Tithing Is Not A New Testament Principle

It's not a commandment-it's about the condition of the heart towards doing the Lord's work supporting the Church. Since we need to make it 'relevant'; most people that don't have animals and crops to give-have money, AKA: income.

Of course we should give money. Although those who do have crops and animals may prefer to give food instead of money, OR along with money. It's a heart issue, not a percentage issue. Even in the OT, they gave money. The tithe was not money, but giving included money.
 
(SBC LIFEWAY) FACTS AND TRENDS MAGAZINE, Mar/Apr 2006; pg 14-19, for complete article.

If one out of five (20%) of SBC pastors and regular church members freely admit that they disagree with the tithing doctrine, then 20% should be enough of a REASON to re-study the doctrine.

This does not prove that they are against supporting the church! It merely proves that they are against supporting it using the Old Covenant principles of tithing.

Baptists flourished for over 300 years without teaching tithing. Perhaps they should restore their old paths of evangelism and Training Union instead of restoring the Mosaic Law.

You bring up the SBC with a Lifeway article. I will do the same with an article from SBC by Kenneth Hemphill:

First, the tithe preceded the giving of the Law. The first mention of tithing is found in Genesis 14:20 where Abram gives Melchizedek a tenth of all he had. Abram has defeated Chedorlaomer and thus is entitled to the spoils taken in battle. The contrast in the story is telling. The defeated king of Sodom wants to make a deal with Abram, allowing him to keep the goods and returning the people to him. Melchizedek, on the other hand, meets Abram on his return and provides for his needs, bringing him bread and wine. Abram's spontaneous gift of the tithe is based on his renewed understanding that "God Most High" is the possessor of the heaven and earth. This is a biblical truth that goes back to the beginning chapters of Genesis. The spontaneous act of tithing was later codified in the Law.
Second, grace does not negate the Law but rather fills it full of meaning. If one looks at Jesus' treatment of various Old Testament Laws in the Sermon on the Mount, we will find that He always exceeds the Law by internalizing and intensifying it. For example, one might outwardly obey the Law about murder but yet express intense anger toward his brother. Now in the Kingdom instituted by grace, this person stands guilty (Matt. 5:21-22). By the way, Jesus actually mentions the practice of giving in this same context. He indicates that when you come to present an offering and you remember that your brother has something against you, you should go and be reconciled to your brother. But that is not the end of one's duty under grace. He must "then come and present your offering" (5:24). It would be a disgrace to grace to indicate that the person who has received grace would do less than one under the Law.
 
It would be a disgrace to grace to indicate that the person who has received grace would do less than one under the Law.

Since wage earners did not tithe under the law, ANY giving under grace is more than what wage earners were required to give under the law. Furthermore, tithing wasn't giving, it was paying (Matthew 23:23).

I've already gone over Abram's tenth. Abram, himself, said the spoils didn't belong to him. He kept NONE of the spoils. NONE. Not like what is taught today - give the tenth and the 90% is yours to keep.

God commanded THREE different tithes (tenths). Why don't you try to follow all three of them? You pick and choose which laws you want brought forward.

What Abram did wasn't even carried forward into the law. God didn't want a tenth of war spoils. Also, under the law, the victor didn't own the spoils. (Numbers 31)

Future Baptist pastors are currently being taught at Liberty University that tithing is not appropriate in the Christian Church. One by one, pastors are beginning to see their error in their teaching of tithing. Many have left the ministry over this issue.

By definition, not interpretation, the Biblical tithe always came from assets and never from income.
 
Taking God at His word is a test of faith for many.

In any test, you have a choice to participate or not (Choose life or death - per the bible. Its your choice).

However, I personally think that people use His word to make excuses for themselves.

You get out what you put in. You obey or disobey - those results you will get.

The bible is plain and clear. Just as there is no way of justifying yourself out of adultery or fornication -
it says bluntly you will go to hell? Not? So ok, is it by grace that you must still sleep with your boyfriend
whom you love so much because God understands that you are not ready and blah blah blah?

