Politics and the Church.

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Everyone wants to be chief...lol
Actually I don't really but the sheep need herding and feeding by someone. I think 12 is enough for one person to handle (Jesus only picked 12) because you do have to call them by name.

Thing is, Jacobs family had 13, 12 sons and 1 daughter, but he had also two wives and two concubines. (makes for many family squabbles 'politics' by another name) Many families today are not like that at all...there are also 'blended' families.

So it's not so simple.
 
Thanks for the question brother.
there are reasons of divorce a man should not be a preacher . verbal abuse to the spouse . adultery especially if he will not rule over his own household.. i am more than well aware of what polygamy is. if divorce happened before grace the .i fail to see the accountability. how ever there are still circumstances that they should not preach

married to only ONE woman at a time.
so is it ok to have been married several times ?
 
there are reasons of divorce a man should not be a preacher . verbal abuse to the spouse . adultery especially if he will not rule over his own household.. i am more than well aware of what polygamy is. if divorce happened before grace the .i fail to see the accountability. how ever there are still circumstances that they should not preach


so is it ok to have been married several times ?
My opinion:

I would assume it depends on the manner the prior marriage(s) ended.

If the first wife died, it is quite different than a failed marriage.

But a failed marriage may indicate something in one's nature that caused the marriage partnership to fail. Even if it is supposed that the wife is 'at fault', it still is an indication that one was unable to solve the problems that come up in long commited unions.
 
My opinion:

I would assume it depends on the manner the prior marriage(s) ended.

If the first wife died, it is quite different than a failed marriage.

But a failed marriage may indicate something in one's nature that caused the marriage partnership to fail. Even if it is supposed that the wife is 'at fault', it still is an indication that one was unable to solve the problems that come up in long commited unions.
i agree %100 the presbytery i was in we changed it to that exact manner . before no matter 2nd marriage we would not ordaine . we felt it was the only fair thing to do
 
I recall visiting a church where they were set to ordain a new pastor and he came up to the pulpit to introduce himself and near the end of the sort of interview they had in front of everyone he was like 'oh by the way, I'm divorced'.

Though he didn't mention the circumstances. He looked youngish, so I don't know. Some people are divorced because they married unbeliever when they were young and also unbelievers themselves, they could have come to Christ later in life.

It was a baptist church and as far as I know if you are a member you can vote whether you want the pastor or not.
I don't know how it's done in other churches. But that's how Baptists tend to operate. In some ways its good but others it falls apart because with voting it's always majority rules so if you tend to have exclusive clubs made up of the majority...and board members tend to be male, so you would hardly ever get a say if you are the token female. You just get drowned out or outvoted. They don't really deem females as important and female issues are not considered much if at all.
 
t was a baptist church and as far as I know if you are a member you can vote whether you want the pastor or not.
this is true being ordained and voted in as a pastor is 2 different things . ordained is when a man announces his call to preach the presbytery will exam the man find out if he has other marriages ,
usually ask few questions about his character if they dont know him. then question him on his calling . something like why do you feel your called to preach.? then after that we license him for a year in that time he goes to each Church in the association and will preach .
after that year he comes back .
we reexamine him again. after that we vote to ordain him . then set up a time place for his ordination. one of the pastors will preach his charge to preach. we then gather around him and lay hands on him pray for him. he then is free to find a church ,
the question is can he pastor will he is licensed the presbytery does not control the local church that is up to the local church .presbytery

the presbytery is made up of ordained ministers and deacons . the election of a pastor is much like you described only in most cases. the presbytery. usually knows of few things ahead of time.

unless he has been ordained previously and divorced . so if he is out side the association once again the local church has the say over the pastor .


if you are the token female. You just get drowned out or outvoted. They don't really deem females as important and female issues are not considered much if at all.

in Baptist Churches No woman are not allowed to preach. how ever women have a very important role in the Church and they should not be deemed as not much of all .

the ladies have many functions in the Church and yes they have a voice in the Church . personally i think it would be great to attend church in the country you live
 
there are reasons of divorce a man should not be a preacher . verbal abuse to the spouse . adultery especially if he will not rule over his own household.. i am more than well aware of what polygamy is. if divorce happened before grace the .i fail to see the accountability. how ever there are still circumstances that they should not preach


so is it ok to have been married several times ?

There are NO Biblical reasons. What you just posted is YOU OPINION of what YOU think and it is NOT supported by the Scriptures which I posted for you to read.

You said.........
"if divorce happened before grace the .i fail to see the accountability".

That makes NO sense and I have no idea what you mean so I can not respond to it.

The point is.........The Bible does not say that a "divorced" man can not be a Pastor.

