The judgment seat of Christ: Dividing wheat from tares by works.

[Godhelpus]

My dear friend.......NO one has to agree with me on anything whatsoever.

This is now my 4th time asking you to shorten up your posts to "me" if you want me to respond. I have some health issues that just do not allow me to read all that well now after surgery, but you do not seem to able to do that.

Yes, of course. Forgive me, and I understand. My manner is to address any and every point someone takes time to write to me. That's not just a courtesy, but also to make sure I am not misreading someone.

I believe your definition of who is a believer and Christian, or not, is according to their manner of life. If someone is living like the devil, then you say they are not a believer nor Christian at all.

My definition of who is to be called a believer and Christian, or not, is only by confessing faith in Christ, or not. I give Scripture saying so. No Scripture ever calls anyone confessing faith in Christ, a non-believer or non-Christian, no matter what manner of life they may be living at the time.

Therefore, all Christians appearing at His judgment seat, include all people confessing faith in Him. Whether they are living worthy of His name, or not, is only judged by Jesus Christ from His Bema seat.

2Co 5:9Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ;

 

[Godhelpus]

I think you misunderstand the context of the verse. He was warning believers that they would suffer trials (v.12).

True. The context is about suffering as a Christian. Which means any suffering spoken of, is by Christians, not non-Christians. In 1 Peter 4, all are called Christians, whether suffering for doing evil, or for doing good.

Not that they are actively murderers and thieves but not to be accused or found guilty as such.

First of all. Let me thank you for addressing this verse, to try and correct my reading of it. However, I'm not sure what you mean here.

Are you saying Christians shouldn't 'get caught' doing evil? You're not suggesting that we shouldn't do evil, but if we do, just don't get accused and found guilty of it? We should be smart thieves?

Or, are you saying that Peter is referring to Christians falsely accused of doing evil?

1Pe 4:15 But let none of you suffer as a 'falsely accused' murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters.

The problem with this, if it's your point, is that we would be told not so suffer from false accusation of evil doing. Because that is exactly what Christ Himself suffered from, when falsely accused of doing evil by blasphemy:

Mar 14:64Ye have heard the blasphemy: what think ye? And they all condemned him to be guilty of death.

It can't be that 1 Peter 4 is forbidding Christians not suffer by false accusations, because then we are forbidden to suffer as Christ Himself suffered. Which is what we are supposed to do for His name's sake:

Rom 8:17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

1Pe 4:15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters. Yet if any man suffer as a 'falsely accused' Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.

Peter is simply confirming what he says before in chapters 2 and 3, that Christians should never suffer for doing evil, but only for righteousness' sake:

1Pe 3:13 And who is he that will harm you, if ye be followers of that which is good. But and if ye suffer for righteousness' sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled;

1Pe 2:20 For what glory is it, if, when ye be buffeted for your faults, ye shall take it patiently? but if, when ye do well, and suffer for it, ye take it patiently, this is acceptable with God.

And if we do suffer just punishment patiently, then we still don't being glory to God.

Yet, if you find yourself before the authorities, for the offense of claiming Christ, do not be ashamed.

Exactly. No Christian should be ashamed for suffering persecution as a Christian. But, Christians suffering for evil doing, ought be ashamed, just like any other evil-doer suffering just punishment.

 

[cocoa]

Are you saying Christians shouldn't 'get caught' doing evil? You're not suggesting that we shouldn't do evil, but if we do, just don't get accused and found guilty of it? We should be smart thieves?

No, it would be ridiculous to suggest that the verse is saying "don't get caught". I think Petet is just referencing the some of the maladies of the surrounding culture. Encouraging them not to engage in such behaviors.
Like the Israelites were warned not to participate in the surrounding pagan culture in the OT.

 

[Major]

Yes, of course. Forgive me, and I understand. My manner is to address any and every point someone takes time to write to me. That's not just a courtesy, but also to make sure I am not misreading someone.

I believe your definition of who is a believer and Christian, or not, is according to their manner of life. If someone is living like the devil, then you say they are not a believer nor Christian at all.

