Is the age of the Earth connected to Jesus' second coming?

[Major]

When I became a Christian I brought with me my old earth age beliefs but I soon had them challenged. For example what do you think Jesus meant when He said:

John 10:35
“The Scriptures cannot be discredited”.

I take this to mean that Jesus believed in the entirety of the Old Testament and what do you believe Jesus meant when He said:

Matthew 19:4
"Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,'

I take this to mean that Jesus believed that the beginning of time was marked by the creation of the first people and what do you think God meant when He said:

Genesis 1:5
God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

I take this to mean that the original Hebrew meaning for 'evening' and 'morning', which can only be interpreted as being a description of a 24 hour period and no longer, means that the first six days were all 24 hour periods and that this really was the first week at the beginning of time.

There are masses of evidence to support a young Earth but scripture can't be discredited, and remember God can do anything. What do you think?

You asked, What do I think of John 10:35.......
"If he called them gods, unto whom the Word of God came, and the Scriptures cannot be broken".

I do not think that the verse is speaking to an 'Old or New " earth paradigm. Correct Bible understanding always hinges on "Context". The context is that Jesus is saying that "IF" princes and magistrates, appointed and anointed and receiving this honor by grace, were not at fault when they called themselves gods. or when they were referred to as gods, then how could HE, Jesus, the only begotten SON of God deserve to be stoned because He rightfully declared Himself to be God in a body of flesh.

Then Genesis 1:5 says........
"God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day."

The Hebrew word for “day” and the context in which it appears in Genesis will lead to the conclusion that “day” means a literal, 24-hour period of time.

However, The Hebrew word yom translated into the English “day” can mean more than one thing.
It can refer to the 24-hour period of time that it takes for the earth to rotate on its axis.
It can refer to the period of daylight between dawn and dusk.
And it can refer to an unspecified period of time (e.g., “back in my grandfather’s day . . .”).

It is used to refer to a 24-hour period in Genesis 7:11. It is used to refer to the period of daylight between dawn and dusk in Genesis 1:16. And it is used to refer to an unspecified period of time in Genesis 2:4.

So, the real question comes down to what does yom mean in Genesis 1:5–2:2 when used in conjunction with ordinal numbers.
Are these 24-hour periods or something else? Could yom as it is used here mean an unspecified period of time? I am no expert and have no answer for you.

Now for Matthew 19:4...............
"Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,'

Personally I do not think that Jesus was speaking to the beginning of time was marked by the creation of the first people by referencing them as male and female. IMO He was simply going back to God's original plan of marriage One man for One woman. God created one of each for each other setting the example for all man and women forever.

To say that Jesus was speaking to and old or new earth is reading into the Scriptures what we want them to say instead of accepting them for what they actually do say.

Now please do not misunderstand me because I do not know. In fact IMO no one knows.

But, according to those who believe in Young Earth Creationistion, dinosaurs lived alongside humans 6,000 years ago, before the great flood described in Genesis 6-9. That means they would have to have been included in the Ark. Some Christians dispute the existence of dinosaurs all together, claiming that bones excavated by scientists are a ruse meant to cause confusion among believers. The problem comes up in that there has not been any fossil record of humans found with those of the dinosaurs.

If man and dinosaurs co-existed during the 6000 year record, would it not then demand that the bones of each one be found together?

Now consider Genesis 1:2....
"And the earth was without form, and void, and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters".

Before the creative process begins in verse 3, there is "water" on the earth. Where did the water come from.

 

[Major]

Thank you for your reply, I have been looking into this as more and more Christians are coming to this conclusion and am wondering why there is not being made more fuss about it, especially considering that the last 7 years of Daniels prophesy would mean that we would be very close to the time when the Anti-Christ is supposed to take over the world. Just for arguments sake if you're right then that would be just next year! In my original post however I found 3 Christian's who have all independently calculated the 24th September 2029 as the day of Jesus return. Which is very interesting. I would like to hear if you have more thoughts on all of this as I am still trying to assess it all for myself. Do you have you own site where I can view your chronology? God bless.

My advice is to forget any and all date setting. If Jesus does not know then there is no way any one else would know.

Mark 13:32.........
"But concerning that day or that hour, no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father."

 

[Major]

Brothers and Sisters.
When the Bible says it took God 6 days to create the earth, this is not and cannot be taken literally. The two verses below explains why.

