A Biblical rebuke to the prosperity gospel movement

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Juk

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3 If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; 4 He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings, 5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself. 6 But godliness with contentment is great gain. 7 For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. 8 And having food and raiment let us be therewith content. 9 But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition. 10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. 11 But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness. 12 Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.
1 Timothy 6:3-12

The Word of God speaks for Itself.
 

Fish Catcher Jim

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@Juk ,
Hey brother no disrespect but it is going to take more then you pulling some scriptures out and thinking it says something it does not. What I mean is simply this. You are witch hunten and and you will not ever gain a thing. You have a waxed heart towards certain ministries and dig for anything you think will prove them wrong. That will not gain you anything.

Why not seek God and study and find out for your self. Juk you have told me things in PM.s of your reasonings and it has just been simple hear say. Why not find out for your self.

I have a scripture for you JUk -----
Acts 5:38 -39
38...And now I say unto you, Refrain from these men, and let them alone: for if this counsel or this work be of men, it will come to nought:
39...But if it be of God, ye cannot overthrow it; lest haply ye be found even to fight against God.

Again Juk I mean no disrespect at all but why not study to prove YOUR SELF worthy instead of trying to proves other not. Which one of these will please God ?
God Bless
Jim
 

Juk

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@Juk ,
Hey brother no disrespect but it is going to take more then you pulling some scriptures out and thinking it says something it does not. What I mean is simply this. You are witch hunten and and you will not ever gain a thing. You have a waxed heart towards certain ministries and dig for anything you think will prove them wrong. That will not gain you anything.

Why not seek God and study and find out for your self. Juk you have told me things in PM.s of your reasonings and it has just been simple hear say. Why not find out for your self.

I have a scripture for you JUk -----
Acts 5:38 -39
38...And now I say unto you, Refrain from these men, and let them alone: for if this counsel or this work be of men, it will come to nought:
39...But if it be of God, ye cannot overthrow it; lest haply ye be found even to fight against God.

Again Juk I mean no disrespect at all but why not study to prove YOUR SELF worthy instead of trying to proves other not. Which one of these will please God ?
God Bless
Jim
What do you think the prosperity gospel is?
 
May 19, 2012
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I wish I had your wisdom at your age, @Juk...Presently, I'm almost finished with the book listed below but he has some very good advice.

Preparing the Remnant Part 2: Joel, Acts, the Book of Revelation, and Spiritual
Warfare I have been preaching the Word of God since I was thirteen years old.
Over those forty-one years, I have both prepared and listened to myriad
sermons. During the past few decades, I have noticed a perplexing phenomenon
within the body of Christ: There are concepts (or even sound bites) that can be
heralded from pulpits that will move the crowds to great excitement and releases
of emotion that tap into some unrealized psychological need or carnal desire.
However, when we examine many of the “truths” being proclaimed across the body
of Christ, they lack any real scriptural legitimacy. In other words, conducting
some basic biblical research will quickly reveal that there is no scriptural
foundation for those beliefs. These unscriptural revelations may produce larger
crowds and offerings, but they weaken the spiritual lives of those caught within
their circles. One of two possible scenarios could have created this phenomenon:
Somewhere along the line, we have unconsciously fallen into the same occupational
trap as the Levites in the book of Malachi: We are preaching what the people
WANT to hear instead of what Heaven says they NEED to hear. · These
unbiblical concepts were created as a part of the Shinar Directive to pull the body
of Christ away from sound doctrine. In today’s current climate within the Church
world, the minister who gathers the largest crowds becomes the new prototype for
Church growth. The end result is deception spreading like a cancer! I remember a
situation years ago that exemplifies this paradigm. I attended a church with a
pastor I absolutely loved. You could see the love of God flowing from him as well
as his contagious excitement about God’s Word. He was teaching on the life of
Abraham, and I couldn’t tell which one of us was enjoying it more. This dear
brother has served as the perfect example of a teaching pastor for me to this
very day. I have to admit that, during his presentation, I mentally drew a circle
around a few statements to examine later. However, this is typical for me;
perhaps it is an occupational hazard of being a Christian educator. Whenever I
listen to a message, my mind will categorize everything I am hearing and cross-
index it with established truth I have already learned. Later, the resulting study
will either allow me to expand my understanding of the Word or bring a realization
that someone’s own humanity has crept into his interpretation and preaching.
After the service, this pastor was having a long discussion with someone else in
the congregation, and he called me in to assist him. A Berean within the fellowship
had picked up on one of the concepts that I had earmarked within my mind to
search out more fully. The pastor was hoping I could bring some clarity to the
situation and assist him. He shared that one of the men he highly respected in
ministry had taught those truths to him. The three of us opened the Word of God
to examine the Scriptures in question, step by step. As we analyzed, the pastor
began to realize that his teaching was slightly out of alignment with the Word. It
was nothing major— just obvious. When he realized his mistake, he quickly
apologized and then said, “That sure preached good though, didn’t it?” That
situation has stuck with me over the years. I knew that wonderful pastor loved
both God and His Word with a passion I had rarely seen. Yet, in his passion, he
had picked up something in his preaching that was slightly off, because it just
“preached better” that way. If this mature saint of God could fall prey to that, I
was certain I also could have done so over the years. One of the sermons that
just “preaches good” and gets the people excited, but does not line up with the
Word, is the army described in Joel chapter 2.
Lake, Micheal; Horn, Thomas (2015-02-20). The Shinar Directive: Preparing the
Way for the Son of Perdition's Return (Kindle Locations 4871-4876). Defender
Publishing. Kindle Edition.
 
