Trials and Troubles more precious than gold

Fish Catcher Jim said:
So if you be a servant of God and are walking in the Blessing of the Lord and are very blessed it is wrong ? So only regular people can have nice things or tools for their trade ? Hey my frinds dad is a christian and he owns a trucking company and has more big trucks on the road then you would beleive and owns them all. Is He living wrong ?

Why is it if a pastor is blessed in ALL area's of his life it is a sin or he is bad ?
Please let me know how this works
Thaks KJ
Blessings
Jim
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Any Christian who buys a Ferrari, a mansion, a rolex etc when there are many Christians and unsaved that need transport, food and shelter is a Christians behind. There is no way around that.

Were you implying the opposite? Good business = live lavishly with money = acceptable Christianity?
 
KingJ said:
That you believe the underlined is rather disturbing.

The love of money is the root of much evil. A pastor should be extra mindful of stumbling his flock. A pastor that can afford a private jet should still fly economy class.

Titus 1:7 For an overseer, as God's steward, must be above reproach. He must not be arrogant or quick-tempered or a drunkard or violent or greedy for gain.

Heb 13:5 Keep your life free from love of money, and be content with what you have, for he has said, “I will never leave you nor forsake you.

Matt 16:24 No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and money.

Luke 12:33-34 Sell your possessions, and give to the needy. Provide yourselves with moneybags that do not grow old, with a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches and no moth destroys. For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.
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Your scriptural "support" does nothing to support you. what you are doing is judging the hearts of people who love God and have a good relationship with Him and are doing what they are called to do. There is no root of the love of money in them, but the love of serving their Father. It is perverse to bind up people who are free in Him to do with the resources he gives what they are led to do.

Ministries who have the resources to purchase their own transportation to serve God better in ministry, to be able to keep to His schedule and not an airline's schedule, are using their resources well, and are subject to the fierce criticism of those who are thinking carnally...but they do what God says, not men.
 
Euphemia said:
Your scriptural "support" does nothing to support you. what you are doing is judging the hearts of people who love God and have a good relationship with Him and are doing what they are called to do. There is no root of the love of money in them, but the love of serving their Father. It is perverse to bind up people who are free in Him to do with the resources he gives what they are led to do.

Ministries who have the resources to purchase their own transportation to serve God better in ministry, to be able to keep to His schedule and not an airline's schedule, are using their resources well, and are subject to the fierce criticism of those who are thinking carnally...but they do what God says, not men.
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Do you agree or disagree with this line by Jim regarding pastors spending money: ''it is no ones business other then Gods and his''?
 
KingJ said:
Do you agree or disagree with this line by Jim regarding pastors spending money: ''it is no ones business other then Gods and his''?
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I agree with it. It is no one's business what transpires between a man of God and His Lord concerning money. It's no one's business what he does with his finances. Making it your business makes you a busybody.
 
Euphemia said:
I agree with it. It is no one's business what transpires between a man of God and His Lord concerning money. It's no one's business what he does with his finances. Making it your business makes you a busybody.
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God forbid pastors are not accountable to their congregation!!

If a pastor has a carnal need to drive a flashy over priced car, I do not trust his spiritual leadership. You and Jim can. I can't. For me, modesty, no treasure on earth, pastor obligated to be a good ambassador is Christianity 101. Like I said, you and I must be reading different bibles.
 
KingJ said:
If a pastor has a carnal need to drive a flashy over priced car, I do not trust his spiritual leadership. You and Jim can. I can't. For me, modesty, no treasure on earth, pastor obligated to be a good ambassador is Christianity 101. Like I said, you and I must be reading different bibles.
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LOL! If I see a pastor in a rundown old jalopy, I figure his church doesn't care enough about him, and that he has a church full of misers. I would be embarrassed if my pastor didn't have a good car or a nice house to live in. The bible tells us to give those over us who lead well double honour---in other words, we are to pay them well!

1 Timothy 5:17-18
Elders who do their work well should be respected and paid well, especially those who work hard at both preaching and teaching. 18 For the Scripture says, “You must not muzzle an ox to keep it from eating as it treads out the grain.” And in another place, “Those who work deserve their pay!”
 
Euphemia said:
LOL! If I see a pastor in a rundown old jalopy, I figure his church doesn't care enough about him, and that he has a church full of misers. I would be embarrassed if my pastor didn't have a good car or a nice house to live in. The bible tells us to give those over us who lead well double honour---in other words, we are to pay them well!