You would think that because many of the Old Testament men that you had read about had more than one wife you would understand why God placed 1 Timothy 3:1-3 in the Bible.

Some of the polygamists in the Old Testament mentioned by name are Lamech, in Gen 4:19, who is the first polygamist, and then there were Jacob, Esau, Elkanah, Ashur, Shaharaim, and many of the kings, like David, Solomon, Rehoboam, Abijah, Ahab, Jehoram, Joash, and Jehoiachin, and Belshazzar. Even people who know very little Bible know that Solomon had 700 wives and 300 concubines.

What the Bible DOES say is that The two cases in which God permits divorce are fornication (Matt 19:9) and desertion (1 Cor 7:15). In those two cases, the marriage can be dissolved and the spouse is free to remarry (1 Cor 7:28) without living in adultery.

So when you come across a verse in the New Testament that tells you a bishop can only have one wife, you’re going to think that the Bible means exactly what it says. The man can’t be a polygamist, though his contemporaries in other religions may be and though many of the Jewish fathers were.

The thought that 1 Tim 3:2 and Tit 1:6 could be referring to a preacher who had been divorced and remarried wouldn’t even cross your mind, unless somebody had given you that thought. You would remember that a man and woman who are divorced are no longer husband and wife [Hos 2:2]. Therefore, you wouldn’t even consider that Paul was referring to a pastor who had been remarried after a scriptural divorce. You would know from the Bible that he still only has one wife.

To simplify this, you can “do the math” as the saying goes. When a man is married, he has one wife. When he is divorced, he has no wife. When he remarries, he has one wife. One plus zero equals one, not two.

Now.....how did YOU come to YOUR conclusion?????? The only way YOU could come to YOUR conclusion is to force the Bible to say something it doesn’t say. Or else someone taught YOU that 1 Tim 3:2 and Tit 1:6 really meant “not divorced and remarried” when it said “the husband of one wife.”
 
i agree %100 the presbytery i was in we changed it to that exact manner . before no matter 2nd marriage we would not ordaine . we felt it was the only fair thing to do

So .......what if a mans wife was convicted of the murder of her child and while in prison for life the husband divorced her.?
So.........what if a mans wife shot him with a gun but did not kill him and then he divorced her for attempted murder?
So.........what if a mans wife has an affair, packs her bags and leaves her husband and he then divorces her.??
 
There are NO Biblical reasons. What you just posted is YOU OPINION of what YOU think and it is NOT supported by the Scriptures which I posted for you to read.
excuse me let me say this out of love and be respectful . i dint ask you and i will stand by my so called opinion . i am well aware of what the Bible says . lets call this a truce we simply seldom agree


Now.....how did YOU come to YOUR conclusion??????

the exact same way you did AMEN
 
So .......what if a mans wife was convicted of the murder of her child and while in prison for life the husband divorced her.?
So.........what if a mans wife shot him with a gun but did not kill him and then he divorced her for attempted murder?
So.........what if a mans wife has an affair, packs her bags and leaves her husband and he then divorces her.??
gezzzzzzz did you not read where we had voted to examine on a case by case basis . what IF a frog didnt have legs
 
excuse me let me say this out of love and be respectful . i dint ask you and i will stand by my so called opinion . i am well aware of what the Bible says . lets call this a truce we simply seldom agree




the exact same way you did AMEN
I agree 100%. Friends and brothers in Christ should be able to discuss these things in love and understanding.

Now my friend, You did not have to ask me anything at all. When YOU place an opinion on an OPEN forum you just opened the door to the world to respond which is exactly what I did.

I simply hate to see people make decisions such as this one on divorced men which are not Bible based but instead are motivated by personal opinions.

WHY would I say that?????

BECAUSE----Over the years of my life, I have personally seen a lot of really good men denied a Pastorate and the office of a Deacon because some people in a church lived by some rules and opinions that were taught to them by people who did not read and understand the word of God.

I have no axe to grind with you and nothing is personal for me. I only try to inform and teach the word of God.

Now, the center of our conversation and YOUR thinking comes from......." “the husband of one wife.” .

So then.........The proponents of the opinions that a man called to preach is disqualified to pastor use 1 Timothy 3:2 and Titus 6 to say that divorced men cannot pastor. Yet, everyone reading the Scriptures will have to agree that you will not find the verse or verses to say that the bishop must not have been divorced and remarried. They are not in the Bible.

Blessing to you brother!
 

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Staff Note - This thread is also being closed because of arguing by persons who have been cautioned repeatedly that this type of conduct is NOT something that is allowed at this forum. If you have extreme differences, settle it by using Private Messaging, because if this continues in other threads in the open forum, there will be consequences.


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