I just googled the age of the universe and Dr. Google said 14.7 Billion Years Ohhh I see I was jumping ahead of myself..sorry the good doctor said 13.8 billion, then he was a little more specific and said 13.82 Billion years old I suppose that extra 0.02 billion years is for our time on Earth? Ohh and I see that according to the Hubblesite the Age is only 13.7 Billion years. Must have something to do with the orbital velocity of the scope.
Did Dinosaurs Co-exist With Biblical Man?
- Thread starter Scott C F
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First question, ...yep, my generation even declared God is dead!!
Second question, ...then stop wasting your time here, the world as you know it is about to crumble before your very eyes, and that isn't Christian info, that is coming from your secular worldview, so enjoy what little time you have left before you die and go to Hell and then your eyes will be opened, ...but then it's too late (and then you too will join in that prayer meeting for your children)!
In His Love,
Gene
Second question, ...then stop wasting your time here, the world as you know it is about to crumble before your very eyes, and that isn't Christian info, that is coming from your secular worldview, so enjoy what little time you have left before you die and go to Hell and then your eyes will be opened, ...but then it's too late (and then you too will join in that prayer meeting for your children)!
In His Love,
Gene
I don't see that you are doing yourself any favours here Calvin. Thought you were better than this.
I enjoy the discussion Gene, I hope to have a few years left in me yet.
Huntingteckel
Inactive
I suppose Tubby is an atheist by what JustPassingThru is saying. Is that right? If that's the case we should welcome him with open arms instead of attacking him and telling him he's wasting time here. There shouldn't be any judgment here.
I don't know Tubby, I kind of doubt that, you need to get your head out of the stars and take a serious look around you, the financial people are saying the world debt is like a basketball compared to the sun, the basketball represents the actual money in the world and the sun represents the debt in the world, when the crash happens, and they are not saying if, but when, ...and they don't understand why it hasn't happened already (I could show you the reason, but you wouldn't accept it) how much money do you think a happy chap like you will have to make yourself happy?
In His Love,
Gene
In His Love,
Gene
Hunting, I suggest in Christian love you go back and read all of Tubby's posts, we are not attacking him, we are trying to show him why he is here in the first place and take him to the foot of the Cross, however I will give you credit on one point, after we have layed out the plan of salvation, he is persistent to refuse it and still stay here, ...he doesn't recognize it Eph 2:1-3, but God is working in his life.
Blessings,
Gene
Blessings,
Gene
Rom 10:14. How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching?
Rom 10:15. And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, "How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!"
Huntingteckel
Inactive
I've only read the past couple pages, but even then I'm happy to have atheists on christian forums or in church or wherever else Christians are. Even if Tubby was being negative or even insulting in prior pages we should still welcome him...Says the man that's only been here a day...
I, too, have trouble with the young earth but we keep having this conversation, here and on other threads with no resolution. Science only deals in guestimates, theories - with few verifiable facts. See Learning Genesis thread for Schroeder's 6 day confirmation, at the point of the Big Bang (believed origin) and he's a yamulka wearing astrophysicist. When you get to talking about time, it becomes very confusing. I love science, and many scientists now agree that evolution is not a very workable theory. (see Through the Wormhole - Creationism VS Evolution).
Huntingteckel
Inactive
Have you checked out Hugh Ross' website Reasons.org? It's a website devoted to science and the Bible. You would probably enjoy it. Hugh Ross does hold to an Old Earth perspective and I enjoy his views.
I'm not sure if I believe in evolution or not. I know that most scientists believe in it but I've never seen anything that's really shocked me into belief. Maybe there is something out there that proves it, but I haven't seen it. I would have no problem believing in Theistic Evolution if there was proof though.
Hey Hunt 
Welcome to the forum. No, I haven't checked that particular website (altho you never know - I google for specifics alot so maybe). It is very difficult to add "time" into any discussion because we are "in" linear time and cannot conceive "out of time" framework. I have used the analogy of creating virtual worlds, where the "history" goes back millenia. Evolution has some major problems, in regards to human beings, in stating that not life becoming instantly life. Some say that 14 billion years would not be long enough for the human being of today to have occurred randomly. Survival of the fittest doesn't account for how we "lost" our fur. I could go on but I won't 
. But more and more scientists agree that this life and the universe didn't happen at random.
Welcome to the forum. No, I haven't checked that particular website (altho you never know - I google for specifics alot so maybe). It is very difficult to add "time" into any discussion because we are "in" linear time and cannot conceive "out of time" framework. I have used the analogy of creating virtual worlds, where the "history" goes back millenia. Evolution has some major problems, in regards to human beings, in stating that not life becoming instantly life. Some say that 14 billion years would not be long enough for the human being of today to have occurred randomly. Survival of the fittest doesn't account for how we "lost" our fur. I could go on but I won't . But more and more scientists agree that this life and the universe didn't happen at random.