1 Timothy 5:17-18
Elders who do their work well should be respected and paid well, especially those who work hard at both preaching and teaching. 18 For the Scripture says, “You must not muzzle an ox to keep it from eating as it treads out the grain.” And in another place, “Those who work deserve their pay!”
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1. It works both ways. The congregation are to support and the pastor is to lead by example

2. Tithing was 11 tribes supporting 1. So that the Levites would have 110% average income.
 
KingJ said:
1. It works both ways. The congregation are to support and the pastor is to lead by example.

2. Tithing was 11 tribes supporting 1. So that the Levites would have 110% average income.
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That's how it goes. So, what's your problem?
 
Euphemia said:
That's how it goes. So, what's your problem?
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1. That your idea of living by example is not making yourself the least / not pursuing desires of the flesh / carnal treasures :speechless:.

2. You said you agree with Jim saying pastors are beyond reproach.
 
KingJ said:
That you believe the underlined is rather disturbing.

The love of money is the root of much evil. A pastor should be extra mindful of stumbling his flock. A pastor that can afford a private jet should still fly economy class.

Titus 1:7 For an overseer, as God's steward, must be above reproach. He must not be arrogant or quick-tempered or a drunkard or violent or greedy for gain.

Heb 13:5 Keep your life free from love of money, and be content with what you have, for he has said, “I will never leave you nor forsake you.

Matt 16:24 No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and money.

Luke 12:33-34 Sell your possessions, and give to the needy. Provide yourselves with moneybags that do not grow old, with a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches and no moth destroys. For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.
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KJ in your thinking and belief I guess this all is good so you enjoy this and have fun with it,
Blessings
 
KingJ said:
That you believe the underlined is rather disturbing.

The love of money is the root of much evil. A pastor should be extra mindful of stumbling his flock. A pastor that can afford a private jet should still fly economy class.

Titus 1:7 For an overseer, as God's steward, must be above reproach. He must not be arrogant or quick-tempered or a drunkard or violent or greedy for gain.

Heb 13:5 Keep your life free from love of money, and be content with what you have, for he has said, “I will never leave you nor forsake you.

Matt 16:24 No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and money.

Luke 12:33-34 Sell your possessions, and give to the needy. Provide yourselves with moneybags that do not grow old, with a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches and no moth destroys. For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.
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KJ just to shed some light on this. One can take bits and pieces of scripture and use them to back any belief they have but it does not make it so.
 
KingJ said:
Any Christian who buys a Ferrari, a mansion, a rolex etc when there are many Christians and unsaved that need transport, food and shelter is a Christians behind. There is no way around that.

Were you implying the opposite? Good business = live lavishly with money = acceptable Christianity?
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KJ as simply put as I can........
If God bless's any of His children with anything nice no matter what it is...........what is it to you ? Your problem is you do not know anything about this and so you make up things as you go along. No pastor who GOD gives these things too has do9ne anything wrong and the pastor has given more away and sowed more then you have ever made in your entire life.
You tend to speak from your narrow minded views with out any true understanding of what you are talking about.
God Bless
 
Fish Catcher Jim said:
KJ as simply put as I can........
If God bless's any of His children with anything nice no matter what it is...........what is it to you ? Your problem is you do not know anything about this and so you make up things as you go along. No pastor who GOD gives these things too has do9ne anything wrong and the pastor has given more away and sowed more then you have ever made in your entire life.
You tend to speak from your narrow minded views with out any true understanding of what you are talking about.
God Bless
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Jim, he is saying that if this Christian BUYS these things. Buying is an active choice of the will. He is buying a Ferrari, Rolex or mansion for what reason? What could possibly be the reason other than to spend it on his lusts? Why didn't he buy a good decent car, watch, or house for a fraction of the cost and give the money he saved to those in need? That is selfish living. It makes no difference if this same man were a billionaire and gave 75% of it away to do good, he is still wasting the money given to him on frivolous extravagant luxuries.
 