My definition of who is to be called a believer and Christian, or not, is only by confessing faith in Christ, or not. I give Scripture saying so. No Scripture ever calls anyone confessing faith in Christ, a non-believer or non-Christian, no matter what manner of life they may be living at the time.

Therefore, all Christians appearing at His judgment seat, include all people confessing faith in Him. Whether they are living worthy of His name, or not, is only judged by Jesus Christ from His Bema seat.

2Co 5:9Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ;

The problem here is the definition of who said what.

You said...........
" If someone is living like the devil, then you say they are not a believer nor Christian at all."

No Sir.....I did not say that. What God said in Matthew 7:22-23..............
"On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then I will declare to them, I never knew you, depart from me you workers of iniquity."

I have NO idea how this can be confused! These people who SAID they were Christians are not Christians because God said so. They will not be at the Bema Seat Judgment!

But who are these people and how can they do miracles unless they are doing them by God’s power?
#1. We know there are a lot of them, because it is many who are on the broad road to eternal death.
#2. They claim the name of Christ. These are not Muslims, Buddhists, or atheists. These are those who would gladly say, “I am a Christian.” They work their works in Jesus’ name. They pray and heal in Jesus’ name. They preach and teach in Jesus’ name. They build huge churches and ministries in Jesus’ name. They claim a relationship with Him. But they are none of His. In fact, He sends them away, not with commendation for their good works in His name (and many good works are done in Jesus’ name by false professors), but by disowning their every deed and word. He “never” knew them, nor did they ever truly know Him. They weren’t Christians who lost their salvation. They were never part of the elect of God, chosen before the foundation of the world set apart and sanctified by the Spirit and justified by faith. The ones Christ puts away from Himself with harsh words of condemnation, calling them doers of evil, never came to Him in faith, despite their outward good works and miracles.

That is who I am referring to!

You said.................
"Therefore, all Christians appearing at His judgment seat, include all people confessing faith in Him."

Brother, you are proposing a teaching that is diametrically opposed to the Words of God.

 

[bobinfaith]

No, it would be ridiculous to suggest that the verse is saying "don't get caught". I think Peter is just referencing some of the maladies of the surrounding culture. Encouraging them not to engage in such behaviors. Like the Israelites were warned not to participate in the surrounding pagan culture in the OT.

Good morning, cocoa;

Well said.

 

[crossnote]

These are those who would gladly say, “I am a Christian.” They work their works in Jesus’ name. They pray and heal in Jesus’ name. They preach and teach in Jesus’ name. They build huge churches and ministries in Jesus’ name. They claim a relationship with Him. But they are none of His.

Aren't these who establish their own righteousness, all the while rejecting the righteousness of Christ, even though they profess His name, saying "Lord, Lord"? (e.g. Rom 10:3)

 

[Godhelpus]

So then, I will respond to your 1st question........."Then who does the Scriptures say are Christians? They were first called Christians in Antioch. Why?"

In Acts 11:26.......
"So for a whole year Barnabas and Saul met with the church and taught great numbers of people. The disciples were called Christians first at Antioch."

"Were called" in the Greek is a derogatory phrase used by the Gentiles as a insult, like the use of Moonies today.

More like Jesus-lovers.

Act 26:28 Then Agrippa said unto Paul, Almost thou persuadest me to be a Christian.

And then, Christians became the acknowledged name of all those naming Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior.

Just as a note, the disciples never use the phrase themselves. They keep to such terms as the “brethren” (Acts 15:1), and the “saints” (Acts 9:13), and “those of the way” (Acts 9:2).

Not true.

1Pe 4:15But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters. Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.
The Lord Himself made the name Christian, special to His believers.

But the point remains the same, whether the name Christian was first used derogatively, or not. All believers in Christ confessing faith in Him, are called by God, Christians. And all Christians shall appear at His judgment seat, whether naming Him from the heart, or only with the lips.

Mat 15:8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.