One conclusion underlines all this:

DECEPTION.

Yes, even the evil one quoted the scripture against GOD HIMSELF.

........it is therefore not a surprise that people do it to worm themselves out of the very laws of God that are meant to protect and prosper them.

your take.

(ps. it seems every country's norm now is to twist laws to suit their lives, it is actually meant to be for us to twist our lives to fit God... the blessings of honouring His word are then innumerable).

nothing but Luv,

Merk.
 
No sir. Never have and never will. I was just calling your attention TO what the Bible says and not what you are saying. You used a verse as a basis for your opinion and it simply is not there.

You said.........." In this case, Abram was RECOVERING goods belonging to the King of Sodom."

I was simply showing that there was more to it than just what you stated. Abraham brought back more than what was taken from the King of Sodom.

I have not advocated a 10% tithe as you have wrongly stated but in fact have said that we can and should give MORE than that as the New Test. does not fix an amount.

Why did Abraham give 10% when he could have given 7 or 11 or 50%. It was his choice to do so as there was no Law which said 10%....correct??? Is that not exactly what Paul said in 2 Corth. 9:6-7.???

Personally I do not care one bit what anyone gives. I know what I give to my church for its ministry and I am pleased with its efforts in outreach and helping those people it can. It gives regularly to the cooperative program for missionaries. IF more people tithed instead of giving what they wanted to give as a minimum, the churches all over this land could do a lot more in helping the poor, sick and suffering.

I appreciate the work in posting such a long list of people, but in all honest I am not impressed by what others think, especially when one of the groups is the Jehovah's Witnesses cult. That pretty much messes up your whole effort IMO.

I hope you have read Dr. Graham's book in which he states that according to SBC records, about 22% of church members give the tithe (10%).

Can you imagine what the church could do if it had all of its members tithing?????

So agree.

The work of God would go so far if people stopped putting a figure they wanted to it.

10% is His command - do it. The rest of the 90 do what you want.

How presumptious to give what you think 'works for you'.

When Jesus wanted to wash Peters feet. Peter was over the top, wanting his whole body washed.

The real issue with "overobedience" and tithing at 50% this month, and then 5% the next is - CONTROL. plain and simple you want to be the one to decide how much to give God. You just don't have that control. Or shouldn't in a relationship where He is Lord over your life.

Is He Lord? If not then you can live your life how you want it - your choice.

Minimum of 10% consistently folks.
 
Since wage earners did not tithe under the law, ANY giving under grace is more than what wage earners were required to give under the law. Furthermore, tithing wasn't giving, it was paying (Matthew 23:23).

I've already gone over Abram's tenth. Abram, himself, said the spoils didn't belong to him. He kept NONE of the spoils. NONE. Not like what is taught today - give the tenth and the 90% is yours to keep.

God commanded THREE different tithes (tenths). Why don't you try to follow all three of them? You pick and choose which laws you want brought forward.

What Abram did wasn't even carried forward into the law. God didn't want a tenth of war spoils. Also, under the law, the victor didn't own the spoils. (Numbers 31)

Future Baptist pastors are currently being taught at Liberty University that tithing is not appropriate in the Christian Church. One by one, pastors are beginning to see their error in their teaching of tithing. Many have left the ministry over this issue.

By definition, not interpretation, the Biblical tithe always came from assets and never from income.

Great stuff Pastor Gary.

Since wage earners did not tithe under the law...

Could you give the associated scriptures for this statement.

Thanks again, JLB
 
As the 'law' is concerned-we all fail (they all failed) to follow the law. I think that may be one reason we need a Savior. But 'tithing' is directly related to 'giving'. If we are not giving-of our stuff and more importantly of ourselves-how dare we call ourselves "Christians"? Giving money/ income/ stuff-is easier than giving ourselves-but if we aren't going to give our 'stuff'-we will never give of ourselves.

