If A Young Child Dies, will He/She Go To Heaven?

[Chopper]

Isn't this all moot? God's the final judge. The scriptures say what they say. Listen to the Holy Spirit, not men.

In a way you are right Abdicate. I appreciate your reference to God being the final Judge, for that He is! As far as being moot, I feel that this discussion is necessary for those who don't have a Scripture to base their hope on. I have faced the tears and anguish of parents of a five year old precious little girl who died in their arms, only to have her taken away by a stranger never to be seen again in this lifetime.

Where did she go!!!! Pastor, is she in the arms of Jesus? Because of God's Grace, He led me to Romans Chapter five so that I could comfort these parents with Scripture, not my opinion, that perhaps an angel that was assigned to her, gently lifted their little girl out of the Mothers arms and gently laid her into Jesus' arms and He opened her eyes and welcomed her home.

 

[KingJ]

As a pastor, over the years, I have been asked this question many times by parents who's child has died. I have heard many opinions of man, but none that satisfied my thirst for a Scriptural response until I read Romans 5:12-14.

We give thanks because God is good Psalm 136:1. We can be more then confident that all our babies are in a good place.

Babies and the mentally handicapped makes for a very interesting discussion. Is God showing preference? Partiality is evil. Do babies stay babies in heaven? Should we kill our babies and guarantee them heaven?

We need to look at the unknown in the parameters of God defined / given in His word. God is good. God is impartial.

We know that toward the end of the millennium satan is released from the bottomless pit to tempt mankind for the last time. Why does God do this? We have good men and woman who have never sinned and suddenly they are with the devil? Why can't they just go on living without being tempted? It all points to God being impartial. If God put satan with Adam and Eve, God will put satan with ALL mankind. Babies and mentally handicapped will get their day in the sun with the devil when they are ready. All the evidence points there and as always with God and the unknown future....we are on a need to know basis and cannot grasp most / any of it....we can only look at where the evidence points.

It is fine if some believe babies are born with sin and do not qualify for heaven. As long as they grasp that having sin never equaled hell. Loving sin does John 3:19. If babies are not in heaven they are in a place like Abrahams bosom.

 

[Chopper]

YES BUT did it dawn on you what they were saying ? Did you gain enough knowledge to know or understand that you needed Christ ?

Interesting conversation Jim and CCW95A. Just like you CCW95A I watched Billy Graham on TV (one of the first in our neighborhood, a "Tele King"). I remember, I was very emotional at the invitation. I was a teenager, and I repeated the "sinners prayer" but nothing happened. I was attending our Methodist Church every Sunday but there was nothing added at that time to feed my decision. As you say Jim, I did not really know why I needed Jesus...At the age of 34, my decision became real with a life change.

 

[CCW95A]

Interesting conversation Jim and CCW95A. Just like you CCW95A I watched Billy Graham on TV (one of the first in our neighborhood, a "Tele King"). I remember, I was very emotional at the invitation. I was a teenager, and I repeated the "sinners prayer" but nothing happened. I was attending our Methodist Church every Sunday but there was nothing added at that time to feed my decision. As you say Jim, I did not really know why I needed Jesus...At the age of 34, my decision became real with a life change.

I was raised a Roman Catholic, and when I was around 7 years old and sitting in Church one day, I looked up at the cross and thought to myself, "um, I wonder how can a person die for me to save me. How does this salvation work?" Many many years later the Lord reminded me of that day when I asked this question, and Lord said to me, "I heard that prayer of yours, and from that time on I began to work in your life to bring you to the place where I can teach you how salvation works"
I received Jesus as my savior in a "Assembles of God Church" that a friend of mine invited me to. Right now, and most of my Christian life I was not associated with any man made denomination, and just considered myself a part of the body of Christ.

 

[Chopper]

We give thanks because God is good Psalm 136:1. We can be more then confident that all our babies are in a good place.