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Juk

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I wish I had your wisdom at your age, @Juk...Presently, I'm almost finished with the book listed below but he has some very good advice.

Preparing the Remnant Part 2: Joel, Acts, the Book of Revelation, and Spiritual
Warfare I have been preaching the Word of God since I was thirteen years old.
Over those forty-one years, I have both prepared and listened to myriad
sermons. During the past few decades, I have noticed a perplexing phenomenon
within the body of Christ: There are concepts (or even sound bites) that can be
heralded from pulpits that will move the crowds to great excitement and releases
of emotion that tap into some unrealized psychological need or carnal desire.
However, when we examine many of the “truths” being proclaimed across the body
of Christ, they lack any real scriptural legitimacy. In other words, conducting
some basic biblical research will quickly reveal that there is no scriptural
foundation for those beliefs. These unscriptural revelations may produce larger
crowds and offerings, but they weaken the spiritual lives of those caught within
their circles. One of two possible scenarios could have created this phenomenon:
Somewhere along the line, we have unconsciously fallen into the same occupational
trap as the Levites in the book of Malachi: We are preaching what the people
WANT to hear instead of what Heaven says they NEED to hear. · These
unbiblical concepts were created as a part of the Shinar Directive to pull the body
of Christ away from sound doctrine. In today’s current climate within the Church
world, the minister who gathers the largest crowds becomes the new prototype for
Church growth. The end result is deception spreading like a cancer! I remember a
situation years ago that exemplifies this paradigm. I attended a church with a
pastor I absolutely loved. You could see the love of God flowing from him as well
as his contagious excitement about God’s Word. He was teaching on the life of
Abraham, and I couldn’t tell which one of us was enjoying it more. This dear
brother has served as the perfect example of a teaching pastor for me to this
very day. I have to admit that, during his presentation, I mentally drew a circle
around a few statements to examine later. However, this is typical for me;
perhaps it is an occupational hazard of being a Christian educator. Whenever I
listen to a message, my mind will categorize everything I am hearing and cross-
index it with established truth I have already learned. Later, the resulting study
will either allow me to expand my understanding of the Word or bring a realization
that someone’s own humanity has crept into his interpretation and preaching.
After the service, this pastor was having a long discussion with someone else in
the congregation, and he called me in to assist him. A Berean within the fellowship
had picked up on one of the concepts that I had earmarked within my mind to
search out more fully. The pastor was hoping I could bring some clarity to the
situation and assist him. He shared that one of the men he highly respected in
ministry had taught those truths to him. The three of us opened the Word of God
to examine the Scriptures in question, step by step. As we analyzed, the pastor
began to realize that his teaching was slightly out of alignment with the Word. It
was nothing major— just obvious. When he realized his mistake, he quickly
apologized and then said, “That sure preached good though, didn’t it?” That
situation has stuck with me over the years. I knew that wonderful pastor loved
both God and His Word with a passion I had rarely seen. Yet, in his passion, he
had picked up something in his preaching that was slightly off, because it just
“preached better” that way. If this mature saint of God could fall prey to that, I
was certain I also could have done so over the years. One of the sermons that
just “preaches good” and gets the people excited, but does not line up with the
Word, is the army described in Joel chapter 2.
Lake, Micheal; Horn, Thomas (2015-02-20). The Shinar Directive: Preparing the
Way for the Son of Perdition's Return (Kindle Locations 4871-4876). Defender
Publishing. Kindle Edition.
It is true. To keep the members coming, pastors will teach what the congregation of false Christians (most of the time) what they want to hear. Reminds of the Bible verse that talks about how people will having "itching ears" in the end times.
 
?

/

Guest
People...remember, we are friendly people here.
I'm watching the development of this thread.
 
