How does one "misuse" a manuscript?
List of Totally or Partially Omitted, Transposed and Interpolated Bible Passages
- Thread starter netchaplain
- Start date
By forging information that they would like to enter. After making a last copy is when they destroy the manuscript copy in order to perpetuate a continued tradition of ongoing correct manuscript. Of course this cannot occur in modern times because the translators have all of the manuscript copies.
If they wanted to defraud, during the copy process is the best time. Destroying the original serves to hide the evidence.
I still don't see how destroying the original ever makes sense for legitimate actors. At worst you have an old manuscript lying around, at best you have an artifact to compare against in cases of doubt or confusion.
I still don't see how destroying the original ever makes sense for legitimate actors. At worst you have an old manuscript lying around, at best you have an artifact to compare against in cases of doubt or confusion.
Of course all that we are talking about would have had to happen when copies of manuscripts were being produced. The copiers (scribes) did pretty good and is why there in only one false manuscript source, and not more. The corrupted source is referred to as the Minority Text
(Alexandrian Text). The true manuscript source is the Majority Text (Traditional Text).
NetChaplain,
Coming in late to this thread I apologize.
}}}===>>> What manuscript copies are corrupted?
tischendorf manuscripts
...
"In addition to Codex Sinaiticus, Tischendorf made significant contributions through his work on other manuscripts. He deciphered the Codex Ephraemi Rescriptus, a palimpsest containing a Greek New Testament overwritten in Syriac, which he published in 1843. He also collated numerous uncial manuscripts and published several editions of the Greek New Testament, with his first edition appearing in 1840 and seven more following during his lifetime.
..."
~ Mabe
Hi! There are only two sources of manuscript copies: Codex Sinaiticus; Codex Vaticanus. These two primarily make up what's known as the "Minority Text" because it only comprises two sources. These manuscripts were never used for copying by early scribes, which decarded them as they were not in agreement with most of the extant manuscript copies. The Minority Text (MNT) does not contain the entire Bible because it omits much of the Scriptural passages of the Majority Text (MJT). The (MJT) is the only manuscript source that contains the entire Bible.
You can check any modern translation with passages in any Traditional translation (KJV/NKJV) and see the omission of many verses. One of the examples are 1Jn 5:7, which is supposed to say, "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one." But all the have is "For there are three that testify." Without "the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost" it does not show the omnipresence of the Holy Spirit being in both heaven and earth.
Verse 7 is the "heavenly testimony,: and verse 8 is the "earthly testimony," reveling the omnipresence of the Spirit being in both places simultaneously.
Another of hundreds of examples in the NT is Jhn 3:13, which is supposed to say, "no man hath ascended up to heaven, but He that came down from heaven, even the Son of Man which is in heaven." Most modern versions omit the phrase "which is in heaven," without demonstrating that the Lord Jesus was in heaven at the same time He was on the earth.
One last example is a problem in 1Sam 21:19 which is supposed to say "Elhanan killed the brother of Goliath," but most modern versions have an error here which reads, "Elhanan killed Goliath." Everyone knows that David killed Goliath," not Elhanan.
I can present more information if you like.
Thanks for the reply and God bless!
NetChaplain,
Excellent need to know errors so can correct.
Thank you for the clarification!
~ Mabe
Excellent need to know errors so can correct.
Thank you for the clarification!
~ Mabe
NetChaplain,
}}}===>>> Which Version / Publisher do you think is the most exact on not adding or deleting words?
(Am not a KJV only or NKJV only type personally nor do I support that the deuterocanonical books should have been eliminated by the revision of King James.)
}}}===>>> Is the
Septuagint Greek Version Bible
the best we can hope for on precision?
"...
The Septuagint, commonly abbreviated as LXX, is the earliest extant Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible, also referred to as the Old Testament. It was produced by Jews living in the Ptolemaic Kingdom, primarily in Alexandria, Egypt, during the 3rd and 2nd centuries BC. The Pentateuch (first five books of the Bible) was likely translated in the early to middle part of the 3rd century BC, while the remaining books were translated over the following two to three centuries. The version was written in Koine Greek, the common language of the eastern Mediterranean at the time, reflecting the linguistic environment of Hellenistic Judaism.
The name "Septuagint" derives from the Latin word septuaginta, meaning "seventy," referencing the legendary account in the Letter of Aristeas that seventy-two Hebrew scholars—six from each of the Twelve Tribes of Israel—were sent from Jerusalem to Alexandria to translate the Torah at the request of King Ptolemy II Philadelphus (285–247 BC). Although this story is considered pseudepigraphical by many scholars and likely a later tradition, it contributed to the name and the perception of the translation's divine inspiration. The term "LXX" (the Roman numeral for seventy) is commonly used as an abbreviation.
