Speaking In Tongues
- Thread starter Silk
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MichaelH
Inactive
Well........................ The role of lest there be one known to interpret would be as the Holy Spirit distributes gifts in a "CHURCH" setting. I have never run into anyone who just took request. Paul said he prays and prays with his own understanding so anyone praying in tongues would be able to ask the Lord for interpretation. In a church setting it comes out as Prophecy so that others may also be edified if tongues are allowed that is.
It's sort of like those that claim to interpet dreams for people, your going to get off in to la la land because Jesus said I'll show you plainly of the Father and no more speak in parables so anyone that needs a dream interpreted needs to just forget it as the Lord is more than able to clearly get something across to us. There would be no reason for him not to if He is trying to tell us something.
As you Mature though, you should not care if your tongues are interpreted. Forcing an interpretation will cause error.
I have never been used much in this but I did hear the Lord speaking in this song sung in tongues.
Song by Nicole Fujan sung in tongues.
If anyone like to speak with Nicole then I'll give you her contact info. She just signed a recording contract today, praise God.
MichaelH
Inactive
I can assure you Nicole sung that completely in tongues, In fact she came over and I helped her put the video together after her Recording session in Champaign IL. (why she traveled 8 hours to use a studio when Branson has studios is a mystery to me)
After she finally got the video together we joined and they let me just pray in tongues by which I got a prophecy that I had up on my web site but taken it down and not got around to putting it up again. It had nothing to do with the video though.
Before she told me I told her to play the song And I heard the Lord like water in 3 layers saying different things in each layer. Thank you Holy Spirit for making it clear but there was more in there are I got part.
If you want to Read what Nicole said about it you can read it here.
If you want to speak with her about it, I can fix that also. It's not my video so I really don't want to comment much on it. It's best to ask her.
http://www.forum.mikecarolhelmickministries.org/index.php/topic,65.0.html
MichaelH
Inactive
Silk, If it was not in tongues, it would be in English. I speak in tongues, and know for a fact the song is in tongues, I have heard her sing in tongues more than once. Listen and ask the Lord what the song is about, don't rely on someone that claims they know. I have been around this stuff for years and I would not mislead you.
All I can say is you were told wrong. I am not saying the person is not trying to mean well, but meaning well does not make us right. I have known Nicole for years and she was just on Shine in Florida and out of 800 some people she has agents calling her back. She would do nothing fake.
Several people picked up on some of the interpretation. She is on the phone with the wife now, so best I just put you in contact with her before she gets to famous to meddle with us simple folk and you can ask her yourself.
Now if I did not trust you, I would not offer to put you in touch with her, but your being told wrong and people just can't choose when they interpret any tongue. It's as the Spirit wills and only mentioned by Paul for a Church type setting to keep things decent and in order because everyone just speaking in tongues don't help things much.
Also if you want prayer with someone to understand and receive the gift yourself, she would be someone to speak to.
MichaelH
Inactive
https://www.facebook.com/nicole.fujan
She said go to her facebook page. Leave a private message. Tell her that you spoke with me....... Mike about her video and she would be more than happy to speak with you. If you get her number I trust you would not give it out. She said she would be more than happy to help you with the gift or understanding.
She is lot less grumpy than I am...........
She said go to her facebook page. Leave a private message. Tell her that you spoke with me....... Mike about her video and she would be more than happy to speak with you. If you get her number I trust you would not give it out. She said she would be more than happy to help you with the gift or understanding.
She is lot less grumpy than I am...........
MichaelH
Inactive
Silk, as long as they are Female. You have to understand I would not put you in touch with just a male you never met. She is married and is very busy, but we worked together in the past doing ministry. You are also free to speak with her about these things.
We can talk scripture all day and you will find a different view from those that speak in tongues as to those that don't. Those that don't seem to think they know more about it for some odd reason.
It's best to speak with another women about how it effects their life and what God has done through the gift.
Tongues is the only gift that it is for us to speak to God and get edified with. It's not a gift God uses at his will through us to help someone else. There fore its a gift that is available to every believer because it changes your prayer time and effect dramatically. All the other gifts we can't force, but they just come as the Spirit wills to help others.
This is why there are so many bad prophecies because people force things, and it got so bad in Paul's time that Paul had to say. Despise not prophecy but prove all things and hold to that which is true. All prophecy needs judged by 2-3 wittiness, and interpretation of Tongues comes out as prophecy.
God said if you seek, you will find. May not seem like it, may take awhile but God always keeps his word, you will find.
Blessings.
Good luck Silk on your thread. Just be prepared when it heats up. This one is a lot like the Genesis 6 thread. It prompts heated responses because everyone thinks that they are right.
But my brother.........that is not what the Scripture say now is it?
I love ya man, but you have been a stickler for what the Bibles and only the Bible says and I am in your corner, But when Paul gives the corrections to the church in Corinth, he says specifically that tongues must be interpreted.
