I just used my tools this morning in my Bible study (a thread here) on Acts 1--4. The question was a term that for some reason is horribly butchered and has no examples by MANY translations. One of the unique things about the term is that it has a root or stem that is a huge clue that it can't be what the butchered use is. Plus there is a verb right before this, and if you try to join them in the butchered way, the two together is a huge trainwreck on the meaning of it.
Do you use original languages in bible study and teaching?
- Thread starter YeshuaFan
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I have a lonely planet Hebrew phrasebook, but I don't know if I'll ever use it though interesting to read through for the cultural aspects of it.
It has Hebrew phrases, but I think you have to start right from the basics, like learn the Hebrew alphabet.
I don't really understand how Jesus was speaking Aramaic and nobody really speaks it anymore. Where did this language come from? Apparently there are a few Aramaic words that are left untranslated in the KJV like Abba for Father, mammon, talitha cum, raca, Golgotha.
Was Jesus speaking Aramaic all the time or was he just using a few words and phrases here and there?
It has Hebrew phrases, but I think you have to start right from the basics, like learn the Hebrew alphabet.
I don't really understand how Jesus was speaking Aramaic and nobody really speaks it anymore. Where did this language come from? Apparently there are a few Aramaic words that are left untranslated in the KJV like Abba for Father, mammon, talitha cum, raca, Golgotha.
Was Jesus speaking Aramaic all the time or was he just using a few words and phrases here and there?
It came from Babylon; see Dan 2. It was a section of Daniel in Aramaic so that the Chaldeans advisers and visionaries whom he rescued from Nebuchadnezzar's sword could understand the Biblical account; it preserved the bond, and guess who came to Israel when the awaited star appeared? What I don't know is what kept the Jews from going back to Hebrew upon return; they only used it in synagogue. It might have been the plundering and hostility of the various occupying powers, especially Antiochus. With the coming of Roman occupation and hostility, the secret Qumran caves were filled with scrolls--in Hebrew.
So all Jewish oral communication was Aramaic in Judea. Roman admins used Latin, but wrote in Greek. The occasional term shows up in Aramaic in the Greek gospel texts and some letters as accent. They kind of thought of it as their home language at that point. As far as I know, Matthew wrote his own Greek text.
The Septuagint was the translation of the Hebrew to Greek in the mid 1st cent. BC to help those raised in Greek/Hellenist culture retain at least something and be able to explain it to the Greeks. When the NT quotes the OT, it is Septuagint as the source.
I do with the caveat that context is king.
Aramiac would have been his "mother tongue"
indeed, as the context and the literary genre are equally important!
Is our friend a closet KJVO?
Yes one year of Greek will instill caution. Thursday night Greek lessons for 3 months will only make a person brag.
At some Bible colleges, there are English Bible courses, which sounds odd at first, like 'well, how else would you study?' But what they mean is that you must be advanced in diagramming. Most of the time the better translations are retaining that, give or take a modifier. You would recognize the English diagram if it was overlaid on a Greek one. They are not adventuring deep into subtext.
Think the best way to learn Koine greek would be to have refresher on English grammar and syntax first!
I wouldn't pin it on just the KJVO crowd, I've heard the misinformation from other quarters as well.
Perhaps, but Kjvo seem to use the mantra that cannot understand hebrew and greek, so just stick to the english!
Give an example of syntax.
I wouldn't worry if people like the KJV, that's their favourite Bible let them read it.
If you like a different one, then read that one.
If you want to learn Greek but you don't actually speak Greek everyday, well it's something else. I'm sure Greek speakers have no problems with New Testament, though it might be more formal than how they actually speak it, just as written language is sometimes different from spoken language.
I've been kind of roped into learning Te Reo Maori this year as all the teachers are now teaching it in school. I thought finally because this is a language that is unique to NZ and to not know the basics is very remiss of people living here. Schools ought to have been fully bilingual from the start..otherwise the language will die out. In many respects it is a beautiful language.
I'm trying to get some Te Reo Maori bibles and scriptures so that our children can learn the Bible in their native tongue. It's only then, they'll really understand what it's all about and get the MEANING. Learning it second hand it's just phonetics for them.
If you like a different one, then read that one.
If you want to learn Greek but you don't actually speak Greek everyday, well it's something else. I'm sure Greek speakers have no problems with New Testament, though it might be more formal than how they actually speak it, just as written language is sometimes different from spoken language.
I've been kind of roped into learning Te Reo Maori this year as all the teachers are now teaching it in school. I thought finally because this is a language that is unique to NZ and to not know the basics is very remiss of people living here. Schools ought to have been fully bilingual from the start..otherwise the language will die out. In many respects it is a beautiful language.
I'm trying to get some Te Reo Maori bibles and scriptures so that our children can learn the Bible in their native tongue. It's only then, they'll really understand what it's all about and get the MEANING. Learning it second hand it's just phonetics for them.
I've written to this charity in order to get some teaching materials.
www.maoripostal.co.nz
Māori Postal Aotearoa
Maori Postal Aotearoa is a Gospel literature outreach. A mission aimed at spreading the Word of God among Maori and across Aotearoa.
www.maoripostal.co.nz
The Bible has already been translated into Te Reo Maori...but the problem is, there needs to be more audio versions, as reading it and hearing it spoken are slightly different. Also they want a modern Te Reo version for todays speakers as the language has changed a bit in a hundred years.
I presume the translation is from the original tongue, not a retranslation of the English translation. That would be dumbing it down somewhat.
Māori Bible Archives - Bible Society New Zealand
biblesociety.org.nz
Its said the current Maori Bible is very similar in tone to KJV English Bible. I have the children's version in Maori and also Samoan.
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I encountered some problems with the ICB version (International Children's Version) with some of the translation making no sense, particularly with pronouns used, and you'd get confused of who was speaking or who was being referred to in scripture. In informal English it can be fairly lazy. If you have two people both male they are He and also They and sometimes if not named it would be hard to tell who is who.
In Te Reo Maori it is very specific whether you are referring to one person, two people, three people or a big group. And there is formal and informal 'you' like the olde English way of saying 'thee and thou' to designated respect, or specfically one person, while YOU is more of could be referring to anyone in a group that you don't know the name of.
In Te Reo Maori it is very specific whether you are referring to one person, two people, three people or a big group. And there is formal and informal 'you' like the olde English way of saying 'thee and thou' to designated respect, or specfically one person, while YOU is more of could be referring to anyone in a group that you don't know the name of.
The Bible has already been translated into Te Reo Maori...but the problem is, there needs to be more audio versions, as reading it and hearing it spoken are slightly different. Also they want a modern Te Reo version for todays speakers as the language has changed a bit in a hundred years.
I presume the translation is from the original tongue, not a retranslation of the English translation. That would be dumbing it down somewhat.
Māori Bible Archives - Bible Society New Zealand
Its said the current Maori Bible is very similar in tone to KJV English Bible. I have the children's version in Maori and also Samoan.
Ahh, then you need someone in their 20s to work on that. All the same, the lower common word vocab could help them get there.
Why would they need to be in their 20s?
They can do a Children's bible and start with that, and then when their vocab is a bit more advanced, go on to the full Bible.
I was in my 30s when I read the full Bible for myself in English. I think people can handle the New Testament a bit easier than the Old Testament since it's much shorter. But they won't get the full picture if they only stick with the New Testament. The New Testament is totally dependent and referencing what was in the Old.