2 Peter 3:8
But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day.

Psalm 90:4
For a thousand years in Your sight Are like yesterday when it passes by, Or as a watch in the night.

Psalm 39:5
"Behold, You have made my days as handbreadths, And my lifetime as nothing in Your sight; Surely every man at his best is a mere breath. Selah.

The Bible can be Literal when you think its figurative, and figurative when you think it is being literal. And for all we know, the thousand years mentioned could be figurative, meaning it might be millions of years.

God just may have used evolution to create man. We just do not know how he did it. We do know God is not a magician. And he loves and respects knowledge coupled with wisdom and mercy.

Good thoughts and I appreciate them.

What do you understand about Genesis 1:2?

Where do you think that the water in verse 2 came from since it is mentioned "before" the creation process of verse #3.

 

[Gary Beach]

Good thoughts and I appreciate them.

What do you understand about Genesis 1:2?

Where do you think that the water in verse 2 came from since it is mentioned "before" the creation process of verse #3.

Remember the folks in the days that God was explaining things to mankind, we were nothing short of cavemen. No kind of knowledge nor education at all. So how does one explain the process of creation in a technical manner to them that they would understand? Do they really need the specifics? Or do they just basically need to understand God created all we are and see, and do not see?
Jesus I think said it best when speaking to the scribes and pharisees. He told them they strain at a GNAT while ignoring a beam. They enforced the finer points of the law while ignoring the greater parts.

I really do not speculate on the creation much, all we have to know is that however God did it, it's his work.

 

[Gary Beach]

Remember the folks in the days that God was explaining things to were nothing short of cavemen. No kind of knowledge nor education at all. So how does one explain the process of creation in a technical manner to them that they would understand? Do they really need the specifics? Or do they just basically need to understand God created all we are and see?
Jesus I think said it best when speaking to the scribes and pharisees. He told them they strain at a NAT while ignoring a beam. They enforced the finer points of the law while ignoring the greater parts.

I really do not speculate on the creation much, all we have to know is that however God did it, it's his work.

I do not think God intended genesis to explain how he did creation, as much as that he did do creation. I think the how is unimportant. It's all about who and why.
I also tend to lean to the belief that God would want as little knowledge of how he does things to be in our hands as possible.
Riddled with sin and temptation towards evil, that could be seen by our creator as a very unwise and dangerous thing.

 

[Major]

Remember the folks in the days that God was explaining things to mankind, we were nothing short of cavemen. No kind of knowledge nor education at all. So how does one explain the process of creation in a technical manner to them that they would understand? Do they really need the specifics? Or do they just basically need to understand God created all we are and see, and do not see?
Jesus I think said it best when speaking to the scribes and pharisees. He told them they strain at a GNAT while ignoring a beam. They enforced the finer points of the law while ignoring the greater parts.

I really do not speculate on the creation much, all we have to know is that however God did it, it's his work.

Hebrews 1:1......
"God who at different times and in different ways spoke in times past to the fathers by the prophets".

God gave us what we could understand in portions over the ages. If He gave us all the knowledge He has in one time, our heads would explode.

Ecclesiastes 3:11........
"He has made everything beautiful in its time. Also, he has put eternity into man’s heart, yet so that he cannot find out what God has done from the beginning to the end."

It seems to me that every thing is as God made it; not as it appears to us. We have the world so much in our hearts, are so taken up with thoughts and cares of worldly things, that we have neither time nor spirit to see God's hand in them

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Remember the folks in the days that God was explaining things to mankind, we were nothing short of cavemen. No kind of knowledge nor education at all.

This is not even funny.
Adam and Eve were very intelligent.
They did not communicate with Ugg , Ugg ug

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Ok every one.
This thread is about reached its ending.
Please stick to what the Most Holy Written Word of God Says.
Blessings

 

[Christian Guy]

You asked, What do I think of John 10:35.......
"If he called them gods, unto whom the Word of God came, and the Scriptures cannot be broken".

I do not think that the verse is speaking to an 'Old or New " earth paradigm. Correct Bible understanding always hinges on "Context". The context is that Jesus is saying that "IF" princes and magistrates, appointed and anointed and receiving this honor by grace, were not at fault when they called themselves gods. or when they were referred to as gods, then how could HE, Jesus, the only begotten SON of God deserve to be stoned because He rightfully declared Himself to be God in a body of flesh.