1 Corth. 14:13
"Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret."
How can we move away from such clear directions. Then consider that women are not to speak in tongues in church at all.
1 Corth. 14:34
"Let your WOMEN KEEP SILENCE in the churches for it is not permitted unto them to speak..............."
Verse 34 is about "speaking in tongues" as that is the context of chapter 14 beginning at verse #2.
Every church I have attended that allowed the speaking in tongues, it has always been the women who do it.
How then do we reconcile the clear and direct direction given in the Word of God on this subject and why would Paul give such directions to us????
Really????
Do you care to share your view now?
I will check out your answer tomorrow. My wife and I have a big day tomorrow. One of our children's birthday and we are having a BBQ and get together so we need to get some rest.
In the past, as you know, I have felt that some people use the "speaking in tongues" as a kind of point, that they are somehow closer to the Lord. And those who don't do it are not "really" filled with the Holy Spirit. I still think a translator is needed but MichaelH seems to understand, if not at the time, then after he has spoken in tongues, what is being said. I have never heard singing in tongues before last night and while I found the sounds lovely and haunting, I got no clarification nor did the translator. I must have read the wrong part of the link given for the translation but Michael clarified it for me and it is a message I have long known. I should let him explain that.
MichaelH
Inactive
You know, I am 100% scripture only. Not that I am perfect at it, by far as there is much I don't know. What is the issue though? If Tongues must be interpreted then we have to force God to do that every time someone speaks in tongues. The interpretation part is the edification of the Church part. That is a gift from one by the Holy Spirit to help someone else.
I am not sure what your saying Major. Everything must be done decent and in Order. That was the whole message to the Church. Tongues was the one gift everyone got because of the filling of the Holy Spirit, so Tongues was the problem gift because it is as we will with the Help of the Holy Spirit and not as the Spirit wills. So everyone wanted to show off their gift at the same time.
What did Paul say?
Let them speak by 2 or 3 if there be a known interpreter. Someone used by God constantly that has interpreted. At the most 3 Paul said. Each takes a turn by course and one be there known to interpret.
The interpreter has to have the words that come to them by the Holy Spirit, they just can't do this on their own and not every tongues gets interpreter. It just comes to them, it's hard to explain unless God has used you to do this. It does not mean you can decided to interpret every single tongue. It's as the Spirit gives it to you.
Much like God talking to you and you get a revelation of something. Sort of like that.
Does that mean we don't pray in tongues without an interpreter?
In church yes. We just don't start speaking in tongues in the middle of Church service. In fact we follow the lead of the Pastor, He is in charge of service and most services have ZERO tongues going on at any time.
Most the folks I go to church with speak in tongues. You would be hard pressed to hear it one time though during any service. In fact you won't hear it at all. It's not part of the program.
1Co 14:28 But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.
If there is no tongues going on at church, or part of the program then we are told let them Speak to himself and to God. Tongues edify us, and it's speaking mysteries to God. So that means we don't speak tongues in church, but by ourselves is fine.
Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.
(1Co 14:13-15)
Here Paul gives a bit of different direction. Someone that speaks in tongues, let HIM pray that he may interpret.
This is where you don't need someone to interpret, but you pray for it after speaking.
Paul said if my Spirit prays his understanding is unfruitful. So praying in the Spirit is praying in tongues. Paul said he will also pray with understanding also. So Paul prays in his known language and prays in tongues. The Holy Spirit Helps us.
But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it. Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
(Rom 8:25-27)
Here is more praying in the Spirit. Tongues is used to pray for things we don't know about. We don't know all situations about all things, we might know some surface issues but we don't see roots. We would use tongues here in our own prayer time.
Remember, Paul said Praying in the Spirit is praying in tongues. So tongues would be a very important gift for all believers to use. Prayer is important.
Blessings.
Mike, when we read your quote from 1 Corth 14:
"? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also."
Are you saying that "praying with the Spirit is the say meaning as praying in a tongue?
You see, the direction Paul gives in 1 Corth. 14:2 is for a reason. An unknown language in church must be translated. It is not a though or an idea, but instead is an absolute directive from Paul himself as he spoke several languages himself. He understood the need to be understood.
WHY is that the case. The Jews made up the early church and came together with many languages among themselves, It was important to be understood so that the church COULD BR EDIFIED.
WHY is that important????????
1 Corinthians 14:22-23
"Wherefore tongues are for a sign not to them that believe but to them that believe not, but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not but for them that believe.
If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues and there come in those that are unlearned or unbelievers, will they not say that you are mad".
Do we not see this???
These verses are very clear and they are a general guide to be used by all. IF an unbeliever should visit a church where tongues are being exercised without being translated, the result is that the unbeliever will leave the church the same way he came in........
LOST.
Now we must ask ourselves.......what is the will of God???????????
God’s first priority is to glorify himself through man’s deliverance from the condemnation of sin. He wants everybody to be saved, and he says so several times. He says, for example, that he “will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.” He says also that he is “not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.” And he says that he “sent his Son into the world to seek and to save the lost.”