 

[Godhelpus]

It seems to me that the OP has placed a lot of stock for his argument on Romans 10:9, but has neglected to consider the ramifications of Romans 10:10 which blows his argument that everyone who confesses Christ with their mouth is a Christian.

Not necessarily, since verse 9 also needs the confession to be from the heart:

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

So then, I will respond to your 1st question........."Then who does the Scriptures say are Christians? They were first called Christians in Antioch. Why?" In Acts 11:26......."So for a whole year Barnabas and Saul met with the church and taught great numbers of people. The disciples were called Christians first at Antioch."

"Were called" in the Greek is a derogatory phrase used by the Gentiles as a insult, like the use of Moonies today.

More like derogatively used for Jesus-lovers today.

Act 26:28 Then Agrippa said unto Paul, Almost thou persuadest me to be a Christian.

And then, Christians became the acknowledged name of all those naming Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. Without being derogatory.


And finally in Scripture, Christians has become the name called by the Lord Himself.

Just as a note, the disciples never use the phrase themselves. They keep to such terms as the “brethren” (Acts 15:1), and the “saints” (Acts 9:13), and “those of the way” (Acts 9:2).

Not true. Since verse 9 establishes the confession must be from the heart.

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

No one has said that confession with the mouth alone saves the soul. That's not the question at hand, pertaining to who appears at the judgment seat of Christ.

1Pe 4:15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters. Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.

The same can possibly be said for 'Jews', since it's first used in the bad light of being driven out by heathen.

2Ki 16:6 At that time Rezin king of Syria recovered Elath to Syria, and drave the Jews from Elath: and the Syrians came to Elath, and dwelt there unto this day.

As far as orthodox theology is concerned, only people who are saved can be genuinely called Christians, not just professors of Christ, but possessors of Christ.

And yet, we have Scripture calling them Christians too.

1Pe 4:15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters. Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.

By Scripture all Christians can agree, that everyone called a Christian is not living the Christian life. But neither Scripture nor all Christians agree, that they ought not be called Christian.

Therefore, strictly for appearing at the judgment seat of Christ, it is only a matter of who is called a Christian by the Lord, when He has all Christians appear before Him.

As an aside, according to Scripture, I can call anyone confessing faith in Christ, a Christian and a brother. But that does not mean I have to. It only means that I ought not call them a non-Christian and non-believer. Even if needing to avoid Christian fellowship with them.

 

[BibleLover]

Not necessarily, since verse 9 also needs the confession to be from the heart:

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

More like derogatively used for Jesus-lovers today.

Act 26:28 Then Agrippa said unto Paul, Almost thou persuadest me to be a Christian.

And then, Christians became the acknowledged name of all those naming Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. Without being derogatory.


And finally in Scripture, Christians has become the name called by the Lord Himself.

Not true. Since verse 9 establishes the confession must be from the heart.

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

No one has said that confession with the mouth alone saves the soul. That's not the question at hand, pertaining to who appears at the judgment seat of Christ.

1Pe 4:15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters. Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.

The same can possibly be said for 'Jews', since it's first used in the bad light of being driven out by heathen.

2Ki 16:6 At that time Rezin king of Syria recovered Elath to Syria, and drave the Jews from Elath: and the Syrians came to Elath, and dwelt there unto this day.

And yet, we have Scripture calling them Christians too.

1Pe 4:15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters. Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.

By Scripture all Christians can agree, that everyone called a Christian is not living the Christian life. But neither Scripture nor all Christians agree, that they ought not be called Christian.

Therefore, strictly for appearing at the judgment seat of Christ, it is only a matter of who is called a Christian by the Lord, when He has all Christians appear before Him.

As an aside, according to Scripture, I can call anyone confessing faith in Christ, a Christian and a brother. But that does not mean I have to. It only means that I ought not call them a non-Christian and non-believer. Even if needing to avoid Christian fellowship with them.

OK, you win; I'm tired of messing with you. Everybody who says the name Jesus will be at the Bema. See you there. Don't bother answering; I won't be able to read it.

