It seems as if you are putting several thoughts into one or I am missing what you are saying.
By His stripes we are healed
- Thread starter KingJ
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It seems as if you are putting several thoughts into one or I am missing what you are saying.
The greek word sozo..which is where we get the word salvation from means to save or to make whole. To make whole refers to healing.
I think we have now reached the heart of the disagreement.
I am proposing that many miss quote ''by His stripes we are healed'' as it an absolute statement. A statement that removes all doubt. By His stripes we are healed = having our sins removed from East to West. Now you suggest our sickness is treated the same way. It is always God's will for our sickness to be removed from East to West? Well if it is the truth...then why do we get sick in the first place? If you believe the absolute of ''healed from sin'' why not the absolute of ''healed from sickness'? Please try understand what I mean by absolute before you respond. It would make being sick on par with being unsaved / The East to West, absolute removal of our sins is compromised as easily as us getting the flu.
Hence ''By His stripes we are healed'' cannot apply at all to bodily healing. If it does and we get the flu, then... we were not healed by His stripes. It should not be something we need to claim. The cross has happened. We are children. Does God get sick?
Now I want you and all disagreeing with me to simply be dead honest. Have you ever had the flu? Have you had it for more then a day? Do you get aches and pains from old age? Do you get headaches? If you kick your foot against the wall, does your toe hurt?
Now I see it !! and will reply to this. Thank You KJ for making it easy to understand !!
Well, now we are entering a discussion of real faith. Hell hit Job but he never questioned God's goodness. Abraham had to kill his son but he never questioned God's goodness. He could have said 'it is written, you shall not kill'. He had a lot more scriptural support for murder over healing.
1 Pet 4:19 So then, those who suffer according to God's will should commit themselves to their faithful Creator and continue to do good.
In response to Paul's thorn in the flesh God said 2 Cor 12:9 My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.
To be honest i have not had the flu in quite some time. Headaches...yes for a an hour or so, of course it hurts when i stub my toes, and pains from getting older...sometimes...
But you have to realize that because of Is 53:5...... by His stripes i am healed, it means that Jesus paid for my healing with His Blood. Now every time a symptom of sickness tries to come on me i rebuke it, because it does not belong to me. For we are the healed and the devil is trying to get us to accept that we are sick. And if i meditate upon the Word of God, regarding healing (prov. 4:20-22 and Josh 1:8) taking it like medicine...then planting the seed or feeding my spirit with the truth of the living Word, causes my body to receive what is planted.
But you have to realize that because of Is 53:5...... by His stripes i am healed, it means that Jesus paid for my healing with His Blood. Now every time a symptom of sickness tries to come on me i rebuke it, because it does not belong to me. For we are the healed and the devil is trying to get us to accept that we are sick. And if i meditate upon the Word of God, regarding healing (prov. 4:20-22 and Josh 1:8) taking it like medicine...then planting the seed or feeding my spirit with the truth of the living Word, causes my body to receive what is planted.
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Job (i am admitting that i have not ever read the whole book) did however curse the day he was born and, if he didn't do something wrong, God would not have laid into him in the last 3 or 4 chapters.
Abraham obeyed God, because he trusted that the boy and himself would return back to the slaves, after they sacrificed.
In my opinion suffering is referring to crucifying the flesh, which is God's will...Jesus said several times that if we were to follow Him that we must deny the flesh or worldly ways.
In response to My grace is sufficient for you...if one substitutes the meaning of grace it reads as follows.....My overwhelming desire to treat you as if sin never happened or My unmerrited favor is sufficient for you. So knowing that he had the power of God residing within him...God was telling him to deal with it. Just like Jesus told the disciples why didn't they rebuke the wind and the waves?
@KingJ ,
I am proposing that many miss quote ''by His stripes we are healed'' as it an absolutestatement. A statement that removes all doubt. By His stripes we are healed = having our sins removed from East to West.
He remembers our sins no more----they are forgotten as far as the east is from the west.
Now you suggest our sickness is treated the same way. It is always God's will for our sickness to be removed from East to West?