Babies and the mentally handicapped makes for a very interesting discussion. Is God showing preference? Partiality is evil. Do babies stay babies in heaven? Should we kill our babies and guarantee them heaven?

We need to look at the unknown in the parameters of God defined / given in His word. God is good. God is impartial.

We know that toward the end of the millennium satan is released from the bottomless pit to tempt mankind for the last time. Why does God do this? We have good men and woman who have never sinned and suddenly they are with the devil? Why can't they just go on living without being tempted? It all points to God being impartial. If God put satan with Adam and Eve, God will put satan with ALL mankind. Babies and mentally handicapped will get their day in the sun with the devil when they are ready. All the evidence points there and as always with God and the unknown future....we are on a need to know basis and cannot grasp most / any of it....we can only look at where the evidence points.

It is fine if some believe babies are born with sin and do not qualify for heaven. As long as they grasp that having sin never equaled hell. Loving sin does John 3:19. If babies are not in heaven they are in a place like Abrahams bosom.

Interesting observation and questions KingJ. With the help of our Lord, I will attempt to give you some biblical answers. You ask, "Babies and the mentally handicapped makes for a very interesting discussion. Is God showing preference? Partiality is evil. Do babies stay babies in heaven? Should we kill our babies and guarantee them heaven?" I have been using the word innocent as a key word in this thread because it represents a condition that observes with great Grace....Lets look at the word innocent from "Strongs."

נָקִיא נָקִי
nâqı̂y nâqı̂y'
naw-kee', naw-kee'
From H5352; innocent: - blameless, clean, clear, exempted, free, guiltless, innocent, quit.
Total KJV occurrences: 43

From what I understand, this is not partiality. It is a position whereby God does not record their sins against them because, their knowledge of "good and evil" is missing from the innocent....Obviously, killing our babies so that they are guaranteed a place in heaven is not necessary. Beside, murder under whatever the reason is still murder according to God's Commandments.

You ask, "We know that toward the end of the millennium satan is released from the bottomless pit to tempt mankind for the last time. Why does God do this? "

There are two classes of people who populate the millennium, to my knowledge. I must confess that I have not refreshed my memory about that 1,000 year period for some time. My statements will be short and to the point. The two classes of people, will be those Christians who come thru the tribulation will still have their mortal bodies, and will populate that time period giving birth to children who will grow up to adulthood. Those believers who come with Jesus will also not only populate that period, but will also reign with King Jesus.

At the end of that 1,000 year reign of Jesus, Satan will be loosed from his prison and will go out and tempt the people who were born during the millennium....The reason? No one can enter the final Kingdom of God and His Son that has not been tempted and refused to follow Satan and his fallen angels or devils. Only over comers will populate the new heavens and earth for all eternity. I hope this helps a little.

 

[Chopper]

I was raised a Roman Catholic, and when I was around 7 years old and sitting in Church one day, I looked up at the cross and thought to myself, "um, I wonder how can a person die for me to save me. How does this salvation work?" Many many years later the Lord reminded me of that day when I asked this question, and Lord said to me, "I heard that prayer of yours, and from that time on I began to work in your life to bring you to the place where I can teach you how salvation works"
I received Jesus as my savior in a "Assembles of God Church" that a friend of mine invited me to. Right now, and most of my Christian life I was not associated with any man made denomination, and just considered myself a part of the body of Christ.

That's a wonderful testimony my friend, thank you for sharing it with me. I pray that someone who is struggling with the same question might be led to your testimony and receive Jesus as you did. I have some very good pastor's and friends in the "Assembles of God." I credit a lot of my theology on the "gifts" to these wonderful folk.

 

[Abdicate]

In a way you are right Abdicate. I appreciate your reference to God being the final Judge, for that He is! As far as being moot, I feel that this discussion is necessary for those who don't have a Scripture to base their hope on. I have faced the tears and anguish of parents of a five year old precious little girl who died in their arms, only to have her taken away by a stranger never to be seen again in this lifetime.