Christ being the perfect example didn't have an income (at least not detailed in the Bible)-But my Savior gave His life in payment for my soul. He gave his blood, sweat and tears for me-for His Church. He said it-then He did it. We spend an awful lot of time being useless wrangling over words and doctrines like tithing. Here's an idea, "Just do it!" You know....that thing we like to ignore in the Bible...obedience....(Might bring us closer to Holiness). As a matter of fact- a 'tithe' is not enough-it is the tip of the iceberg.

Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.-Jesus Christ
 
Great stuff Pastor Gary.

Since wage earners did not tithe under the law...

Could you give the associated scriptures for this statement.

Thanks again, JLB

The scripture to support that wage earners didn't tithe is merely God's tithing commands:

Leviticus 27:30-33 - notice the tithe comes from the seed (crops) and animals. Nothing about money or income.
Deut. 14:22-27 - notice the tithe comes from the seed (crops). Nothing about coming from income.
Deut. 14:28-29 - notice the tithe comes from the seed (crops). Nothing about money or income.

IF you add wages or income to God's commands you are ADDING TO HIS WORD.
 
So agree.

The work of God would go so far if people stopped putting a figure they wanted to it.

10% is His command - do it. The rest of the 90 do what you want.

How presumptious to give what you think 'works for you'.

When Jesus wanted to wash Peters feet. Peter was over the top, wanting his whole body washed.

The real issue with "overobedience" and tithing at 50% this month, and then 5% the next is - CONTROL. plain and simple you want to be the one to decide how much to give God. You just don't have that control. Or shouldn't in a relationship where He is Lord over your life.

Is He Lord? If not then you can live your life how you want it - your choice.

Minimum of 10% consistently folks.

Yes my friend.......I agree with you!
 
As the 'law' is concerned-we all fail (they all failed) to follow the law. I think that may be one reason we need a Savior. But 'tithing' is directly related to 'giving'. If we are not giving-of our stuff and more importantly of ourselves-how dare we call ourselves "Christians"? Giving money/ income/ stuff-is easier than giving ourselves-but if we aren't going to give our 'stuff'-we will never give of ourselves.

Christ being the perfect example didn't have an income (at least not detailed in the Bible)-But my Savior gave His life in payment for my soul. He gave his blood, sweat and tears for me-for His Church. He said it-then He did it. We spend an awful lot of time being useless wrangling over words and doctrines like tithing. Here's an idea, "Just do it!" You know....that thing we like to ignore in the Bible...obedience....(Might bring us closer to Holiness). As a matter of fact- a 'tithe' is not enough-it is the tip of the iceberg.

Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.-Jesus Christ

Amen brother!
 
The scripture to support that wage earners didn't tithe is merely God's tithing commands:

Leviticus 27:30-33 - notice the tithe comes from the seed (crops) and animals. Nothing about money or income.
Deut. 14:22-27 - notice the tithe comes from the seed (crops). Nothing about coming from income.
Deut. 14:28-29 - notice the tithe comes from the seed (crops). Nothing about money or income.

IF you add wages or income to God's commands you are ADDING TO HIS WORD.

NOPE. That is your opinion because it seems that you do not want to tithe. So Don't!

The economy was agriculture based....correct?
 
Since wage earners did not tithe under the law, ANY giving under grace is more than what wage earners were required to give under the law. Furthermore, tithing wasn't giving, it was paying (Matthew 23:23).

I've already gone over Abram's tenth. Abram, himself, said the spoils didn't belong to him. He kept NONE of the spoils. NONE. Not like what is taught today - give the tenth and the 90% is yours to keep.

God commanded THREE different tithes (tenths). Why don't you try to follow all three of them? You pick and choose which laws you want brought forward.

What Abram did wasn't even carried forward into the law. God didn't want a tenth of war spoils. Also, under the law, the victor didn't own the spoils. (Numbers 31)

Future Baptist pastors are currently being taught at Liberty University that tithing is not appropriate in the Christian Church. One by one, pastors are beginning to see their error in their teaching of tithing. Many have left the ministry over this issue.