 

[Godhelpus]

If I am understanding you correctly, you are saying Christians will also be present at the GWTJ? Correct me if I am wrong.

Now this is a very good question, and is a sword with two sides. For Christians rejected at His Bema judgment? No.
But for Millennial Christians. Yes.

My only argument from Scripture, is that while living on earth, anyone confessing faith in Christ is called in Scripture a Christian. They must appear at His judgment seat. However, once any Christian in name only is rejected by Christ, then they no longer can be called Christian. They will be sent away to wait for the GWT, not as Christians but as judged unbelievers.

Rom 9:26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.

This works both ways. To them that were called Christians, shall be said, Ye are not my people...

If the Lord says someone is not His people, then they cannot be called by His name, Christians. And so, Christians appearing at His Bema seat and rejected of Him for evil lip-service, they will not be called Christians at the GWT.

I only show by Scripture, that so long as we are confessing faith in Christ on earth, then we can be called Christians. And also, while on earth anyone confessing His name with lips alone, can begin to confess Him from the heart, and be said, Ye are my people.

We should not write anyone off on earth, and say they are not Christians, so long as they do confess faith in Christ. It just doesn't mean we have to keep company with them, or even must call them Christian and brother. The Lord will make difference between the wheat and the tares soon enough.

 

[Major]

OK, you win; I'm tired of messing with you. Everybody who says the name Jesus will be at the Bema. See you there. Don't bother answering; I won't be able to read it.

Wonderful post!.

 

[Major]

Not necessarily, since verse 9 also needs the confession to be from the heart:

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

More like derogatively used for Jesus-lovers today.

Act 26:28 Then Agrippa said unto Paul, Almost thou persuadest me to be a Christian.

And then, Christians became the acknowledged name of all those naming Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. Without being derogatory.


And finally in Scripture, Christians has become the name called by the Lord Himself.

Not true. Since verse 9 establishes the confession must be from the heart.

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

No one has said that confession with the mouth alone saves the soul. That's not the question at hand, pertaining to who appears at the judgment seat of Christ.

1Pe 4:15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters. Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.

The same can possibly be said for 'Jews', since it's first used in the bad light of being driven out by heathen.

2Ki 16:6 At that time Rezin king of Syria recovered Elath to Syria, and drave the Jews from Elath: and the Syrians came to Elath, and dwelt there unto this day.

And yet, we have Scripture calling them Christians too.

1Pe 4:15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters. Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.

By Scripture all Christians can agree, that everyone called a Christian is not living the Christian life. But neither Scripture nor all Christians agree, that they ought not be called Christian.

Therefore, strictly for appearing at the judgment seat of Christ, it is only a matter of who is called a Christian by the Lord, when He has all Christians appear before Him.

As an aside, according to Scripture, I can call anyone confessing faith in Christ, a Christian and a brother. But that does not mean I have to. It only means that I ought not call them a non-Christian and non-believer. Even if needing to avoid Christian fellowship with them.

I agree completely with post #209!

We just keep going over the same old plowed ground my friend.

 

[Major]

Aren't these who establish their own righteousness, all the while rejecting the righteousness of Christ, even though they profess His name, saying "Lord, Lord"? (e.g. Rom 10:3)

Yes.

 

[crossnote]

If the Lord says someone is not His people, then they cannot be called by His name, Christians. And so, Christians appearing at His Bema seat and rejected of Him for evil lip-service, they will not be called Christians at the GWT.

My understanding of the bema seat is that of rewards, not a judgment of merit

I only show by Scripture, that so long as we are confessing faith in Christ on earth, then we can be called Christians. And also, while on earth anyone confessing His name with lips alone, can begin to confess Him from the heart, and be said, Ye are my people.

That would be a salvation of works, as Christians, we are robed in His obedience, not ours. (I confess Christ because he saved me not in order to get saved.)

 

[Godhelpus]

The Bible doesn't speak of "good" Christians and "bad" Christians.

This is grammatically true. But the Bible still does call some people confessing faith in Him and doing evil, a Christian.