Yes it is Gods will and desire that we be in good health and that we do not live in sickness.
No the sickness is to be removed from us.
Not from the easdt or west. lol
Well if it is the truth...then why do we get sick in the first place? If you believe the absolute of ''healed from sin'' why not the absolute of ''healed from sickness'? Please try understand what I mean by absolute before you respond. It would make being sick on par with being unsaved / The East to West, absolute removal of our sins is compromised as easily as usgetting the flu.
Sickness is a part of the curse and or sin that adam aloud to be released into this earth through his big sin. Nothing can change this. God said by His stripes we are healed. No the word absolute is not scriptural in this context. It is something that has been done for us BUT we have to activate it or walk it out. Now just wait until this reply is done.
Hence ''By His stripes we are healed'' cannot apply at all to bodily healing. If it does and we get the flu, then... we were not healed by His stripes. It should not be something we need to claim. The cross has happened. We are children. Does God get sick?
Here is where you are getting your self caught up. You are seeing this as an instant thing which it is not. Nothing in His word just happens. It has not ever been this way nor will it ever be this way. Have you ever heard fight the good fight of faith ?
This is in essence what has to be done in order to see the healing or the victory. We are already healed but we have to fight the good fight of faith with His word to get our victory. Another words Sickness or the symptoms of a cold begins to be felt in your body. You are under attack.
For those who know His word know that thery are healed by His stripes. Now this is where Faith comes in. You speak His promise or promises by Faith and you stand on them. I do not care what it looks like or what it feels like you only speak what His word says. Before you know it it is gone.
Nothing just happens because we are Born again. Every promise of His must be activated and then worked correctly or another words through faith and standing on His word.
When ever His word does not bring the desired results it is always because of us for we are missing it someplace and simply praying and asking God where it is you are missing it, well He will show you and you fix it and the desired results happen.
Now I want you and all disagreeing with me to simply be dead honest. Have you ever had the flu? Have you had it for more then a day? Do you get aches and pains from old age? Do you get headaches? If you kick your foot against the wall, does your toe hurt?
One would have to say yes to all of these BUT it does not mean they have to stay or run their full course. No weapon formed against me will prosper. This does not say it wont come on you but it wont run it's full course.
By His stripes we are healed is not saying you never get sick or aches and so forth but what it does say is that you do not have to stay that way...
This is where the big dilema is............You are seeing it as it never should happen and the truth is, it does happen but does not have to stay. Once you get ahold of this you will begin to find that you do not get these symptoms on you very much at all.
Now then does this make better sense to you ? OBTW........I was honest !!
I am proposing that many miss quote ''by His stripes we are healed'' as it an absolutestatement. A statement that removes all doubt. By His stripes we are healed = having our sins removed from East to West.
He remembers our sins no more----they are forgotten as far as the east is from the west.
Now you suggest our sickness is treated the same way. It is always God's will for our sickness to be removed from East to West?
Yes it is Gods will and desire that we be in good health and that we do not live in sickness.
No the sickness is to be removed from us.
Not from the easdt or west. lolWell if it is the truth...then why do we get sick in the first place? If you believe the absolute of ''healed from sin'' why not the absolute of ''healed from sickness'? Please try understand what I mean by absolute before you respond. It would make being sick on par with being unsaved / The East to West, absolute removal of our sins is compromised as easily as usgetting the flu.
Sickness is a part of the curse and or sin that adam aloud to be released into this earth through his big sin. Nothing can change this. God said by His stripes we are healed. No the word absolute is not scriptural in this context. It is something that has been done for us BUT we have to activate it or walk it out. Now just wait until this reply is done.
Hence ''By His stripes we are healed'' cannot apply at all to bodily healing. If it does and we get the flu, then... we were not healed by His stripes. It should not be something we need to claim. The cross has happened. We are children. Does God get sick?
Here is where you are getting your self caught up. You are seeing this as an instant thing which it is not. Nothing in His word just happens. It has not ever been this way nor will it ever be this way. Have you ever heard fight the good fight of faith ?