Where did she go!!!! Pastor, is she in the arms of Jesus? Because of God's Grace, He led me to Romans Chapter five so that I could comfort these parents with Scripture, not my opinion, that perhaps an angel that was assigned to her, gently lifted their little girl out of the Mothers arms and gently laid her into Jesus' arms and He opened her eyes and welcomed her home.

That's why I said to stick with the scriptures, you can't go wrong. I thoroughly believe not just every word, but how those words are used. You know more than me that it sometimes takes a lifetime of trust in the Lord to squeeze out the effective juices from the scriptures. I for one am very grateful to live in an age where I have the Holy Spirit's prompting and good search engine.

 

[Chopper]

That's why I said to stick with the scriptures, you can't go wrong. I thoroughly believe not just every word, but how those words are used. You know more than me that it sometimes takes a lifetime of trust in the Lord to squeeze out the effective juices from the scriptures. I for one am very grateful to live in an age where I have the Holy Spirit's prompting and good search engine.

You are a wonderful new friend of mine! I really like the way you think and express yourself. "Squeeze out the effective juices from the Scriptures"? Good One! It's interesting that you would praise the Scriptures. Just this morning, I was greeting our Heavenly Father and telling Him how much I loved His Word. Then I caught myself and asked myself if I might be making God's Word an Idol. Hmmm, Do you think that would make an interesting new thread? "Can God's Word, the Bible, become an idol?

 

[Major]

Interesting observation and questions KingJ. With the help of our Lord, I will attempt to give you some biblical answers. You ask, "Babies and the mentally handicapped makes for a very interesting discussion. Is God showing preference? Partiality is evil. Do babies stay babies in heaven? Should we kill our babies and guarantee them heaven?" I have been using the word innocent as a key word in this thread because it represents a condition that observes with great Grace....Lets look at the word innocent from "Strongs."

נָקִיא נָקִי
nâqı̂y nâqı̂y'
naw-kee', naw-kee'
From H5352; innocent: - blameless, clean, clear, exempted, free, guiltless, innocent, quit.
Total KJV occurrences: 43

From what I understand, this is not partiality. It is a position whereby God does not record their sins against them because, their knowledge of "good and evil" is missing from the innocent....Obviously, killing our babies so that they are guaranteed a place in heaven is not necessary. Beside, murder under whatever the reason is still murder according to God's Commandments.

You ask, "We know that toward the end of the millennium satan is released from the bottomless pit to tempt mankind for the last time. Why does God do this? "

There are two classes of people who populate the millennium, to my knowledge. I must confess that I have not refreshed my memory about that 1,000 year period for some time. My statements will be short and to the point. The two classes of people, will be those Christians who come thru the tribulation will still have their mortal bodies, and will populate that time period giving birth to children who will grow up to adulthood. Those believers who come with Jesus will also not only populate that period, but will also reign with King Jesus.

At the end of that 1,000 year reign of Jesus, Satan will be loosed from his prison and will go out and tempt the people who were born during the millennium....The reason? No one can enter the final Kingdom of God and His Son that has not been tempted and refused to follow Satan and his fallen angels or devils. Only over comers will populate the new heavens and earth for all eternity. I hope this helps a little.

Chopper, the Bible makes it clear that people are condemned to hell on the basis of their sins8 and their rejection of Christ as the remedy for their sinful condition. However, infants and young children are incapable of fully understanding either their spiritual condition or God's requirements for salvation. Can God judge them even though they don't understand the basis of that judgment? The Bible does indicate that children are innocent, for example, when describing how some of the Israelites in the Valley of Benhinnom had become corrupt so as to sacrifice their own innocent children:

Jere. 19:4-5
"Because they have forsaken Me and have made this an alien place and have burned sacrifices in it to other gods, that neither they nor their forefathers nor the kings of Judah had ever known, and because they have filled this place with the blood of the innocent and have built the high places of Baal to burn their sons in the fire as burnt offerings to Baal, a thing which I never commanded or spoke of, nor did it ever enter My mind".

