The Gates of Hell

I guess simply Gates of hell is anywhere where Evil can come out of. And as I said upon a rock, a house stands, and so we stand upon Christ, or with Christ lol, therefore the Gates of hell and evil cannot prevail against the Good, the Rock, the Holy.
 
Jesus said that God had revealed to Peter who he really was and upon this rock he would build his Church - which was divine revelation - not Peter.

Sorry I don't understand :S.. could you rephrase? Is it in the bible? If it is can you post it and explain it more because it rings a bell and I believe I did not understand that the first time I read that..

edit: Hmmm it's starting to make sense, but can you explain more please brother?
 
Sorry I don't understand :S.. could you rephrase? Is it in the bible? If it is can you post it and explain it more because it rings a bell and I believe I did not understand that the first time I read that..

edit: Hmmm it's starting to make sense, but can you explain more please brother?

This is a classic Catholic/Protestant argument. Will post when I get more time.

Larry II
 

smellycat

Account Closed
they cannot get around christ,s words.or round christ himself.peter is the rock because he believed Jesus to be the son of God.we should all read Jesus because he talks truth.
 
Christ told Simon that his name would thereafter be Peter, which translates as "Rock" (John 1:42). The startling thing was that—aside from the single time that Abraham is called a "rock" (Hebrew: Tsur; Aramaic: Kepha) in Isaiah 51:1-2—in the Old Testament only God was called a rock.


The verse in question is Mat 16:18 "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."


The name Peter derived from the Greek Πετρος (Petros) meaning "stone". This is a translation used in most versions of the New Testament of the name Cephas, meaning "stone" in Aramaic, which was given to the apostle Simon by Jesus; however there is two rocks spoken of in Mat 16:18

18 And I tell you, you are Peter [Greek, Petros--a large piece of rock], and on this rock [Greek, petra--a huge rock like Gibraltar] I will build My church, and the gates of Hades (the powers of the infernal region) shall not overpower it [or be strong to its detriment or hold out against it].

So then, let’s take the “original” English phrase that we have…
You are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church.
Next, we swap in the Greek words (my apologies, but I am not scholarly enough to deal with the whole passage in Greek)…
You are Petros, and on this petra I will build my church.
Next, we assume that Jesus was speaking Hebrew or Aramaic (both of which are closely related, and to my knowledge, have very similar words, grammar, etc). We see that other locations in scripture in fact use an Aramaic name for Simon Peter (which is obviously derived from a Hebrew word), so we swap that in with reasonable confidence…
You are Cephas, and on this petra I will build my church.
Finally, we must figure out what word Christ would have used in the place of petra. In Matthew and Luke, we see that Jesus told the parable of the wise man who built his house on the rock. The word used there was petra. Obviously, we see from that parable that the wise man built his house upon a firm foundation. This is right in line with both the lexical definitions of petra that I have available to me, as well as with the use of the Hebrew word sela’. Thus, we can reasonable assume that that sela’, or an Aramaic derivitive (shu’a), and not keph (or an Aramaic derivitive or hellenized form like cephas) was used…
You are Cephas, and on this shu’a I will build my church.

As you can see Jesus was not referring to Peter, I know this will be hard for you to accept for most of my catholic brothers but the fact still remains that the interpretation that I have put forth is the correct one.



BTW if i sound like I am being harsh I am not just dont really know how to express myself in forums well... maybe I sould use alot of smiles :cool:
 
B

Boanerges(Inactive)

Guest
Amen Atrhick- Christ is the Rock upon which the Church will be built, Peter was merely a rock.
 

smellycat

Account Closed
translation sucks.and this is where back reference suffers and people lose truth.i understand why Jesus called peter his rock,because he knew he was the son of God and only got this from his father the rock which is God.translation just confuses a lot of things.:eek:
 
Amen Atrhick- Christ is the Rock upon which the Church will be built, Peter was merely a rock.


Exactly.
And what is the first stone to be placed when building?
That’s right, the cornerstone.

And who is the chief cornerstone?
That’s right, Jesus is the chief cornerstone.

That is what the Church is built on.

If the Church were built on top of a mortal man, what a sorry state we would all be in.

Not taking anything away from Peter, but he is just not a good foundation for the bride of Christ.
 

Dusty

Inactive
Rick Joyner in his book, Epic Battles of the Last Days, has a bit different view of the gates of hell. He says "The gates of hell are the entrances through which evil gains access to this world. Likewise, the doors of heaven are the openings through which divine grace and truth flow to the world."

"These spiritual gates or doors are often localities, especially cities where people are concentrated in great numbers. The conflict between the kingdom of God and this present evil age is not over territory, but over people."

He cites the City of Cologne (Koln) as being an example of a portal of evil. Cologne, Germany has been one of the most influential cities in world history. Consider the following...

Cologne was founded at the time of the birth of Christ. The mother of the emperor Nero was born there. The mad emperor Caligula also came from Cologne. Cologne was the capital city which ruled the western part of the Roman empire. It was also highly involved in orchestrating the Crusades, which was the most flagrant distortion of Christianity that there ever was.

The Cathedral in Cologne was built to house the remains of the three wise men. Karl Marx moved to Cologne and was the publisher of a socialist newspaper. He published The Communist Manifesto from there. Robert Blum and Moses Hess started their careers in Cologne. They were the founders of modern Zionism.

So this city was central in many movments that were responsible for much bloodshed over the past several hundred years. Was Cologne a "gate of hell?

Larry II


Thanks Larry II.... That sums it up very well . No dispute from me.
 

Dusty

Inactive
Exactly.
And what is the first stone to be placed when building?
That’s right, the cornerstone.

And who is the chief cornerstone?
That’s right, Jesus is the chief cornerstone.

That is what the Church is built on.

If the Church were built on top of a mortal man, what a sorry state we would all be in.

Not taking anything away from Peter, but he is just not a good foundation for the bride of Christ.


Thanks Dean.... I think now we are just repeating ourselves only in different words. But your summery is the best. But we do need to take away from Peter because he was the church builder but Christ is the church.
 
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