This is in essence what has to be done in order to see the healing or the victory. We are already healed but we have to fight the good fight of faith with His word to get our victory. Another words Sickness or the symptoms of a cold begins to be felt in your body. You are under attack.
For those who know His word know that thery are healed by His stripes. Now this is where Faith comes in. You speak His promise or promises by Faith and you stand on them. I do not care what it looks like or what it feels like you only speak what His word says. Before you know it it is gone.
Nothing just happens because we are Born again. Every promise of His must be activated and then worked correctly or another words through faith and standing on His word.
When ever His word does not bring the desired results it is always because of us for we are missing it someplace and simply praying and asking God where it is you are missing it, well He will show you and you fix it and the desired results happen.
Now I want you and all disagreeing with me to simply be dead honest. Have you ever had the flu? Have you had it for more then a day? Do you get aches and pains from old age? Do you get headaches? If you kick your foot against the wall, does your toe hurt?
One would have to say yes to all of these BUT it does not mean they have to stay or run their full course. No weapon formed against me will prosper. This does not say it wont come on you but it wont run it's full course.
By His stripes we are healed is not saying you never get sick or aches and so forth but what it does say is that you do not have to stay that way...
This is where the big dilema is............You are seeing it as it never should happen and the truth is, it does happen but does not have to stay. Once you get ahold of this you will begin to find that you do not get these symptoms on you very much at all.
Now then does this make better sense to you ? OBTW........I was honest !!
Abraham had to kill his son but he never questioned God's goodness. He could have said 'it is written, you shall not kill'. He had a lot more scriptural support for murder over healing.
Brother that is so not correct. Abraham never had to kill issac. First of all this was a test to prove Abrahams faith for GOD WAS GETTING READY TO MOVE BIG in Abrahams life.
SECOND THING.......God asked Abraham to sacrifise issac unto Him. First thing is thaty God could not ever except Issac as a true sacrifise for God only accepted pure unblemished and Issac was a human born into sin.
1 Pet 4:19 So then, those who suffer according to God's will should commit themselves to their faithful Creator and continue to do good.
Does this say sickness to you ?
You cannot assume it is always Gods will to heal someone physically. Spiritually, yes.
1. Sickness can be from the devil. It can also be from bacteria, viruses, our stupidity, our unhealthy body and God.
2. I do believe God heals us. It is just not an absolute.
3. Why call for the elders?
4. Any Christian can pray a prayer of faith. This is what is so funny about this subject. That and the fact that it takes less faith then a mustard seed.
5. God meets all my needs. I am not God that I can presume to know His will. I know that if my kid constantly played in dirty puddles, I would want him to learn a lesson. We can't naively blanket all sickness as wicked. Clearly their is weakness (no legs), sickness (flu, migraines) and then their is sickness (ebola, aids).
@KingJ I just have one little quote of yours to respond to....we may not be God, to know His will.....BUT we have the Word of God and in it lies His Will or better said His promises and so that means that we can know how God feels, and what He desires....so there is no more questions. Here is a quote from another brother here on another thread:
*******"God has a book of remembrances, Mal 3:16. It is not for Him to remember, but for us to go to the Judge and claim the promise. It's protocol just like on earth. Kings have books of their chronicles so they don't forget. God has these same books so WE don't forget. It is up to us to claim His promises. You never get what you don't ask for."*********** !thanks @Abdicate
*******"God has a book of remembrances, Mal 3:16. It is not for Him to remember, but for us to go to the Judge and claim the promise. It's protocol just like on earth. Kings have books of their chronicles so they don't forget. God has these same books so WE don't forget. It is up to us to claim His promises. You never get what you don't ask for."*********** !thanks @Abdicate
@KingJ I just have one little quote of yours to respond to....we may not be God, to know His will.....BUT we have the Word of God and in it lies His Will or better said His promises and so that means that we can know how God feels, and what He desires....so there is no more questions. Here is a quote from another brother here on another thread:
*******"God has a book of remembrances, Mal 3:16. It is not for Him to remember, but for us to go to the Judge and claim the promise. It's protocol just like on earth. Kings have books of their chronicles so they don't forget. God has these same books so WE don't forget. It is up to us to claim His promises. You never get what you don't ask for."*********** !thanks @Abdicate
A kid has to ask for healing?