There are two kinds of people......the Saved and the Lost.

Luke 15:4 What man of you, having an hundred sheep, if h lose one of them, doth not leave the ninety and nine in the wilderness, and go after that which is lost, until he find it?

So, the sheep which is lost, is the lost, and not saved?

What the Bible does say is that those who say the right words but live in know sin where never saved in the 1st place.

So, one of the sheep which is lost, was never saved in the 1st place.

Being a "good Christian" is not in any way Biblical and goes against the Gospel of the Lord Jesus because it actually adds the idea of WOKS to our salvation.

Being a good Christian is works salvation??

Luk 19:17 And he said unto him, Well, thou good servant: because thou hast been faithful in a very little, have thou authority over ten cities.

Is the Lord adding to works salvation, by speaking of His good Christian servant? Are Christ's good servants, not to be called good Christians??

What is works salvation? Is it not judging some people confessing faith in Christ alone, to be unsaved, because of their bad works?

You imply I teach works salvation now? Then tell me: Are we saved and justified by confessing faith in Christ alone, apart from any works we do?

If so, then how can anyone say someone confessing faith alone in Christ, ought not even be called a Christian, because of their works?

I am the one who is teaching against works salvation. I am the one saying anyone confessing faith in Christ alone, can be called a Christian. I make no exception by works, as them that teach works salvation do.

You said..........
"And unfortunately, unless there is Scripture saying otherwise, the believers that live like devils, will also appear at His seat with the wheat".

Now maybe that is coming from the "Oneness Pentecostal" theology that you post,

Now you are making accusations against me, saying that I post oneness Pentecostalism. I have preached against oneness, and now also against Pentecostalism. Pentecosts also say anyone confessing faith alone in Christ, that is not living by their holiness rules, are unsaved, and cannot be called Christian at all.

All they do is up the holiness ante, when judging who is, and who is not, a Christian, based upon their works, though they do still confess faith in Christ alone.

but actually you are inviting the Universalist Theology that everyone will in the end be saved.

And now, I am posting Pentecostalism and universalism at the same time?? Brother, you see how your zeal is without knowledge.

You are the one preaching that all who appear at the judgment seat of Christ, shall in the end be saved. That is Bema universalism. As with against works salvation and Pentecostalism, I am the one preaching against universal salvation at the Bema judgment.

Even the Scripture you used validate that idea........
Jas 2:19 "Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

That Scripture has no reference at all to the topic at hand.

Your topic is about how only those living for God, can be called believers in God. I never brought it up. And the only reason I bring in the Scripture, is because it's your topic, not mine.

Scripture says the devils are also believers in God, but they do not live for God. Are you going to now say that some people believing in God, are not believers?

Is that how far you've come, in order to hold to your tradition? That not everyone confessing faith in Christ, can be called a Christian, and not everyone believing in God can be called a believer??

 

[Godhelpus]

My understanding of the bema seat is that of rewards, not a judgment of merit

True. It is of rewards:

2Co 5:9 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

What's the reward for doing evil?

Godhelpus said:
I only show by Scripture, that so long as we are confessing faith in Christ on earth, then we can be called Christians. And also, while on earth anyone confessing His name with lips alone, can begin to confess Him from the heart, and be said, Ye are my people.

That would be a salvation of works, as Christians, we are robed in His obedience, not ours. (I confess Christ because he saved me not in order to get saved.)

How so? How is it a work, to confess faith in Christ, and be called a Christian?

Is it a work to begin confessing faith in Christ from the heart, rather than only with the lips? Are you saying that anyone only confessing Christ with the lips, cannot begin to confess Him from the heart?

Are you saying that confessing faith in Christ is a work? How else can you say it would be a work of salvation??

 

[Godhelpus]

No, it would be ridiculous to suggest that the verse is saying "don't get caught". I think Petet is just referencing the some of the maladies of the surrounding culture. Encouraging them not to engage in such behaviors.

True. Totally agree. As well as exhorting us not to suffer for doing such things.