By definition, not interpretation, the Biblical tithe always came from assets and never from income.

Having studied at Liberty many, many years ago, here is a quote from David A. Croteau: Associate Professor of Biblical Studies @ Liberty University:

"All Christians should give something, but there is not a universal amount or percentage required. Each believer must look at their situation in life, their church, and those around them to seek out possible needs. Furthermore, a mindset focused on eternity, and not the moment, will desire to give sacrificially to God's work on the earth. From some paychecks God may require one hundred percent, from others five percent."
 
NOPE. That is your opinion because it seems that you do not want to tithe. So Don't!

The economy was agriculture based....correct?

So what if the economy was based mainly on agriculture. The farm workers didn't tithe, only the land owners tithed.

The workers as well as the land owners had to pay the Temple Tax (tribute in KJV), which was used for the upkeep of the Temple.

According to the International Bible Encyclopedia, the days of mere bartering ended before the days of Abraham.

Here are just a few examples from The Word to show they did, in fact, use money in Biblical times.

The tithing law itself proves they had both money and a marketing system for buying and selling their crops and animals (Deuteronomy 14:24-26).

THE PURCHASE OF LAND WITH MONEY BY ABRAHAM - Genesis 23:15-16

THE PURCHASE OF LAND WITH MONEY BY JACOB - Genesis 33:19

JOSEPH WAS SOLD TO THE ISHMEELITES FOR MONEY - Genesis 37:28

A MONEY OFFERING TO BE USED FOR THE SERVICE OF THE TABERNACLE - Exodus 30:14-16,

USING SHEKEL OF SILVER TO VALUE A RAM - Leviticus 5:15

THE FOLLOWING VERSES REFER TO WAGES: Genesis 29:15, Genesis 30:28, Genesis 31:7-8, Genesis 31:41, Exodus 2:9, Leviticus 19:13, Malachi 3:5, etc.

THEY HAD A MONEY STANDARD

There are several places in Scripture indicating that scales were used to weigh metals and other items. The Law of Moses, for example, commands Jews not to use dishonest standards, but instead, to use honest scales and honest weights. (See also Deut. 25:13-15; Job 6:2-3; 31:6; Psa. 62:9; Prov. 11:1; 16:11; 20:10, 23; Isa. 40:12; 46:6; and Jer. 32:10).

Leviticus 19:35-36 – Do not use dishonest standards when measuring length, weight or quantity. Use honest scales and honest weights, an honest ephah and an honest hin. I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of Egypt.

In order for money to be an exchangeable equivalent for other commodities in today’s society, there must be a standard in place. Likewise, the Old Testament also had a set standard both prior to the law and during the law. A reference to a pre-law standard is in Genesis 23:16.

Merchants in biblical times traveled from place to place conducting business. According to the written law, the standard weight for metals was set according to the sanctuary shekel (See also Ex 30:13, 24; 38:24-26; Lev. 5:15; Num. 7:13-86; 18:16).

Leviticus 27:25 – Every value is to be set according to the sanctuary shekel, …

In addition, 2 Samuel 14:26 shows that the weight standard for the shekel was set by the royal standard. No matter which era in history is studied, there existed a standard for the weight of precious metals.

Money was also used throughout the law. For example, God’s people gave money to support the tabernacle (Ex. 30:14-16; 38:24-31). There are many other examples that illustrate money’s place within the written law and indicate that money was indeed a part of everyday life. Exodus 35 provides such an example.

Exodus 35:5, 21-22 – From what you have, take an offering for the LORD. Everyone who is willing is to bring to the LORD an offering of gold, silver and bronze;

And there are many more examples to show that money was used for everyday transactions well before the Levitical tithe.

But you won't find ANY example in the scripture of anyone tithing from their income. Not even the farmers. The tithe came from ASSETS, not income.