''Dad I guess you didn't notice I am dying of the ebola. Please can you send me someone who knows those verses that I can repeat and think positively on....so that you can see me worthy of healing''. That is what you are proposing?
What if your kid is ilterate and deaf, but hates sin and loves Jesus?
You are missing the reason I included this example. Let me just ask....was Abraham not prepared to go through with the act of murdering his son? Yes or no?
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Abraham was prepared to honor and obey God
Brother now you are simply twisting what was said and being silly.
The birds are out singing and I did it again sat up all night on this thing.
Now it is time to shut down and go to wherer my bed is at. lol
Blessings KJ and have a wonderful day
So He dealt with sickness like He did with our sins? If thats the case why do so many get flu? Clearly He didn't deal with it as well as He did with our sin. Or are you proposing He did not deal properly with our sin?
Yes it is Gods will and desire that we be in good health and that we do not live in sickness. No the sickness is to be removed from us.
If its God's absolute will / something He died for....then why is any Christian sick in the first place?
Do we have to activate repentance everytime we sin?
Sin being defeated on the cross was instant. Our sins washed away is instant. Us assuming He died for bodily healing as He did for our sins....suggests the dead obvious does it not?
I really do not understand what you are proposing. How do you muster up this faith? Do you repeat the verse multiple times in your head? Do we first need to convince ourselves that there is a God? If we are convinced there is a God, why do we still need to convince ourselves that He can do a miracle?
I am proposing that what you propose to be faith is not faith. At all! You are proposing positive thinking / confession.
The unsaved need the faith you are proposing. The faith that my Father can help them.
The saved already believe that a man who walked the earth 2000 years ago is God. We trust our eternity in His hands. Now we teach we need to muster up more faith for Him to take care of our toe?
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Abraham trusted in God. He was prepared to murder for a really good God / ie He knew God had a really good reason for asking something that appeared terrible.
Jim your advice sounds exactly like that example to me.
1. Do your kids need to ask you for medical help? Yes or No?
2. Do your kids need to memorize your written will before they ask you for healing? Yes or No?
3. Do your kids need to ask with confidence before you meet their medical needs? Yes or No?
You know what it takes to be a child of God. How can you think God would treat us like this / expect this of us?
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1. Job was not cursed because he did something wrong. Job is a great read! God had much trust in Job's love. It was tested.
2. Agreed. Abraham knew God's ultimate will is good. Despite the current hell.
3. Why can't it blanket all suffering we endure? As we can all agree that there is no suffering whatsoever in heaven.
4. But he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness." Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ's power may rest on me.
What weakness is he talking about?
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Well there are two ways to interpret Mark 10:29-30
1. If I lose one sister, God will give me 100. My mother and father will give birth to 100 more sisters.
2. It was a metaphor for sisters in Christ. We are one body Rom 12:5.
On houses:
1. I lose one house and receive 100. Has God ever done that for anyone you can think of? Repaid exactly 100/1? I believe the only time God has ever been literal on a return was with the Jews in their tithing. They could test God on that. Can we do the same? Should we do the same? Does it speak well of a kid testing Father God?
2. It is speaking of your sisters house. My house is yours. The pastors house is yours. Persecution unites us. You receive a Christian family. The early Christians gave away all their material possessions. How do you reconcile that with your take on that verse? If you take this literally, do you also take most of Matt 5 literally? ''Do not resist an evil person''? Forgive only 70 x 7 = 490 times a day?
This is speaking of God's heart condition. He wants to see us prosperous and healthy. Prosperous and healthy does not always / if ever eqaul material riches and bodily healing.
I can agree more with 2 Cor 9:8. It ties up with Matt 6:26. But what if God does not generously provide for some? Is it because they do not know this verse? Is it not possible to be poor and love Jesus? If so are you suggesting it is possible to love Jesus more then others and yet not be as blessed as others? God is partial? God is gimmicky? God expects us to recite X and Y or else no Z? God is not a Father ...?
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