Huntingteckel
Inactive
Hey Hunt
The time thing is actually one of the main reasons that I have my doubts about evolution. That does seem rather quick to go from single cell organisms to what we are today, but I'm no scientist so who knows.
Again beloved, the Bible doesn't say the earth is only 6000 years old, the earth was created with the rest of the universe Gen 1:1 and coupled with Is 45:18.
What It does tell us is that the earth became without form and void, which is a better translation of the earth was without form and void Gen 1:2
That is the physical account of creation of the material universe, but it is also the spiritual account of the creation of man, ...Adam was created a perfect man, ...but he became a sinful man, ...shall we go on with the analogy?
Darkness was on the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters, doesn't that describe our spiritual condition before regeneration? (we are the deep, water is a type of the Word, but there was darkness so we couldn't see the Truth of the Word)
Let there be Light! ....and one of His kids gave us the Gospel, ...we saw the Light!
Now isn't it much more fun to dig nuggets out of the Word than to be stress over how old the universe is?
Blessings,
Gene
What It does tell us is that the earth became without form and void, which is a better translation of the earth was without form and void Gen 1:2
That is the physical account of creation of the material universe, but it is also the spiritual account of the creation of man, ...Adam was created a perfect man, ...but he became a sinful man, ...shall we go on with the analogy?
Darkness was on the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters, doesn't that describe our spiritual condition before regeneration? (we are the deep, water is a type of the Word, but there was darkness so we couldn't see the Truth of the Word)
Let there be Light! ....and one of His kids gave us the Gospel, ...we saw the Light!
Now isn't it much more fun to dig nuggets out of the Word than to be stress over how old the universe is?
Blessings,
Gene
Huntingteckel
Inactive
You would think but that's what the thread is about.
I believe with Hugh Ross' interpretation of Leviathan being a crocodile and Behemoth being a hippo. I feel that fits with the description given. I forgot to post this on my first post on this thread.
Hunt, I prefer to rely on the Holy Spirit to teach me Truth rather than man, I'm not saying that books written by man are bad, but if they contradict the Word we can't really have much faith or confidence in them now can we?
Behemoth is a hippo, have you seen a hippo, does it have a tail like a cedar tree, ...have you seen a cedar tree friend, I lived in California, they grow to 200' high and 13' in diameter, ....now a brontosaurus, from the description in Job, that I can believe.
Leviathan is a crocodile, are crocs fire breathers, the Word/God says fire comes out of their mouths, I don't think so, we have never seen a dragon like the Lord is describing, but that doesn't mean they didn't exist.
And if we believe the creation account then we believe God created the dinosaurs on the sixth day with man, ...it's that simple.
Blessings,
Gene
Behemoth is a hippo, have you seen a hippo, does it have a tail like a cedar tree, ...have you seen a cedar tree friend, I lived in California, they grow to 200' high and 13' in diameter, ....now a brontosaurus, from the description in Job, that I can believe.
Leviathan is a crocodile, are crocs fire breathers, the Word/God says fire comes out of their mouths, I don't think so, we have never seen a dragon like the Lord is describing, but that doesn't mean they didn't exist.
And if we believe the creation account then we believe God created the dinosaurs on the sixth day with man, ...it's that simple.
Blessings,
Gene
Gene didn't mention that Leviathan leaves a shining wake etc. Crocodiles are stealthy hunters they leave no wake. Even Psa 104:26. seems to rule out crocks..why? Because even though there are saltwater crocks, they sleep on the land close to water, they hunt and eat, but do they play? I believe not. Also, (I may be mistaken) crocks that do go into salt water don't go into the deeper parts where shipping will go. Yet the Psalmist seems to imply that Leviathan goes into the deeper parts.
Sorry, the description of Leviathan just doesn't fit any known crocodile. Read the whole of Job 41. It was inspired by God...can the same be said of Hugh Ross' interpretation?
Sorry, the description of Leviathan just doesn't fit any known crocodile. Read the whole of Job 41. It was inspired by God...can the same be said of Hugh Ross' interpretation?
I am trying to do you a favour Tubby, I'm covered by the Blood of Christ.
Huntingteckel
Inactive
Tail can easily mean rear or back side. No animal has bronze bones either... or breathes fire... But the description of the leviathan is more than likely a crocodile. The references to armor makes since because of the scales and it has rows of raised scales on its back, which could be the shield. Sure, the behemoth being a hippo may be less likely but from what we're given we aren't supposed to take the verses literally.
Calvin, crocodiles leave wakes plenty. When they run into the water. When they submerge after sitting on the surface they leave small ripples. Crocodiles have been known to go fairly deep into the ocean on occasion, although that is not the norm. And ships don't have to go deep into the ocean.
Look up Hugh Ross on youtube. He's a smart man.
*edit*
I don't take the creation account as a literal six days.