By the way, being Spirit led, I find myself giving far more than a mere tenth of my income. Tithers seem to think the 90% is theirs to do with what they please. Not so. We are to be good stewards of 100% of what God gives to us. If you are Spirit led instead of blindly follow a false tithing doctrine, you may find that God wants you to give 20%, 30%, 50% or even more of your income.
 
So what if the economy was based mainly on agriculture. The farm workers didn't tithe, only the land owners tithed.
...

But you won't find ANY example in the scripture of anyone tithing from their income. Not even the farmers. The tithe came from ASSETS, not income.

Yeah. When the Torah was written, the near east was actually nearing the end of the late bronze age. If anyone wants to know what the late bronze age economy was like in the near east, information is easy to find. The majority of the people would have made their wage from field labour or crafting goods for trade.

The only time I can see where actual money is mentioned is in the Deuteronomy 14:22-27 tithe. That's the tithe where they bring a tenth of their grain, wine, oil and firstborn cattle to "the place which he shall choose, to cause his name to dwell there" (eventually, Jerusalem), and eat it themselves. If "the place" is far away, to avoid an overly cumbersome load, they are allowed to exchange these assets for money, take the money to "the place", and buy whatever they want to eat and drink with it. Either way, they don't give money, they just use money to buy food for themselves to eat.

I've done a bit of reading about whether the Rabbis had interpreted those tithing laws to extend to wage earners, but it doesn't seem like it they did. It does seem like all the OT tithes were for land owners only.

It's also interesting to note the multiple purposes of tithing in the OT. The priests did receive a portion from the people, but as Darby points out, "At any rate what characterises Deuteronomy is their enjoying God's goodness together, and making the poor enjoy it with them, Levites and strangers; while priests, though named, are on these points wholly ignored (see Deu_12:6-7; Deu_12:11-12; Deu_12:17-18; Deu_14:22-28). The priests' portion is in Deu_18:3-4. But firstlings and firstfruits in chapter 12 are not the same word; nor is Deu_14:23. But the whole tone of Deuteronomy is fellowship and enjoyment only before the Lord, not priestly or altar service."

I think that there is definitely a lot to learn from the OT tithing laws (for example, what can we learn from Deuteronomy 14:22-27?) but to say that "The Bible teaches that we must give 10% of our income to our church" is a misrepresentation of the OT tithing laws. The NT instructions on giving and generosity, as Gary points out, are much more challenging than the OT laws were, because they teach a worldview where we don't think of our money as "our money," but we live our lives in generosity, considering the needs of others before our own.

I know it can seem a bit silly to argue against the teaching of a "10% minimum tithe, given to your church" if we're also going to say that the NT teaching about tithing will probably lead us to give far more than 10% of our income. So, we can say that, for example, the early church didn't practice tithing (which they didn't). They practiced generosity, but they didn't practice a 10% minimum tithe. It seems like a trivial distinction, because don't they, in effect, amount to the same thing anyway?

I think it's an important distinction to make: correct teaching about tithing will probably be fairly important to people who've seen churches abuse tithing: false teaching inevitably leads to more false teaching. For example, if your church teaches a 10% tithe, people may be tempted to assume that the remaining 90%, as Gary points is, is theirs with which to do whatever they want. People may also assume that simply giving to support another person's ministry adequately fulfills their own responsibility to minister, which is common practice in our churches, but is not taught in the Bible. I've mentioned before that I've encountered a church that required its members to show their bank statements to the church to prove they were giving 10% to the church. This is an unscriptural practice that comes from a false teaching. Some churches teach that the congregation is "robbing God" if they don't give a minimum of 10% of their income to that church. People are less likely to be manipulated by false teaching if they know what the Bible actually teaches: that's why this is more than haggling over trivial semantics, it's really important.

Obviously, churches, especially if they have salaried staff and large assets like their own building/vehicles, need income to continue as they are. Instead of teaching that the Bible says a 10% minimum tithe given to the church is a commandment from God, just teach about living generous lives and supporting the ministry of the church. Offer courses teaching people how to be good stewards of their money. Just don't teach commandments that aren't actually taught in the Bible.
 