MichaelH
Inactive
Major, I have no idea what your trying to tell me Brother. I did not say Praying in Tongues is praying in the spirit. Paul said that.
Praying in the Holy Ghost could be tongues, it's praying in the spirit, but more important "With" the spirit, that is what tongues is. It is a spiritual gift and Paul called it praying.
Rome 8 literally says the Holy Spirit takes up with us, together, Against. According to the perfect will of God for the saints. Anything to hinder, hurt, the Holy Spirit prays with/ and gives with to help. Paul said I will pray with the spirit. Spirit may mean with my new born again human spirit with the help of the Holy Spirit, it may mean with the Holy Spirit, but both are involved.
Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.
(1Co 14:13-15)
Tongues have nothing to do with man made language, though tongues can be in someones understood language. Tongues by the Holy Spirit is not a man made language but Paul called it the language of Angles, and speaking mysteries to God. Tongues can be in a known language.
You just can't interpret tongues without the Holy Spirit.
Tongues is a powerful Prayer language to God while sitting at home, you can pray in tongues all day at home. Interpretation is different because the operation is different. When praying in tongues your moving things that are not just words, things change according to the will of God. You will get that unction when months later to know you prayed in tongues about something as it happens. You just know.
Tongues in church does not edify, and why Paul gave instruction concerning saying I wish you all spoke in tongues, but there is something better. Prophecy.
Prophecy is inspired utterance that is in a known language. Though Paul said I rather you give prophecy, that is not as we want to also. Tongues is us speaking with the Holy Spirit. Prophecy is God speaking to us and we giving the message.
I have been praying in tongues for over 16 years, it's a spiritual thing and all I can do is show scripture. It is not natural at all, it's a real spiritual gift for every believer. I would not mislead you, but it best if you see this and get this from God for yourself. If you could not have it, then I would not say so. I have yet seen one person who honestly went to receive this not get this because it's prayer for us and a tool from God to his body to help.
Blessing Silk......................... What is proof you have the Holy Spirit filled with Power? I already wrote you about that in a P.M.
It's the same proof everyone gets when they go to the Alter and give their life to Jesus. You don't get trumpets or a greeting card from heaven or some reward to post on your wall. I use to say that you would speak in tongues, but the Lord corrected me on that and that is not the answer.
Faith is the Substance of things Hoped for................... It is evidence................ Evidence of something you can't see. Substance and Evidence before you physically sense a thing. That means it's just as yours and real as if you held it in your hand.
Jesus said believe you have it, then you get it...................... If I waited to speak in tongues for proof of anything then I am going against what Jesus said. (Mark 11:24) If I waited on proof of making Jesus Lord of my life, I would never believe I got born again.
Luk 11:13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
The condition is that God be your Father, and you just ask............. How much more will you not be given the Holy Spirit with Power.
How would you know you are filled with the Holy Spirit? Jesus said it was because you asked. How do you know you were born again, Scripture says because you believed in your heart and confessed with your mouth.
How do you know God gave you the Holy Spirit when you asked? Because you believed in your heart and confessed with your mouth I am now filled with the Holy Spirit because Jesus said if I asked, then My Father would give him to me.
How do you know if you speak in tongues? Jesus said if you believe on me, these signs will follow. It's already there if you met those conditions and so easy to receive.
Its the Person that will just believe what God said, that is the one God moves mountains and makes it good in their life for the Lord went about confirming HIS word with signs following.
So I can say I speak in tongues, I can pray now in a more dynamic and effective way because Jesus said if I believe on Him, it's mine and a sign that will follow me. I can say that even though I never spoke in tongues because the Word is more true than what I have yet experienced.
My story about how I received this is along these lines. I had to get out of waiting for proof and believing what God said. I am Glad did it this way because it taught me about faith a bit.
You, I think, misunderstood me. We all, who believe, have personal confirmation of the Truth. I am only saying it varies from person to person. I use the term "proof" only to the individual and how they follow the right path. I can accept that this is why people who speak in tongues are so joyful. It may come off as "prideful" to those who don't. It is hard to understand the function of people speaking what seems like no sense and not even the speaker understands. God already understands what we are praying to Him, whatever our language.
MichaelH
Inactive
Well, the only proof would be what I gave. It has nothing to do with actually speaking in tongues, Jesus already said those that believe on me shall speak in new tongues. That is already a fact and proof. Now to get your head in line with that as with everything else God said in the Word.
tongues edify ourselves and build up our most holy faith (Jude I think) So it figures people that pray in tongues are anointed and full of Joy.
We have prayer on WED so we pray in English then everyone prays in tongues. Friday and Sunday service you won't hear tongues at all. That is what we do, so it depends on the Church as long as things are not confusing. I don't like coming into a church with people all over the floor and hanging off the rafters. Some like that, not my cup of tea.