‘Store’ a reward in heaven?
Okeedoke, thanks for your definition.
What Law is Valid for Today?
- Thread starter Musicmaster
- Start date
Okeedoke, thanks for your definition.
You know......place something on a shelf in the back room of a STORE.
You mean like 'peanuts from the peanut gallery'? lol
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Exactly!
There are various realms of thought about Torah. One of the main systems of thought is that by observing the feasts, holy days, sabbaths, kosher diet, etc., that doing so is how one allegedly shows their love for God, even though being in Christ, there is no condemnation. This idea that God needs us living out those Mosaic Law items in our lives, what does that actually accomplish for the Lord?
I think that one of the flaws in that system of thought is that none of it adds a single shred of righteousness in one's life, which we know cannot be earned by works and observances. The moral Law written upon our hearts is how the Lord instills within us His moral absolutes. The idea that He needs us "doing" these things, it just runs rampant in legalism. None of the things we may "do" can possibly add to the "cattle on a thousand hills" the Lord possesses, nor to one's value in the eyes of the Lord.
I think that one of the flaws in that system of thought is that none of it adds a single shred of righteousness in one's life, which we know cannot be earned by works and observances. The moral Law written upon our hearts is how the Lord instills within us His moral absolutes. The idea that He needs us "doing" these things, it just runs rampant in legalism. None of the things we may "do" can possibly add to the "cattle on a thousand hills" the Lord possesses, nor to one's value in the eyes of the Lord.
Another thought that struck this morning is, going back in history, Luther spent hours and hours in confessionals before he found salvation through faith in Christ, and none of that gained anything for him. Not one thing at all. Some of the monks crawled around cities on their bloody knees while flogging themselves with whips, and they had the admiration of the people, but the admiration of the One where it truly mattered...they gained nothing! The same goes for us today.
Here's the thing...were we to be taken up in the spirit as was John, the experience of beholding the glorious righteousness of the Lord would indeed solidify in the observer just how filthy ALL our seemingly righteousness deeds really are by comparison. The observer would return back here, look at themselves and all that they might try to accomplish through works, and see just how inadequate it all is. Luther would then have stopped crawling around the city, and he would have stopped wasting his time in confessionals, and fall down on his face in helpless surrender to the righteousness of God imputed upon him by no merit from himself. The same applies to us all.
To the legalist, this all sounds like blasphemous heresy. The legalist sees our refusing to even try to earn God's pleasure through fleshly works of the Mosaic Law, to them, it's a hatred of the Law, and therefore a denial of the Lord. Do you see how insidious it can get? Some of them even go so far as to claim that we don't believe in the moral absolutes of the Las of God, even though Jesus demonstrated the how even the Mosaic Law failed to show that even our inner motives can make us guilty of sins that we never physically committed.
The video above pointed out another really good point: We can just picture the Torah-follower praying, and looking over at another man confessing his sins simply, from the heart, without any self-appointed merit for works of the Law at which he may point, and say, "Lord, I thank you that you didn't make me like that non-works-based, grace and faith alone sinner over there..."
MM
Here's the thing...were we to be taken up in the spirit as was John, the experience of beholding the glorious righteousness of the Lord would indeed solidify in the observer just how filthy ALL our seemingly righteousness deeds really are by comparison. The observer would return back here, look at themselves and all that they might try to accomplish through works, and see just how inadequate it all is. Luther would then have stopped crawling around the city, and he would have stopped wasting his time in confessionals, and fall down on his face in helpless surrender to the righteousness of God imputed upon him by no merit from himself. The same applies to us all.
To the legalist, this all sounds like blasphemous heresy. The legalist sees our refusing to even try to earn God's pleasure through fleshly works of the Mosaic Law, to them, it's a hatred of the Law, and therefore a denial of the Lord. Do you see how insidious it can get? Some of them even go so far as to claim that we don't believe in the moral absolutes of the Las of God, even though Jesus demonstrated the how even the Mosaic Law failed to show that even our inner motives can make us guilty of sins that we never physically committed.
The video above pointed out another really good point: We can just picture the Torah-follower praying, and looking over at another man confessing his sins simply, from the heart, without any self-appointed merit for works of the Law at which he may point, and say, "Lord, I thank you that you didn't make me like that non-works-based, grace and faith alone sinner over there..."
MM
In my experience with Torah observers, the Law is held higher than the Gospel, Moses over Abraham and Paul is belittled (forgive the pun).
Some groupings actually see Paul as a renegade, and therefore not a genuine Apostle, even though Peter and the entire apostolic council in Jerusalem recognized him as being among their number. Paul dealt with doubts about his apostleship in his day, and so I'm not surprised that same spirit of the devil is around today.
MM
I always find this passage á propose for Paul deniers...
2 Peter 3:15-16 LSB
and consider the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you, [16] as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.
It also works on the RLOC (Red Letter Only Christians).
“Law demands – grace gives.
Law says “do” – grace says “believe.”
Law exacts – grace bestows.
Law says “work” – grace says “rest.”
Law threatens, pronouncing a curse – grace entreats, pronouncing a blessing.
Law says “Do, and thou shalt live” – grace says, “Live, and thou shalt do.”
Law condemns the best man – grace saves the worst man.”
— J. Vernon McGee
Law says “do” – grace says “believe.”
Law exacts – grace bestows.
Law says “work” – grace says “rest.”
Law threatens, pronouncing a curse – grace entreats, pronouncing a blessing.
Law says “Do, and thou shalt live” – grace says, “Live, and thou shalt do.”
Law condemns the best man – grace saves the worst man.”
— J. Vernon McGee
Romans 3:20 NKJV
Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
1 Corinthians 15:56 NKJV
The sting of death is sin, and the strength of sin is the law. (see Roman's 7)
Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
1 Corinthians 15:56 NKJV
The sting of death is sin, and the strength of sin is the law. (see Roman's 7)
Romans 7:12
King James Version
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
Does anyone else here keep slipping back on the law?
I do… it just seems like a habit that’s hard to break!
I gotta do this, (or you gotta do this) I must do that…(or you need to do that) I need to be this, (you need to be this) I have to! Etc…
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Good job we got the Spirit to guide us back
I do… it just seems like a habit that’s hard to break!
I gotta do this, (or you gotta do this) I must do that…(or you need to do that) I need to be this, (you need to be this) I have to! Etc…
Edit for other.
Good job we got the Spirit to guide us back
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the law is a part of our life and we all want to do our best but fail. the law tells us what sin is. Romans 8:1-12Does anyone else here keep slipping back on the law?
I do… it just seems like a habit that’s hard to break!
I gotta do this, (or you gotta do this) I must do that…(or you need to do that) I need to be this, (you need to be this) I have to! Etc…
Edit for other.
Good job we got the Spirit to guide us back
Does anyone else here keep slipping back on the law?
I do… it just seems like a habit that’s hard to break!
I gotta do this, (or you gotta do this) I must do that…(or you need to do that) I need to be this, (you need to be this) I have to! Etc…
Edit for other.
Good job we got the Spirit to guide us back
It's always easier to apply the Law to all others than to ourselves. I don't do either because I know there's no benefit trying to live the Mosaic Law. It's a dead end, and a curse....although a perfect one....
MM