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Taking God at His word is a test of faith for many.

...

You obey or disobey

...

........it is therefore not a surprise that people do it to worm themselves out of the very laws of God that are meant to protect and prosper them.

Hey Merk, help me understand where you're coming from here. In another thread on the same topic, you wrote, "As for me? the commands of God are just that "commands"." Do you read the whole OT law as God's commands that we still need to try to fully follow?
 
The scripture to support that wage earners didn't tithe is merely God's tithing commands:

Leviticus 27:30-33 - notice the tithe comes from the seed (crops) and animals. Nothing about money or income.
Deut. 14:22-27 - notice the tithe comes from the seed (crops). Nothing about coming from income.
Deut. 14:28-29 - notice the tithe comes from the seed (crops). Nothing about money or income.

IF you add wages or income to God's commands you are ADDING TO HIS WORD.

Here are the scriptures you quoted as support for your statement: Nothing about money or income

22 "You shall truly tithe all the increase of your grain that the field produces year by year. 23 And you shall eat before the Lord your God, in the place where He chooses to make His name abide, the tithe of your grain and your new wine and your oil, of the firstborn of your herds and your flocks, that you may learn to fear the Lord your God always. 24 But if the journey is too long for you, so that you are not able to carry the tithe, or if the place where the Lord your God chooses to put His name is too far from you, when the Lord your God has blessed you, 25 then you shall exchange it for money, take the money in your hand, and go to the place which the Lord your God chooses. 26 And you shall spend that money for whatever your heart desires: for oxen or sheep, for wine or similar drink, for whatever your heart desires; you shall eat there before the Lord your God, and you shall rejoice, you and your household. 27 You shall not forsake the Levite who is within your gates, for he has no part nor inheritance with you. Deuteronomy 14:22-27

This scripture speaks of money, as well as the tithe to be eaten in the place where God chooses to put His Name [Jerusalem], by the one who tithes. This scripture does not mention "wage earners".

28 "At the end of every third year you shall bring out the tithe of your produce of that year and store it up within your gates. 29 And the Levite, because he has no portion nor inheritance with you, and the stranger and the fatherless and the widow who are within your gates, may come and eat and be satisfied, that the Lord your God may bless you in all the work of your hand which you do. Deuteronomy 14:28-29

This scripture speaks of the Levite, as well as the fatherless and the widow partaking of the tithe.

Today we are the priest's, so who would we tithe to?

30 And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land or of the fruit of the tree, is the Lord's. It is holy to the Lord. 31 If a man wants at all to redeem any of his tithes, he shall add one-fifth to it. 32 And concerning the tithe of the herd or the flock, of whatever passes under the rod, the tenth one shall be holy to the Lord. 33 He shall not inquire whether it is good or bad, nor shall he exchange it; and if he exchanges it at all, then both it and the one exchanged for it shall be holy; it shall not be redeemed.' " Leviticus 27:30-33


This scripture does not speak of any wage earners. Furthermore, this scripture speaks of redeeming the tithe, which means "buying back" for 20% more. This is referring to money.

I believe the Law of Moses was temporary, and was applicable to the Children of Israel for the Land of Promise which is the land of Israel.

Since to Seed has come, the Law of Moses is no longer in force.

I always am eager to learn about Kingdom Giving and the tithe as Abraham tithed 430 years before the Law.

The New Testament teaches us about giving, and especially Acts 4, teaches about everyone having what they need, which I believe came from business people who owned lands and had material wealth.

I believe the message of giving and tithing has been distorted by greedy misguided individuals who have financially "raped" the Church for their own gain.

Well balanced teaching is much needed today in the Church.

I hope to hear more from you on this subject.

I don't see the answer to my question in the scriptures you quoted.

Thanks, JLB
 
I don't see the answer to my question in the scriptures you quoted.

