in a classroom. In reality, none of that makes much of a difference. Granted, we all should have enough of an education to communicate effectively and be able to employ some level of critical thinking, but the rest is just academic fluff. What really makes a person is not actually found in a classroom.
 
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I only list the education that is relevent for the job im applying for.
I have been to so many schools and studied so many different courses its not funny. I dont get why people look down on others for studying. Its silly.

It is not WHICH school you want to, but WHAT you actually learned. Nobody should care if you went to xx university or xx high school. But what topics you studied.
 
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I had a friend who worked in Oxford (as an admin) and she did say that it was rather snobbish as of course they somehow believe only the intellectual elite who get in. Like ivy league schools. But some of those schools are just beome like brands it doesnt say anything about the quality of education received its really up to you the learner what you got out of it.

Because you can get a humanities education anywhere else in the world not just at those exclusive schools. The thing is it takes discipline to keep learning. Sometimes yes you might have to drop out for whatever reason. But that shouldnt ever stop you from learning at a later date
 

rtm3039

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I had a friend who worked in Oxford (as an admin) and she did say that it was rather snobbish as of course they somehow believe only the intellectual elite who get in. Like ivy league schools. But some of those schools are just beome like brands it doesnt say anything about the quality of education received its really up to you the learner what you got out of it.

Because you can get a humanities education anywhere else in the world not just at those exclusive schools. The thing is it takes discipline to keep learning. Sometimes yes you might have to drop out for whatever reason. But that shouldnt ever stop you from learning at a later date
Did you know that, originally, it was not known as Ivy League, but as IV League. This is because there were originally only 4 schools (Harvard, Yale, Princeton and Dartmouth).
 
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I knew someone who said she went to Cornell, is that an ivy league school? But she said after she finished she eloped came to nz got pregnant and ended up working in an ice cream stand. And then divorced. But then she started again working at the library, she was really well read though. When I started doing my horticulture course she copied me and enrolled in open polytech.

I dont know if shes now working in horticulture as lost touch but I just remember she was quite interesting to talk to but regretted her impulsive marriage somewhat. She had two girls and was bringing them up solo. (Although the dad lived five minutes away) I dont know what the full story was really just what she told me but remember it being quite complicated.

So its not as if highly educated people dont do stupid things either. I thought she could have been a great english teacher as she majored in English like me (although I didnt really become a standard high school english teacher) as she had a gift for it but I think she was too flighty to settle into the school system.

I have people come up to me and say they want to be a librarian like me. Some just want to work in a library but others want to be a librarian ie run a library. I think once you do your MLIS degree just working in a library isnt fufilling because the reason you study is to know how to manage one. I did management papers and that was one of the most useful one I did. However promotions can be hard to come by and it can be super frustrating to be working under someone else and having no decison making ability. I had to wait years before I was given the opprotunity. The people I used to work with always asked me why i was still at assistant level when I could be the boss lol. But the boss of course wasnt willing to relinquish their role. Experince tend to top degrees in some workplaces, but the our profession has not always had an easy pathway and the difference of artitudes in different sectors (and generations) to education is revealing. Older people can be generally dismissive of degrees and qualifications, claiming its only a piece of paper. But you studied so HARD for that bit of paper.

Its like when people say marriage is just a piece of paper. Its not. You put the work in (your marriage, your degree) and you obtain the benefit.
 

rtm3039

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I knew someone who said she went to Cornell, is that an ivy league school? But she said after she finished she eloped came to nz got pregnant and ended up working in an ice cream stand. And then divorced. But then she started again working at the library, she was really well read though. When I started doing my horticulture course she copied me and enrolled in open polytech.

I dont know if shes now working in horticulture as lost touch but I just remember she was quite interesting to talk to but regretted her impulsive marriage somewhat. She had two girls and was bringing them up solo. (Although the dad lived five minutes away) I dont know what the full story was really just what she told me but remember it being quite complicated.

So its not as if highly educated people dont do stupid things either. I thought she could have been a great english teacher as she majored in English like me (although I didnt really become a standard high school english teacher) as she had a gift for it but I think she was too flighty to settle into the school system.

I have people come up to me and say they want to be a librarian like me. Some just want to work in a library but others want to be a librarian ie run a library. I think once you do your MLIS degree just working in a library isnt fufilling because the reason you study is to know how to manage one. I did management papers and that was one of the most useful one I did. However promotions can be hard to come by and it can be super frustrating to be working under someone else and having no decison making ability. I had to wait years before I was given the opprotunity. The people I used to work with always asked me why i was still at assistant level when I could be the boss lol. But the boss of course wasnt willing to relinquish their role. Experince tend to top degrees in some workplaces, but the our profession has not always had an easy pathway and the difference of artitudes in different sectors (and generations) to education is revealing. Older people can be generally dismissive of degrees and qualifications, claiming its only a piece of paper. But you studied so HARD for that bit of paper.

Its like when people say marriage is just a piece of paper. Its not. You put the work in (your marriage, your degree) and you obtain the benefit.
This happens all the time. I know a "bouncer" that has a degree in journalism. My pastor has a law degree, but, after passing the Florida bar, got the calling, returned to school for a master's in Divinity, and is now the lead pastor at our church. Like I said before, I have three masters and am employed in a position that only requires a bachelor's degree.

Go figure.