Then Genesis 1:5 says........
"God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day."

The Hebrew word for “day” and the context in which it appears in Genesis will lead to the conclusion that “day” means a literal, 24-hour period of time.

However, The Hebrew word yom translated into the English “day” can mean more than one thing.
It can refer to the 24-hour period of time that it takes for the earth to rotate on its axis.
It can refer to the period of daylight between dawn and dusk.
And it can refer to an unspecified period of time (e.g., “back in my grandfather’s day . . .”).

It is used to refer to a 24-hour period in Genesis 7:11. It is used to refer to the period of daylight between dawn and dusk in Genesis 1:16. And it is used to refer to an unspecified period of time in Genesis 2:4.

So, the real question comes down to what does yom mean in Genesis 1:5–2:2 when used in conjunction with ordinal numbers.
Are these 24-hour periods or something else? Could yom as it is used here mean an unspecified period of time? I am no expert and have no answer for you.

Now for Matthew 19:4...............
"Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,'

Personally I do not think that Jesus was speaking to the beginning of time was marked by the creation of the first people by referencing them as male and female. IMO He was simply going back to God's original plan of marriage One man for One woman. God created one of each for each other setting the example for all man and women forever.

To say that Jesus was speaking to and old or new earth is reading into the Scriptures what we want them to say instead of accepting them for what they actually do say.

Now please do not misunderstand me because I do not know. In fact IMO no one knows.

But, according to those who believe in Young Earth Creationistion, dinosaurs lived alongside humans 6,000 years ago, before the great flood described in Genesis 6-9. That means they would have to have been included in the Ark. Some Christians dispute the existence of dinosaurs all together, claiming that bones excavated by scientists are a ruse meant to cause confusion among believers. The problem comes up in that there has not been any fossil record of humans found with those of the dinosaurs.

If man and dinosaurs co-existed during the 6000 year record, would it not then demand that the bones of each one be found together?

Now consider Genesis 1:2....
"And the earth was without form, and void, and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters".

Before the creative process begins in verse 3, there is "water" on the earth. Where did the water come from.

Thanks for your reply. Yes where did the water come from? That is an interesting question that I have various thought on my self, perhaps if you would like to create a thread about that I'd be happy to discuss it but for the purpose of this thread the assumption is that the Earth is just less than 6000 years old. But thanks for your reply.

 

[Gary Beach]

This is not even funny.
Adam and Eve were very intelligent.
They did not communicate with Ugg , Ugg ug

I did not say they did or did not. What we do know is that they did communicate. How is not something we really know. It could have been pointing or signs, who knows, maybe speech. However it was they did not have the capacity to understand all creation. We do not even have that capacity and we are much much more advanced in that area than they ever could have been. You know I do not have all the answers. But surely you can grasp the idea without taking everything so literally or that someone is thinking they know exactly how things were or were not.
The only few certainties in this world is God exists, God loves us, we are to love one another as Jesus commanded us all to. (Another interesting observation is the young earth theorists also usually advocate the Ten Commandments as did the Pharisees, and never ever mention wanting the one commandment Jesus gave to us all.
This is nothing more than my own opinion of this.

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

I did not say they did or did not.

Remember the folks in the days that God was explaining things to mankind, we were nothing short of cavemen. No kind of knowledge nor education at all.
Those are your words.

 

[Christian Guy]

My advice is to forget any and all date setting. If Jesus does not know then there is no way any one else would know.

Mark 13:32.........
"But concerning that day or that hour, no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father."

Yes that has been my position too up until recently but I am now trying to find out why many Christians are talking the 7000 year plan and also why other Christian's aren't?

BTW the verse you quoted you are assuming that Jesus still doesn't know the day of His own return and we can't assume that, all we know is that nearly 2000 years ago Jesus didn't know at that time, as Jesus says this in the present tense. I mean I could equally assume that when Jesus ascended to Heaven He found out very quickly, from His father, the day He would be returning. Also we can tell from that verse that God has always had a specific day in mind for His Son's second coming.

 

[Major]

Yes that has been my position too up until recently but I am now trying to find out why many Christians are talking the 7000 year plan and also why other Christian's aren't?