Thanks, JLB

Since you don't see wages mentioned in the scriptures for tithing, obviously wages have nothing to do with tithing. It's as simple as that. God defined His tithe in Leviticus 27:30-33. Wages don't fit the qualifications as to what is to be tithed.
 
Hey Merk, help me understand where you're coming from here. In another thread on the same topic, you wrote, "As for me? the commands of God are just that "commands"." Do you read the whole OT law as God's commands that we still need to try to fully follow?

Thanks Road for your reply/question.

My Pastor taught me that there 3 rules that must be applied when reading the bible:
In Context
In Context and
In Context.

For us to grasp the beauty of that book, you kind of have to read it cover to cover - a couple of times. I wish I could say I was one of those people who have read the bible for study purposes, well yes, I have studied it - but only to enrich my relationship with my God. To try and understand Him better. So I am not a scholar etc - I just want to please Him and draw close to Him.

When I say "As for me? the commands of God are just that "commands" of course I bear in mind the timeline of the bible. Which in my understanding (please im not a scholar) is:

1.Man sinned - and created a dilemma for God. By His nature and laws death must enter, but by His love He makes a plan.

3.God makes a backup plan as Man would have never been able to save himself anyways

4. The Plan was Christ

5. The old testament in the mean time (while Christ was coming) is/was a shadow of things yet to come. A set of guidelines for all to follow. (Believe me you need rules - try going on a diet without rules and eat what you want, we will see how far you will go. Even systems and processes in the human body need rules / order)

6. Christ appears in the New T and tears that veil once and for all.

7. His death deals a death knell once and for all in death's power. By His precious Blood we are saved from our sins and He mediates between God and Man - the only way through to God. His Blood literally limits the evil one from "having us" as it were.

Bearing the above in mind I can see that His plan was Love. And that the Holy Spirit, as our Helper, was sent to enable us to walk this walk. on our own - again, He knew we couldn't make it.

The New Testament fulfils the Law - it says somewhere in the bible. How is it then that, we sometimes believe by our actions (which speak louder than words by the way) - that we can omit out of the bible what we feel doesn't apply to us?

THE WHOLE BIBLE applies to you my dear. It applies to us all. Yes there is that dichotomy between laws we need to apply and those we don't etc. In reality - even Old T does say if you fail on one of these 10 commandments - you fail EVERYWHERE (hmmm, now why would God say this? - we need a revelation)

e.g. Laws like if you have mildew on your clothes and etc etc. Its too much. But this dichotomy is put to rest by the Death of Jesus Christ and His Holy Spirit!

Therefore, walking with God is a love walk. A love walk that still demands He remain Lord, that He is not only resident in your life, but PRESIDENT my dear!

How else can He be President, if you don't agree with what He says. If you have a 10 roomed house but God is only allowed in 3 rooms? He is limited to resident or room mate. I think you want Him in all your house.

You see, I have found, walking with God that each and everyone of our relationships with Him are personal. As different as we are all unique. Being the gentle God that He is, if you come to Him with ALL your heart, He corrects, chastises, cleans up and disciplines. At your own special rate, one area at a time. Only so you can move forward and grow and prosper. all the good things.

However, even though I am walking at such a place with God, it is not for me to impose my rules on people. I will however not sit back, and find excuses to worm myself out of His Word. Cause I know that if you read that thing cover to cover man! It is nothing but pure beauty. The Bible.

Give, and it shall be given unto you. Make Him Lord over your whooooooooooollllleeee life, and you will see wonders.

How else, can we manage to live in a fallen world, with mediocre Christians left right and centre. Expecting to raise the dead, expecting to heal the sick (ministries that Christ wants) expecting to heal broken marriages, broken businesses, with true undeniable power - by walking mediocre? By doing things how you want, by tithing when you feel like it?

The bible says, "let him who continues to do good do good, the one doing bad to do bad" - at the end of revelations. In Daniel it says "but YOU Daniel, continue to do good" to paraphrase. It is basically up to you, how you are going to live your life.

Those choices are down to you and God, we cant, no one can control. - Note even God.