Mykuhl said:
Jim, he is saying that if this Christian BUYS these things. Buying is an active choice of the will. He is buying a Ferrari, Rolex or mansion for what reason? What could possibly be the reason other than to spend it on his lusts? Why didn't he buy a good decent car, watch, or house for a fraction of the cost and give the money he saved to those in need? That is selfish living. It makes no difference if this same man were a billionaire and gave 75% of it away to do good, he is still wasting the money given to him on frivolous extravagant luxuries.
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Sorry Mykuhl this is where we part. That is not what kj is saying all together and you do not know what it is you are saying. Stop with this poverty mentality and yes that is how you are thinking.. Truth here all these ministries that have been accused of this in here and by the same in this thread have given more and give more every single day and to those places that have been brought up. Before you or any one boast of what they think you truly should seek God and what He says.
Blessings
 
Fish Catcher Jim said:
Sorry Mykuhl this is where we part. That is not what kj is saying all together and you do not know what it is you are saying. Stop with this poverty mentality and yes that is how you are thinking.. Truth here all these ministries that have been accused of this in here and by the same in this thread have given more and give more every single day and to those places that have been brought up. Before you or any one boast of what they think you truly should seek God and what He says.
Blessings
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Jim, it is not poverty mentality, I never said that anyone should live in rags, in a shack and with barely enough to eat so they can give more to the needy. BUT even if they did it would still be better than a rich person that wastes their wealth on luxurious living. And yes they would be wasting it by buying Ferraris, Rolexs and mansions. There are so many poor and needy people in this world that even if you were a billionaire and used all your money and resources to help them, you would not be able to help them all. That my friend is the point. Like I said it is a heart issue, nothing more, nothing less. You could have used that say $10,000,000 dollars you wasted on "living blessed by God"( from that Ferrari, Rolex and mansion)and used it to help countless more people. Boasting has nothing to do with it.
 
Mykuhl said:
Jim, it is not poverty mentality, I never said that anyone should live in rags, in a shack and with barely enough to eat so they can give more to the needy. BUT even if they did it would still be better than a rich person that wastes their wealth on luxurious living. And yes they would be wasting it by buying Ferraris, Rolexs and mansions. There are so many poor and needy people in this world that even if you were a billionaire and used all your money and resources to help them, you would not be able to help them all. That my friend is the point. Like I said it is a heart issue, nothing more, nothing less. You could have used that say $10,000,000 dollars you wasted on "living blessed by God"( from that Ferrari, Rolex and mansion)and used it to help countless more people. Boasting has nothing to do with it.
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Mykuhl you still do not get it. First of all poverty mentality does not mean rags and shacks but it does mean oh I should drive this less of a car and not the one I truly enjoy for I have to be modest because I am a christian.....That is poverty mentality.

Again you over look the simple things here Mykuhl. You ASSUME that the person with the big house and fancy car has not given to the Lord. Now if you were thinking clearly on this you would grasp that as this person gave God gave back in many different ways. This person gives more and more and God gives them seed to give and bread to eat.

If you desire a 500 dollar car over a 50,000 dollar car that is between you and God but you need to maker sure it is what you really wanted and not what you "think" you should have.

I know a man of God who has a handful of jets. God gives therm to Him and he gives some away and lends them but He uses them to do what God called him to do. Now then this man of God has out reach ministries in more countries then you know and his ministries give more then you have ever seen before. He takes nothing for himself from the church and what the members and partners give goes right back into the work of God after it is tithed on.

You seem to looking at this from the natural and not at all from the spiritual side in which God is directing. God has no problem with a janitor having a jet or the guy who sweeps the front porch of the church driving there in a brand new BMW or what have you. What GOD calls you to do is not a reflection on how you can live in Him.

To claim this man could have had a five and dime watch and drove a normal car and given money to those in need shows that you simply do not have an understanding about thee blessing of thee Lord or how it works. You assume this man is selfish and spending things on his own pleasure. Well if a child of God enjoys or takes pleasure in a fancy car and they believe God for it and walk according to His ways and God gives it to them. They would be selfish to drive it ? Get real Mykuhl.....That does not even make sense.

Have a great day
Jim
 
I know an evangelist from India who has several top designer name brand suits. He never bought one of them. A millionaire bought them for him. So we need to keep our nose out of the business of people in the ministry, because what we see is more often than not the case, and one brings down the Lord's displeasure in being critical about fellow believers, and spiritual leaders who are living and working under the anointing of God.

Psalm 105:15
Saying, Touch not My anointed, and do My prophets no harm.
 
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