The Septuagint is not a single unified text but a collection of translations made by different individuals at various times and places, resulting in variations in style and quality across books. It includes the books of the Hebrew Bible (Tanakh), organized into four sections: Law, History, Poetry, and Prophets, differing from the Hebrew canon's threefold division. Additionally, it contains several books and additions not found in the Hebrew Bible, such as Tobit, Judith, Wisdom of Solomon, Sirach, Baruch, and additions to Daniel (e.g., Susanna, Bel and the Dragon), which are now known as deuterocanonical or apocryphal books. Some of these texts were originally composed in Greek, while others were translated from Hebrew or Aramaic.
The Septuagint played a crucial role in the spread of Jewish religious ideas and later became the Old Testament of the early Christian Church, influencing the New Testament authors who frequently cited it. It served as the basis for other ancient translations, including the Latin Vetus Latina, the Syriac Peshitta, and versions in Slavonic, Armenian, Georgian, and Coptic. Modern editions of the Septuagint, such as those by Rahlfs or Brenton, are eclectic reconstructions based on the best available Greek manuscripts, aiming to approximate the original translation. ..."
Brief History of Septuagint by Bible Archaeology Org
...
"Limitations of the Septuagint
The Orthodox Church argues that the Septuagint is more accurate than the Hebrew Bible and should be used in Bible translation. However, it is good to be aware of some of the Septuagint's limitations.
The Septuagint of Job is about a sixth shorter than the traditional Hebrew text of the Bible known as the Masoretic Text. The missing portions were supplied from the Greek version of Theodotion. The Septuagint of Jeremiah is about an eighth shorter than the Masoretic Text, repeated passages are cut out and the order is changed. Furthermore, the Septuagint often preserves different numbers, e.g. the ages of some of the patriarchs in Genesis are given variously, thus:
So, perhaps for all the plaudits the Septuagint supposedly received from Ptolemy II, it should come as no great surprise that the Septuagint did not receive a universally favorable reception among the Jews: 'That day was as ominous for Israel as the day on which the golden calf was made since the Law could not be accurately translated' (Mesechet Sopherim [Tractate for Scribes] 1.7).
Ultimate Significance of the Septuagint
It was the adoption of the Septuagint by the early Church that was the biggest factor in its eventual abandonment by the Jews. The Septuagint's use of parthenos, meaning 'virgin' in Isaiah 7:14 to describe the mother of the promised son Immanuel, was used by Matthew 1:23 as evidence for Yeshua's virgin birth.
Like any translation the Septuagint has its limitations, but it was the first translation of any part of the Hebrew Bible into another language, so its place in world history is assured. Furthermore, its use as the version of the Old Testament most frequently used by the writers of the New Testament only serves to further enhance its significance.
..."
}}}===>>> Which Version / Publisher do you think is the most exact on not adding or deleting words?
(Am not a KJV only or NKJV only type personally nor do I support that the deuterocanonical books should have been eliminated by the revision of King James.)
}}}===>>> Is the
Septuagint Greek Version Bible
the best we can hope for on precision?
"...
The Septuagint, commonly abbreviated as LXX, is the earliest extant Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible, also referred to as the Old Testament. It was produced by Jews living in the Ptolemaic Kingdom, primarily in Alexandria, Egypt, during the 3rd and 2nd centuries BC. The Pentateuch (first five books of the Bible) was likely translated in the early to middle part of the 3rd century BC, while the remaining books were translated over the following two to three centuries. The version was written in Koine Greek, the common language of the eastern Mediterranean at the time, reflecting the linguistic environment of Hellenistic Judaism.
The name "Septuagint" derives from the Latin word septuaginta, meaning "seventy," referencing the legendary account in the Letter of Aristeas that seventy-two Hebrew scholars—six from each of the Twelve Tribes of Israel—were sent from Jerusalem to Alexandria to translate the Torah at the request of King Ptolemy II Philadelphus (285–247 BC). Although this story is considered pseudepigraphical by many scholars and likely a later tradition, it contributed to the name and the perception of the translation's divine inspiration. The term "LXX" (the Roman numeral for seventy) is commonly used as an abbreviation.
The Septuagint is not a single unified text but a collection of translations made by different individuals at various times and places, resulting in variations in style and quality across books. It includes the books of the Hebrew Bible (Tanakh), organized into four sections: Law, History, Poetry, and Prophets, differing from the Hebrew canon's threefold division. Additionally, it contains several books and additions not found in the Hebrew Bible, such as Tobit, Judith, Wisdom of Solomon, Sirach, Baruch, and additions to Daniel (e.g., Susanna, Bel and the Dragon), which are now known as deuterocanonical or apocryphal books. Some of these texts were originally composed in Greek, while others were translated from Hebrew or Aramaic.