BTW the verse you quoted you are assuming that Jesus still doesn't know the day of His own return and we can't assume that, all we know is that nearly 2000 years ago Jesus didn't know at that time, as Jesus says this in the present tense. I mean I could equally assume that when Jesus ascended to Heaven He found out very quickly, from His father, the day He would be returning. Also we can tell from that verse that God has always had a specific day in mind for His Son's second coming.

I can not agree with you on that. What you are saying is in fact an assumption. You are assuming that because Jesus is in heaven with the Father He would know what He has already said that He did not know.

I would be uncomfortable in believing that.

I agree that the Father has always known the time.

 

[Christian Guy]

I can not agree with you on that. What you are saying is in fact an assumption. You are assuming that because Jesus is in heaven with the Father He would know what He has already said that He did not know.

I would be uncomfortable in believing that.

I agree that the Father has always known the time.

I said that I could equally assume that, just as you assume that Jesus still doesn't know. The fact is we have not got that information to know for sure. However, I personally would be more comfortable believing that what the Father knows the Son knows because they are three in one:


John 16:15
All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will receive from me what he will make known to you."

 

[Major]

Thanks for your reply. Yes where did the water come from? That is an interesting question that I have various thought on my self, perhaps if you would like to create a thread about that I'd be happy to discuss it but for the purpose of this thread the assumption is that the Earth is just less than 6000 years old. But thanks for your reply.

It is something I have wondered about for many years and I have to this day never been given what I would call a really good explanation.

Personally I have been drawn to thinking that there may have been another creation before Genesis 1:1 and the water seen in Gen. 1:2 was actually what was left from the judgment of that creation. That would actually go a long way in explaining the existence of the dinosaurs.

I am not dogmatic on this, it is just something I keep coming back to.

Genesis 1:28 King James Version (KJV)
"And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth."

And yes, I am aware that The literal word for "Replenish" here is ......Fill.

 

[Major]

I said that I could equally assume that, just as you assume that Jesus still doesn't know. The fact is we have not got that information to know for sure. However, I personally would be more comfortable believing that what the Father knows the Son knows because they are three in one:


John 16:15
All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will receive from me what he will make known to you."

And I would not argue that point with you. If it makes you comfortable then that is fine with me.

 

[Gary Beach]

Remember the folks in the days that God was explaining things to mankind, we were nothing short of cavemen. No kind of knowledge nor education at all.
Those are your words.

So what grade schools were they attending? What college did they attend? I too can travel into the absurd. Doing so does not make a point one way or the other.
The point I was alluding to is not difficult. If I did not communicate that well the first time I do apologize, I do think my second attempt was much clearer.
Let's not assume evil intent.
And I most certainly would not attempt to use my lowly observations to prove anything one way or another.

 

[Major]

This is not even funny.
Adam and Eve were very intelligent.
They did not communicate with Ugg , Ugg ug

The Op was about the age of the earth being connected to Jesus 2nd Coming. Personally I do not understand that at all.

However, back to the op and the age of the earth, do you accept the idea of a "Gap" between Genesis 1:1 and verse 2 of millions of years?

Or, do you accept the idea that the dinosaurs were 6000 years old and lived with men and were on the Ark?

If so, why have there never been any human remains found with the remains of those dinosaurs?

What is your position and then why do you believe that?

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

So what grade schools were they attending? What college did they attend? I too can travel into the absurd. Doing so does not make a point one way or the other.
The point I was alluding to is not difficult. If I did not communicate that well the first time I do apologize, I do think my second attempt was much clearer.
Let's not assume evil intent.
And I most certainly would not attempt to use my lowly observations to prove anything one way or another.

Come on Brother,
You are speaking from a natural man's point of view.

God is an Intelligent Being......He Created Man in His Image.....He talked with them and placed Adam in charge of naming animals.
Yep that sounds like uneducated cave men.
Blessings
FCJ

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

The Op was about the age of the earth being connected to Jesus 2nd Coming. Personally I do not understand that at all.

However, back to the op and the age of the earth, do you accept the idea of a "Gap" between Genesis 1:1 and verse 2 of millions of years?

Or, do you accept the idea that the dinosaurs were 6000 years old and lived with men and were on the Ark?

If so, why have there never been any human remains found with the remains of those dinosaurs?

What is your position and then why do you believe that?

Hi Major,
Truthfully I don't give much thought on any of it.
None of it will aid me in following the plan the Father has set before me.
Thanks for asking
Blessings
FCJ