May 6, 2014
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It is true. To keep the members coming, pastors will teach what the congregation of false Christians (most of the time) what they want to hear. Reminds of the Bible verse that talks about how people will having "itching ears" in the end times.
This is not the truth.

What we are dealing with in this thread is the bias against certain teachings that can nicely be lumped into the nebulous "Prosperity Gospel" label. What happens is that if one doesn't like a certain truth, one can dismiss it so easily by sending it to the bin marked with a smear.
 
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Juk

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This is not the truth.

What we are dealing with in this thread is the bias against certain teachings that can nicely be lumped into the nebulous "Prosperity Gospel" label. What happens is that if one doesn't like a certain truth, one can dismiss it so easily by sending it to the bin marked with a smear.
Which teachings?
 
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3 If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; 4 He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings, 5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself. 6 But godliness with contentment is great gain. 7 For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. 8 And having food and raiment let us be therewith content. 9 But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition. 10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. 11 But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness. 12 Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.
1 Timothy 6:3-12

The Word of God speaks for Itself.
I hear you my brother but unfortunity you are going to get a lot of push back from those who are Word Of Faith followers. I hope that you do not get caught up in the arguments and differnces which are bound to come.

You see, they understand the Scriptures differently than do you and me when it comes to prosperity.
 
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Juk

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I hear you my brother but unfortunity you are going to get a lot of push back from those who are Word Of Faith followers. I hope that you do not get caught up in the arguments and differnces which are bound to come.

You see, they understand the Scriptures differently than do you and me when it comes to prosperity.
Yeah, I agree.
 
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Sep 3, 2009
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Now how does that answer my question ?
I ask you this as well Juk - where in Gods word to us in how we are to conduct our selves does it say go and judge others and spread it around ?
No one will be able to say that they do not know what the ole Major believes about Juk's question. He has made it clear over much time his stance on this. We have kicked this around and around and around but in responce to Jims question of ....................
"where in Gods word to us in how we are to conduct our selves does it say go and judge others and spread it around" i found the following to be helpful".........I feel that we must be crystal clear on this thing about JUDGING.

Many Christians misinterpret what the Bible says about judging and say that we should never judge or question when some does make a judgement.

John 7:24..........
Jesus said, "Stop judging by mere appearances, and make a right judgment."

In this verse Jesus is talking about making righteous judgments in regard to God's laws. We must make judgments in matters of biblical doctrine and righteous living. The Bible is our foundation and if we don't discern and follow what God says then it will become just another book.

1 Cor. 5:11-13 ...........
" you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat. What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside. 'Expel the wicked man from among you'.


James 5:19-20. .........
"My brothers, if one of you should wander from the truth and someone should bring him back, remember this: Whoever turns a sinner from the error of his way will save him from death and cover over a multitude of sins."


It's not possible to follow these instructions, and save this man from death, without first judging his actions. As hard as it may be to do, it is an act of love to confront a sinning brother or sister and it is uncaring not to try to help them.

In Ezekiel 33:1-9, God warns the Watchman that if he fails to sound a warning, then he will be held accountable. All Christians are Watchmen so let us lovingly encourage brothers and sisters who have gone off the path of righteousness. Also, if we don't keep God's standards of holiness, sin will soon work it's way through the people and the church will become just another unholy social club.

Even though people will tell us that we should not judge, the Bible makes it clear that we should.


Just so that we are all on the same page.
 
Sep 16, 2011
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It wasn't clear, but I was referring to the pastors in the prosperity gospel movement as well as the pastors mentioned in Silk's post.
We should have more mercy on any Christian at the pulpit / in leadership. ''If they are for us, they are for us''. Pastors are under attack more then us, fact 1. But, pastors are more accountable for what they teach, fact 2.
 
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aha

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Judgment needs information, knowledge… including what is in the hearts of men… who knows the what is in the hearts of men… Human court have this limitations, thus, it has no choice but to stick to the text of the law....

Do we have idea how to be poor? Of lacking where to get the next meal? I have no idea…thank God!

We can judge a teaching a doctrine though, imo…

BUT
Our Teacher, who knows the heart of men, observe how he handles: He continue to preach the gospel…

John 6:26-27New King James Version (NKJV)

26 Jesus answered them and said, “Most assuredly, I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw the signs, but because you ate of the loaves and were filled. 27 Do not labor for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to everlasting life, which the Son of Man will give you, because God the Father has set His seal on Him.”
 
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Sep 16, 2011
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Well, you have to admit that at least some pastors do that. My church definitely does.
I have been to many churches Juk. Some churches are good only to be saved in and visit occasionally, not grow. But I don't need to tell you this. A baby will crave real milk and cry their lungs out until they get it!!!
 
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