The Bible also indicates that children are regarded as being innocent because of their lack of ability to discern between good and evil:

Deut. 1:39...........
Moreover, your little ones who you said would become a prey, and your sons, who this day have no knowledge of good or evil, shall enter there, and I will give it to them and they shall possess it."

Other verses also indicate that young children are not fully capable of making moral choices. So, the Bible says that babies and children are innocent, based upon their inability to fully understand the difference between good and evil.

 

[Major]

You are a wonderful new friend of mine! I really like the way you think and express yourself. "Squeeze out the effective juices from the Scriptures"? Good One! It's interesting that you would praise the Scriptures. Just this morning, I was greeting our Heavenly Father and telling Him how much I loved His Word. Then I caught myself and asked myself if I might be making God's Word an Idol. Hmmm, Do you think that would make an interesting new thread? "Can God's Word, the Bible, become an idol?

Just a thought Chopper......
I am sure that you have heard or read of John Piper, a prominent evangelical who says ..........................

"I'm a Calvinist, and I'm not going to go there, because I believe I got my Calvinism from the Bible. If I didn't get it from the Bible, then I don't want people to be Calvinists. So it seems better to say, "Hold fast to the Bible. Base everything on the Bible. If you are going to criticize somebody, criticize them from the Bible. If you are going to affirm somebody, affirm them from the Bible. If you are going to do a strategy, do it from the Bible. Be a Bible saturated people." That's what will make for long term staying power for the gospel. I know this is going to be called bibliolatry, and people will say, "You worship the Bible, not God." Bologna on that. People who reject the Bible for God become idolaters."

 

[Abdicate]

You are a wonderful new friend of mine! I really like the way you think and express yourself. "Squeeze out the effective juices from the Scriptures"? Good One! It's interesting that you would praise the Scriptures. Just this morning, I was greeting our Heavenly Father and telling Him how much I loved His Word. Then I caught myself and asked myself if I might be making God's Word an Idol. Hmmm, Do you think that would make an interesting new thread? "Can God's Word, the Bible, become an idol?

Thanks for the very kind words. The written word of God is just the crude outline of the Word of God, Jesus. But at the same time, it is not, in and of itself, a god. The Holy Spirit shows us from the words He wrote how to feed our spirit by them. I see the written word of God as a map to Jesus, or God's photo snapshots of His dealings with man since Adam. Some people are content with the photos of God, others are hungry for Him and the word gets us to the Word. At the same time, there is power indeed, because just how God spoke the word of God, all the worlds were framed. Thanks again for the kind words. God bless!

 

[Chopper]

Just a thought Chopper......
I am sure that you have heard or read of John Piper, a prominent evangelical who says ..........................

"I'm a Calvinist, and I'm not going to go there, because I believe I got my Calvinism from the Bible. If I didn't get it from the Bible, then I don't want people to be Calvinists. So it seems better to say, "Hold fast to the Bible. Base everything on the Bible. If you are going to criticize somebody, criticize them from the Bible. If you are going to affirm somebody, affirm them from the Bible. If you are going to do a strategy, do it from the Bible. Be a Bible saturated people." That's what will make for long term staying power for the gospel. I know this is going to be called bibliolatry, and people will say, "You worship the Bible, not God." Bologna on that. People who reject the Bible for God become idolaters."

Ah Yes, John Piper. Very good writer. Don't know much about him personally. I guess I have perhaps a half dozen of his books. Just like Pastor Piper, I'm a Calvinist with no apologies. That is why, like Piper, I demand close attention to the Truth explained in the Scriptures. I'm not interested in man's traditions or opinions. Talk to me from the Scriptures, or don't talk to me.