And so, even if we do such things and suffer for it, the verse still refers to us as Christians.

Christians ought not to suffer for evil doing, but ought only suffer for doing good and right in the name of Christ:

1Pe 3:13And who is he that will harm you, if ye be followers of that which is good. But and if ye suffer for righteousness' sake, happy are ye:

 

[Godhelpus]

You said...........
" If someone is living like the devil, then you say they are not a believer nor Christian at all."

Ok. I'm not sure of the difference, but I accept the correction, and won't say this.

What God said in Matthew 7:22-23.............."On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then I will declare to them, I never knew you, depart from me you workers of iniquity."

I have NO idea how this can be confused! These people who SAID they were Christians are not Christians because God said so.

I think I see what you mean. You're saying that if the Lord says He never knew someone, who calls Him Lord, then they were never Christians nor believers.

He never says they were never called Christians, but only that He did not know them. Your interpretation of the Lord having not known them, doesn't mean they were never called Christian in Scripture.

They therefore can appear at the judgment seat with all that call Him Lord, and are called Christians on earth. After His Bema judgment, them that are rejected by the Lord Himself, can no longer be called Christians in hell, or at the GWT.

They will not be at the Bema Seat Judgment!

And since you say it means they were not Christians, (Though He did not say that), then you say they could not possibly be at His judgment seat, where only Christians will appear.

However, Matthew 7:22-23 is not until His second coming and Bema judgment.

For now on earth, Scripture still calls everyone confessing faith in Christ, a Christian. Therefore, they also will be called Christians by the Lord, until they appear at His judgment seat. Then He will accept some as Christians resurrected unto life, and others not to be called Christians ever again.

They work their works in Jesus’ name. They pray and heal in Jesus’ name. They preach and teach in Jesus’ name. They build huge churches and ministries in Jesus’ name. They claim a relationship with Him. But they are none of His. In fact, He sends them away, not with commendation for their good works in His name (and many good works are done in Jesus’ name by false professors), but by disowning their every deed and word.

I've commented on this before. You acknowledge they are laboring for Christ, but will not have their labors commended by Him:

2Co 5:9Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.

The Scripture specifically says those appearing at His seat, are those laboring for Christ. And some will be accepted and others rejected. That includes all those laboring in His name, whether to be commended or disowned.

They weren’t Christians who lost their salvation.

No one is saying they did.

They were never part of the elect of God, chosen before the foundation of the world set apart and sanctified by the Spirit

No one is saying they were.

The ones Christ puts away from Himself with harsh words of condemnation, calling them doers of evil, never came to Him in faith,

No one is saying they did.

despite their outward good works and miracles.

But, as you say, they did labor for Him, and therefore, they will appear at His seat with all that labor in His name. Some rewarded, some disowned.

You said
"Therefore, all Christians appearing at His judgment seat, include all people confessing faith in Him."

Brother, you are proposing a teaching that is diametrically opposed to the Words of God.

Your words are not necessarily Words of God. I never declare someone's teaching is opposed to God's words, just because they disagree with mine.

Let Scripture be the judge.

 

[Godhelpus]

I agree completely with post #209!

We just keep going over the same old plowed ground my friend.

Yes, we do. And perhaps we are closing.

Let me say this: I believe your main objection, is any notion that some Christians can somehow 'lose' their salvation at His seat. No way.

Some can be called Christian in Scripture, by naming Him alone, but that does not mean they are saved, nor lost their salvation.

I do not believe His Bema judgment is about whole-hearted Christians being separated by works. His judgment seat is simply His promised time to separate the Christian wheat from the chaff, which we are specifically told not to do ourselves on earth. As He says, He will do that Himself without error, when He comes again:

Mat 13:2 He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up? But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Who are these tares that rise up with the wheat in the churches of God on earth, only to be separated when He comes again? They are no doubt 'make-believing' Christians in name only, but they are still called Christian in Scripture. Which will be only until that day, where the Lord rejects their labors, and says He never knew them, and sends them away never to be called Christian again...

 

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