Healing

Where is the Messiah said:
I just thought of something..

Let's say there is a family. There is a mother who is in a coma. She has two sons. One of the sons has great faith, and believes God will heal his mother. The other son listens to the doctor, and doubts his mother will be healed. Will the son with doubt affect the other son's faith, and hinder the mother being healed through faith?
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I believe so. Lets put it this way. Lets say both brothers have faith but one prays like this "Lord if it is Your will please heal my mother."
Other brother "Lord your word tells us your son died for my sins and healing. Through you we are already healed. In the name of Jesus Christ my mother is already healed."

See the difference? Gods will is already there. He wants us healed. First prayer already has doubt. Second prayer has authority
 
Trodaí Urnaí said:
I believe so. Lets put it this way. Lets say both brothers have faith but one prays like this "Lord if it is Your will please heal my mother."
Other brother "Lord your word tells us your son died for my sins and healing. Through you we are already healed. In the name of Jesus Christ my mother is already healed."

See the difference? Gods will is already there. He wants us healed. First prayer already has doubt. Second prayer has authority
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No. God would work the opposite to your reasoning and answer the doubting prayer first. Wouldn't you do that with your kid?

The authority we need is being sons of God John 9:31. Not how we word our prayer. Or a mental positive state.

This kind of teaching makes me want to stab a pencil through my eye.
 
Where is the Messiah said:
Not that I disagree with you, but your post had me thinking. Mainly the verse you mention where it says "Heal the sick, raise the dead." My question would be who actually needs to have the faith, the one healing, or the one being healed? Does it have to be one or the other? Could it be both? If not, then are we saying the dead that was raised, had faith? Or did the one raising the dead have faith? Great thought provoking post!
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What about faith in raising the dead? How much faith did the dead person have to have I wonder?
 
Romans 12:3 (KJV)
For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think [of himself] more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Lack of faith isn't the issue, trusting that God's word is true is where we falter. Our experiences nullify the word of God so the power of the word of God is not manifested. This is why it's so important to not lean on our own understanding or trivialize or spiritualize everything.

Proverbs 3:5-6 (KJV)
Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.
 
Major said:
John.....I would point out that the Apostles had the same abilities as did Jesus. Jesus commissioned them in Marl 16:17-18
"And these signs will accompany those who believe: in my name they will cast out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18 they will pick up serpents with their hands; and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not hurt them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will recover.”

Many miracles were performed by the apostles (2:43). Peter healed the lame man at the Temple (3:7-11). God answered Peter in a miraculous earthquake (4:31). Ananias and Sapphira were slain by the Lord (5:5-10). Signs and wonders continued to be done by the apostles (5:12). Peter healed many from various cities (5:12-16). The prison doors were opened by an angel (5:19). Stephen wrought great wonders and signs (6:8). In Samaria, Philip did great miracles and signs (8:6,7,13).
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The big thing that I realized..... Jesus AUTHORIZED and Commanded the disciples to do specific actions... The Disciples were being Obedient when they were healing.... They were doing specifically what they were commanded by Jesus to do....

Our job is to be Obedient... Wherever that leads... Whatever God leads us to do.... Paul gives us examples of what we may be called to do in Ephesians 4.... and it's our job to be Obedient....

So... God calls you to be Obedient -
If He calls you to declare his Healing upon someone... Go do it! They will be Healed!
If God does NOT call you to declare his healing upon someone... Don't.... They won't.

My opinion is that this is where we run into trouble... We substitute "Wishing and Hoping" for "Be Obedient and Seek God's Face" - and we wonder why stuff doesn't happen.....

The deal with Ananias and Sapphira is something different but related in my opinion..... Notice how Peter never does this again...
In my own opinion - God is showing Peter that he has "Official Standing" before God's Throne to Intercede or Not....
Ref back to Matt 18:18 and John 14:13 - this relates to "Official Standing" when God sends you out into a ministry.....
Compare to 2 kings 2:23-24 (Elisha and the bears) and Amos 7: 1-6

When God sends YOU.... He gives YOU the authority that you will need to perform your ministry..... and that includes the Authority to come before the Throne of God to intercede for people in your ministry....

In the incident with Elisha - A couple young kids were bothering him - so he curses at them.... Bears come along and kill them! What's this all about? Well... Elisha is NOW officially THE Prophet of the Lord.... He NOW has standing before the Lord... Notice how Elisha never again curses "Innocents".... He is NOW speaking for the Lord God of Israel - and he needs to watch himself..... God had to teach him a lesson....