That may sound harsh and I suppose it is, but after four decades of wrestling with theologians with preconceptions, I don't have the time anymore, or the energy.

Hey Major, You're the kind of Brother that I want to know a lot more about because you definitely speak my language.

 

[Major]

Ah Yes, John Piper. Very good writer. Don't know much about him personally. I guess I have perhaps a half dozen of his books. Just like Pastor Piper, I'm a Calvinist with no apologies. That is why, like Piper, I demand close attention to the Truth explained in the Scriptures. I'm not interested in man's traditions or opinions. Talk to me from the Scriptures, or don't talk to me.

That may sound harsh and I suppose it is, but after four decades of wrestling with theologians with preconceptions, I don't have the time anymore, or the energy.

Hey Major, You're the kind of Brother that I want to know a lot more about because you definitely speak my language.

 

[pastor Louis]

Hi it is trough that children are not accountable and are going to heaven, not all children are going to heaven.
Remember a child is link to his parent through blood relation and life is in the blood so if the parent is a devil worshipper and the child died he will go to hell because of his father. he did not have time to grow and cut the ancestral cord or links so he will surely go to hell through blood relation. read the book called go to bethel , you will have more understanding pastor.
Stay blessed and I hope I have humbly contributed.
God bless you all

 

[Major]

Blessings to you my brother Chopper. I guess I would be a 4.5 on the TULIP scale so I know where you are coming from!

I am with you. After 40 or so years of arguing with those who know everything, my patience is not what it used to be either.

 

[Major]

Hi it is trough that children are not accountable and are going to heaven, not all children are going to heaven.
Remember a child is link to his parent through blood relation and life is in the blood so if the parent is a devil worshipper and the child died he will go to hell because of his father. he did not have time to grow and cut the ancestral cord or links so he will surely go to hell through blood relation. read the book called go to bethel , you will have more understanding pastor.
Stay blessed and I hope I have humbly contributed.
God bless you all

Welcome my brother! I understand your comment but I can not agree with it. You of course are initialed to your opinion and I am sure that we will agree on other things in the future but not on this one.

Ezekiel 18:20 ......
“The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not bear the guilt of the father, nor the father bear the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself ”

 

[pastor Louis]

It is true the verse you quoted , my question is as follow, what about a father who gives his own child in sacrifice to the devil , where will the child go?

 

[CCW95A]

It is true the verse you quoted , my question is as follow, what about a father who gives his own child in sacrifice to the devil , where will the child go?

God speaking through the prophet Jeremiah accuses the inhabitants of Jerusalem of shedding "innocent" blood to "Baal"
The innocent blood was in sacrificing their children (sons) to Baal.

Jer 19:4 Because they have forsaken me, and have estranged this place, and have burned incense in it unto other gods, whom neither they nor their fathers have known, nor the kings of Judah, and have filled this place with the blood of innocents;
Jer 19:5 They have built also the high places of Baal, to burn their sons with fire for burnt offerings unto Baal, which I commanded not, nor spake it, neither came it into my mind:

 

[calvin]

I believe the overmastering truth is that God created man(kind) in His image. Not one eensy weensy shred of evidence exists that should lead us to believe that He created anyone just to be destroyed. Once one attains an age where an informed choice is possible, then that choice has a voice.IMNSHO

 

[Mieppi]

“The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not bear the guilt of the father, nor the father bear the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself ”

Did you read the verses before and after this one?

19 "Yet you say, 'Why should the son not bear the guilt of the father?' Because the son has done what is lawful and right, and has kept all My statutes and observed them, he shall surely live. 20 "The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not bear the guilt of the father, nor the father bear the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, w and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself.

You just cut a verse in half to prove a point. Why is it here that the son is not guilty? Not just because he is young. He is already righteous. If you read the whole chapter you will also see that it's not an infant any more. He could do serious crimes. So could we please delete this verse in the argument that despite a fathers sin infant children go to heaven.