BUTTTTT,

forget changing the lives of people to the level you were destined. Forget a heavy anointing, forget yes, even the "windows of heaven pouring forth so much blessings you can not hold".

Now God, remains faithful, as He can not deny Himself (timothy). He will provide for you, you are His baby. He will protect you. BUTTTT there will be a distinction. and you will suffer loss. "Test me in this".

We don't tithe to become millionaires billionaires (yes we can). He might provide more love in your marriage instead. He might provide health. He might provide security. He might provide anointing. All I know my dear, is that YOU WILL BE BLESSED.

If He provides that money, and you share it, and more keeps coming back to you. you are threatened to be trapped in a vicious cycle of more coming back to you and you giving away! What a great threat hey!

True Love, Tells the Truth.

Give it all to God. and You will see that taken at His Word - HE ALLLLWWAAAYYYS turns up.

We cant isolate one part of the bible, to suit us. Its all in context in context in context.

If its too hard, lets admit it. But lets not worm ourselves out of God's word because we find it too hard to follow.

By His Holy Spirit, His help You can do it. And the first no is the hardest. After that you get grace to fullfill His commands. But you must take the first step.

Nothing but Luv.

Mercedes Benz E Class.
 
We cant isolate one part of the bible, to suit us. Its all in context in context in context.

But lets not worm ourselves out of God's word because we find it too hard to follow.

I agree with those statements 100%.

As Gary demonstrates in his forum posts, the NT teachings about generosity are much, much harder to follow than the OT tithing laws would be. In actual practice, my personal experience is that I've seen a "10% minimum rule" being used by Christians to "worm their way out of" NT teaching about giving. For example, Christians may simply cut a cheque of 10% of their weekly income to their church, then consider their entire obligation to ministry and giving fulfilled for that week. I don't think that's an appropriate response to the NT teaching about giving. Even if you say "you can give more if you want, it's just that 10% is the minimum requirement," I can't see what in the Bible would lead us to the conclusion that if we give 10% of our income, we can be satisfied that we've met our obligation for that week. My understanding of Biblical teaching about giving, yes, in context of the whole Bible, is much, much harder to follow than a 10% minimum tithe.

If anyone says that the OT tithing laws don't apply now, and that means we don't have to be generous, I don't think they really have looked into the NT teaching about generous living. Similarly, if anyone says that all of the fairly complex OT tithing laws somehow now work out to give us a new commandment of a 10% tithe on our income which we are required to give to our church, and that means we can do whatever we want with 90% of our income, I don't think they really do understand the Bible in context.
 
Since you don't see wages mentioned in the scriptures for tithing, obviously wages have nothing to do with tithing. It's as simple as that. God defined His tithe in Leviticus 27:30-33. Wages don't fit the qualifications as to what is to be tithed.


Gary,

by your reasoning, that since God defined the tithe in this scripture, the only valid tithe is one that is given in Jerusalem, since He made allowes for it to be exchanged for money, if the trip is to long so the one titheing wouldn't be overburdend with herding and transporting animals that far.

This is the reason Jesus turned over the money tables in the Temple, because the Pharisee's made more money by setting up their "exchange tables" within the temple, taking the "money" in exchange for the required animal so the person that had traveled a long distance could exchange the money back for the proper animal to be sacrificed.

Most often the animals being sold back to the people were of very poor quailty, actually substandard for the required purpose of sacrificing.

So, this tithe that was given was to be enjoyed by the one who was tithing, and partaken of in Jerusalem, as it is written -

take the money in your hand, and go to the place which the Lord your God chooses. 26 And you shall spend that money for whatever your heart desires: for oxen or sheep, for wine or similar drink, for whatever your heart desires; you shall eat there before the Lord your God, and you shall rejoice, you and your household. Deuteronomy 14:25-26

This of course has no bearing on us today, as this law was given for the children of Israel, and it was for them and the Levites to be partaken of in Jerusalem.

How does this apply to us today?

JLB
 
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