Amos 7:1-6.. God issues a bunch of curses and Amos prays, then God relents... Huh? Same thing... As THE Official Prophet of the Lord to Israel - Amos has STANDING before God.... Amos has the right to Intercede for the people he is entrusted with..... In this case - Amos does Intercede for those people - and God relents.... Notice how in Amos 7:10-17 - Amos does NOT intercede for the priest who is slandering him... and the word of God goes forth upon that man and his family....

When God sends YOU... You now have the the Authority to come before His Throne for Those people.... You now have Standing to seek his face pertaining to these things..... Will you Curse them or will you Intercede for them?
 
KingJ said:
No. God would work the opposite to your reasoning and answer the doubting prayer first. Wouldn't you do that with your kid?

The authority we need is being sons of God John 9:31. Not how we word our prayer. Or a mental positive state.

This kind of teaching makes me want to stab a pencil through my eye.
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Well I don't want you to hurt yourself so how about you believe what you want to believe and I'll believe what the Bible says :) No sense getting all irate about it.
 
JohnC said:
The big thing that I realized..... Jesus AUTHORIZED and Commanded the disciples to do specific actions... The Disciples were being Obedient when they were healing.... They were doing specifically what they were commanded by Jesus to do....

Our job is to be Obedient... Wherever that leads... Whatever God leads us to do.... Paul gives us examples of what we may be called to do in Ephesians 4.... and it's our job to be Obedient....

So... God calls you to be Obedient -
If He calls you to declare his Healing upon someone... Go do it! They will be Healed!
If God does NOT call you to declare his healing upon someone... Don't.... They won't.

My opinion is that this is where we run into trouble... We substitute "Wishing and Hoping" for "Be Obedient and Seek God's Face" - and we wonder why stuff doesn't happen.....

The deal with Ananias and Sapphira is something different but related in my opinion..... Notice how Peter never does this again...
In my own opinion - God is showing Peter that he has "Official Standing" before God's Throne to Intercede or Not....
Ref back to Matt 18:18 and John 14:13 - this relates to "Official Standing" when God sends you out into a ministry.....
Compare to 2 kings 2:23-24 (Elisha and the bears) and Amos 7: 1-6

When God sends YOU.... He gives YOU the authority that you will need to perform your ministry..... and that includes the Authority to come before the Throne of God to intercede for people in your ministry....

In the incident with Elisha - A couple young kids were bothering him - so he curses at them.... Bears come along and kill them! What's this all about? Well... Elisha is NOW officially THE Prophet of the Lord.... He NOW has standing before the Lord... Notice how Elisha never again curses "Innocents".... He is NOW speaking for the Lord God of Israel - and he needs to watch himself..... God had to teach him a lesson....

Amos 7:1-6.. God issues a bunch of curses and Amos prays, then God relents... Huh? Same thing... As THE Official Prophet of the Lord to Israel - Amos has STANDING before God.... Amos has the right to Intercede for the people he is entrusted with..... In this case - Amos does Intercede for those people - and God relents.... Notice how in Amos 7:10-17 - Amos does NOT intercede for the priest who is slandering him... and the word of God goes forth upon that man and his family....

When God sends YOU... You now have the the Authority to come before His Throne for Those people.... You now have Standing to seek his face pertaining to these things..... Will you Curse them or will you Intercede for them?
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I would agree with you and would also add the ability to be HUMBLE. Those two abilities seem to me to be the key.

Now remember, those that Jesus commissioned and sent out were the Apostles. They had their calling as a result of a personal, face to face event with the Lord Jesus. That removes anyone from being an apostle today.
 
Absolutely, humble is a Key attribute.... As is Fear of God.... A healthy Fear of God will help protect us from a lot of Ego/self/flesh-driven decisions and actions...

On the other thing... Apostles... I think there were 2 separate classes of Apostles... First is the Direct Witnesses of Jesus' earthly ministry.... When they cast lots to replace Judas Iscariot - they required someone who had witnessed Jesus entire ministry...... Not just someone who heard and believed....

But... If you look at Ephesians 4... and just look at the definition of the word "apostle".... Someone who is authorized and sent to bring the Message.....

Now... That sounds pretty familiar and more common.... like... say a Missionary or a "Church planter" type person.... Those people are called, prepared, authorized, and sent to take the Gospel message out.... and that's what they do..... They love Jesus - and through their Obedience - they go take the Word of God somewhere new....
 
KingJ said:
But you are not preaching from the bible. Your message sounds like a page from Tony Robbins.

Jesus never dealt with Christians.
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Don't know Tony Robbins. It amazes me how a Christian can be so against healing when Jesus said to go out and heal. Why be mad about it? It is almost like you have some sort of vendetta and you are out to totally negate any healing ministry?
 