The Septuagint played a crucial role in the spread of Jewish religious ideas and later became the Old Testament of the early Christian Church, influencing the New Testament authors who frequently cited it. It served as the basis for other ancient translations, including the Latin Vetus Latina, the Syriac Peshitta, and versions in Slavonic, Armenian, Georgian, and Coptic. Modern editions of the Septuagint, such as those by Rahlfs or Brenton, are eclectic reconstructions based on the best available Greek manuscripts, aiming to approximate the original translation. ..."
Brief History of Septuagint by Bible Archaeology Org
...
"Limitations of the Septuagint
The Orthodox Church argues that the Septuagint is more accurate than the Hebrew Bible and should be used in Bible translation. However, it is good to be aware of some of the Septuagint's limitations.
The Septuagint of Job is about a sixth shorter than the traditional Hebrew text of the Bible known as the Masoretic Text. The missing portions were supplied from the Greek version of Theodotion. The Septuagint of Jeremiah is about an eighth shorter than the Masoretic Text, repeated passages are cut out and the order is changed. Furthermore, the Septuagint often preserves different numbers, e.g. the ages of some of the patriarchs in Genesis are given variously, thus:
| Reference | Person's age | Masoretic Text | Septuagint |
| 5:3 | Adam's age at birth of Seth | 130 | 230 |
| 5:6 | Seth's age at birth of Enosh | 105 | 205 |
| 5:28 | Lamech's age at birth of Noah | 182 | 188 |
| 5:31 | Age of Lamech | 777 | 753 |
Ultimate Significance of the Septuagint
It was the adoption of the Septuagint by the early Church that was the biggest factor in its eventual abandonment by the Jews. The Septuagint's use of parthenos, meaning 'virgin' in Isaiah 7:14 to describe the mother of the promised son Immanuel, was used by Matthew 1:23 as evidence for Yeshua's virgin birth.
Like any translation the Septuagint has its limitations, but it was the first translation of any part of the Hebrew Bible into another language, so its place in world history is assured. Furthermore, its use as the version of the Old Testament most frequently used by the writers of the New Testament only serves to further enhance its significance.
..."
Septuagint Bible w/ Apocrypha LXX - Bible Study Tools
"... The Septuagint is a translation of the Hebrew Bible and some related texts into Koine Greek. As the primary Greek translation of the Old Testament, it is also called the Greek Old Testament. This translation is quoted in the New Testament, particularly by Paul, and also by the Greek Church Fathers. The title and its Roman numeral acronym LXX refer to legendary seventy Jewish scholars who solely translated the Five Books Of Moses as early as the late 2nd century BC.
The Septuagint is a translation of the Hebrew Bible and some related texts into Koine Greek. As the primary Greek translation of the Old Testament, it is also called the Greek Old Testament. This translation is quoted in the New Testament, particularly by Paul, and also by the Greek Church Fathers. The title and its Roman numeral acronym LXX refer to legendary seventy Jewish scholars who solely translated the Five Books Of Moses as early as the late 2nd century BC.
This English translation by Sir Lancelot C. L. Brenton, published in 1851, is considered a long-time standard. For most of the years since its publication it has been the only one readily available, and has continually been in print. It is based primarily upon the Codex Vaticanus and contains the Greek and English texts in parallel columns.
The Brenton translation of the Septuagint is in the public domain. ..."
Septuagint - Internet Archive
The Apocrypha, The Septuagint and the canon
The Apocrypha, The Septuagint and the canon - Printer Friendly Edition
"... The Septuagint is a translation of the Hebrew Bible and some related texts into Koine Greek. As the primary Greek translation of the Old Testament, it is also called the Greek Old Testament. This translation is quoted in the New Testament, particularly by Paul, and also by the Greek Church Fathers. The title and its Roman numeral acronym LXX refer to legendary seventy Jewish scholars who solely translated the Five Books Of Moses as early as the late 2nd century BC.
The Septuagint is a translation of the Hebrew Bible and some related texts into Koine Greek. As the primary Greek translation of the Old Testament, it is also called the Greek Old Testament. This translation is quoted in the New Testament, particularly by Paul, and also by the Greek Church Fathers. The title and its Roman numeral acronym LXX refer to legendary seventy Jewish scholars who solely translated the Five Books Of Moses as early as the late 2nd century BC.
This English translation by Sir Lancelot C. L. Brenton, published in 1851, is considered a long-time standard. For most of the years since its publication it has been the only one readily available, and has continually been in print. It is based primarily upon the Codex Vaticanus and contains the Greek and English texts in parallel columns.
The Brenton translation of the Septuagint is in the public domain. ..."
Septuagint - Internet Archive
The Apocrypha, The Septuagint and the canon
The Apocrypha, The Septuagint and the canon - Printer Friendly Edition