Looked up Tony Robbins. This commercial says it all about motivational speakers, even though it is trying to sell insurance:
 
Trodaí Urnaí said:
I believe so. Lets put it this way. Lets say both brothers have faith but one prays like this "Lord if it is Your will please heal my mother."
Other brother "Lord your word tells us your son died for my sins and healing. Through you we are already healed. In the name of Jesus Christ my mother is already healed."

See the difference? Gods will is already there. He wants us healed. First prayer already has doubt. Second prayer has authority
Click to expand...
Let's put this way.. My daughter is going to school and she has to complete assignment.. She is unable to do it herself.. She can ask me this in 2 ways.

"Dad, please do this homework for me. Because I know you can finish this. So just do it"

"Dad, I am not able to do this. I don't know if this is a learning process for me. But I know you can help me in this. If you are willing to help, please help me in getting this completed"

Which would make me happy?

Everyone things praying "If this is Your will" is lack of faith. I don't think so. Faith is substance of things hoped for and not seen. In both the prayers the faith is there. That God is able to bring healing. There is no question on that.

Lack of faith is doubting whether God is able to heal a person.
 
Trodaí Urnaí said:
Don't know Tony Robbins. It amazes me how a Christian can be so against healing when Jesus said to go out and heal. Why be mad about it? It is almost like you have some sort of vendetta and you are out to totally negate any healing ministry?
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I am not against healing and to a degree I agree with your enthusiasm / motivation for it because many Christians don't even try to pray for healing. I am just saying that there are certain things we don't need to include with teaching it. Positive thinking and bending God's arm is not mature Christianity. Forgive me if I am too rude and harsh. I have 3 good friends that bombard my wife and I with Curry Blake's teaching :barefoot:.
 
KingJ said:
I am not against healing and to a degree I agree with your enthusiasm / motivation for it because many Christians don't even try to pray for healing. I am just saying that there are certain things we don't need to include with teaching it. Positive thinking and bending God's arm is not mature Christianity. Forgive me if I am too rude and harsh. I have 3 good friends that bombard my wife and I with Curry Blake's teaching :barefoot:.
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Don't know Curry Blake either. In my own life I have seen a difference in prayers answered and not answered. For example I am selling a house and this last weekend I really got negative and basically didnt trust God. Finally the holy spirit told me to calm down that God is working on it. To be honest I was this way for a week. We had no hits on house. The last three days i have had 3 interests. Was my lack of faith causing my prayers to not be answered?
 
I have an illness that I was told would take my life in 6 month to 20 years. It's been over 20 years now, and I recently read an article that says this illness would take one's life in 10 to 15 years. Hmmmm. Okay! But I believe in healing. I believe that if G-d wants to heal me, He will, so my husband and I pray for my healing, as do other believing members of my family and friends.

I still have the illness. But He has allowed me to live far beyond the doctors' and articles' firm predictions! Furthermore, while I am tired a lot, I am not sick as are others with this illness who have pain as I have never known. So has He healed me?

Well, except for from late July to early September, when I get very sick, weak, tired, and just plain ICKY! BUT!! We think my sister has nailed down that yearly problem, and a friend (a nutritionist) told me what to eat for two weeks plus in order to clear the bad stuff out of my system...and it's WORKING!I am feelinf "unseasonably better" over the last couple days. So has He healed me?

What exactly is healing anyway? For me, I am enjoying the extra time (years!!) He has given me, but I am still looking for complete freedom from this malady.
 
Trodaí Urnaí said:
Don't know Curry Blake either. In my own life I have seen a difference in prayers answered and not answered. For example I am selling a house and this last weekend I really got negative and basically didnt trust God. Finally the holy spirit told me to calm down that God is working on it. To be honest I was this way for a week. We had no hits on house. The last three days i have had 3 interests. Was my lack of faith causing my prayers to not be answered?
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In this case - your "Faith" is not your repetition of wishing and hoping.. but rather your obedience - that you will listen to the holy spirit and Calm down - to KNOW that God is working on it.....
You can't bring in the buyer...
You can't make sure their offer is good enough
you can't make their credit good and they get their loans approved..
You can't make sure that their appraiser will appraise it "Right"...
you can't bring them to closing without something crazy blowing it....
But.. God can.

I can tell you personally... This was very hard for me.... We went a year trying to sell our house (Relo with work) ... and it's agonizing to go week after week with nothing good coming out of it.. Finally, I realized that "Being Obedient" meant renting it out.... From the day I signed the papers with the property management company - we had a tenant signed up in 2 weeks and moved in in 1 month....

Why didn't God let me sell the house? Don't know...
But... I am thankful that God brought a tenant quickly so we could start to make plans to move along with our lives too...
 
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