Pastor doesn't want members praying or reading bible together

Also I'm not too hung up on every bit of doctrine being 100% to my interpretation, however I feel that this is all a bridge too far for me.

I don't care how complex or simple or anything else, I just want to know more about God and to know Him more and to love Him and live for Him.

I'm in Australia. It seems like most temporary Christianity is so far removed from biblical Christianity.

With my church experience I care nothing for anything other than a room with four walls, even a handful of true brothers and sisters in Christ, a Bible, a pastor/preacher who understands and preaches a message of exhorting us to die to ourselves and live for Christ because of His love for us and His worthiness and most importantly the power of the Spirit and a spirit of fervent prayer.
 
pavilion103 said:
Hello everyone.
This is the original poster.

After months of prayer and counsel I have decided to leave my church.

It is a good church in many respects but also one which is lacking in many respects. No church is perfect but this is not the one for me. After 10 years I am gracefully leaving.

Issues include:
- that outlined in the thread on pastor trying to control all bible discussion in private time with other members of church. I cannot submit to this.
- my pastor is a psychologist and much of the preaching is "principles" from the bible to overcome problems etc. He will pray for God to be glorified etc but the teaching is centred on psychology techniques of applying principles to help people.
I see things much differently. I think the core is the gospel. I believe that we need to see and know God and through doing so more and more we will be transformed day to day. When we see God for who He is we will desire to die to ourselves and live for Him.
Prayer and Bible is mentioned in sermons but it almost seems like a footnote rather than the absolute two means of transformation and power in our lives.
Spiritual maturity needs to be such a fundamental emphasis. The Biblical "idea" of spiritual maturity, not just behaving well and smiling.

My pastor is a genuine man of integrity and I have no doubt that he is doing the best that he knows how but I just don't agree with him.

Other pastors that I have met with get this totally. But when I saw him very humbly and inquisitively he said I was "claiming higher revelation" that I "had to have other motives" for raising this and that I had an "Absalom spirit".
I felt this was a deflection from the theological points that I desired to discuss with an open bible.

It's been tough but I know I've made the right decision.
Click to expand...

Brother, the Bible warns us of those who use things other than what comes from Christ (the anointing) in proclaiming God's Word. They usually sound good to the ears, but have no power to change anyone.

Col 2:8.. See to it that no one carries you off as spoil or makes you yourselves captive by his so-called philosophy and intellectualism and vain deceit (idle fancies and plain nonsense), following human tradition (men's ideas of the material rather than the spiritual world), just crude notions following the rudimentary and elemental teachings of the universe and disregarding [the teachings of] Christ (the Messiah). (AMP)
 
I guess the question is how honest (yet respectful) should I be in my last conversation with the pastor.
Or is it best to just say nothing more and thank him for the good things over the years ?
 
pavilion103 said:
Hello everyone.
This is the original poster.

After months of prayer and counsel I have decided to leave my church.

It is a good church in many respects but also one which is lacking in many respects. No church is perfect but this is not the one for me. After 10 years I am gracefully leaving.

Issues include:
- that outlined in the thread on pastor trying to control all bible discussion in private time with other members of church. I cannot submit to this.
- my pastor is a psychologist and much of the preaching is "principles" from the bible to overcome problems etc. He will pray for God to be glorified etc but the teaching is centred on psychology techniques of applying principles to help people.
I see things much differently. I think the core is the gospel. I believe that we need to see and know God and through doing so more and more we will be transformed day to day. When we see God for who He is we will desire to die to ourselves and live for Him.
Prayer and Bible is mentioned in sermons but it almost seems like a footnote rather than the absolute two means of transformation and power in our lives.
Spiritual maturity needs to be such a fundamental emphasis. The Biblical "idea" of spiritual maturity, not just behaving well and smiling.

My pastor is a genuine man of integrity and I have no doubt that he is doing the best that he knows how but I just don't agree with him.

Other pastors that I have met with get this totally. But when I saw him very humbly and inquisitively he said I was "claiming higher revelation" that I "had to have other motives" for raising this and that I had an "Absalom spirit".
I felt this was a deflection from the theological points that I desired to discuss with an open bible.

It's been tough but I know I've made the right decision.
Click to expand...
Well said, and well reasoned. I can tell you have meditated much on discernment. I am praying for you, and I hope you keep us all updated on the next step in your spiritual life. I anticipate much growth and/or expansion in your connection with the Spirit.
God bless you brother,
John
 
pavilion103 said:
I guess the question is how honest (yet respectful) should I be in my last conversation with the pastor.
Or is it best to just say nothing more and thank him for the good things over the years ?
Click to expand...
He deserves honesty or else how can he change or take inventory of his pastorship? Yet, I am not sure how he will take what he may see as criticism of him personally. With the comment of the Absalom thing, he may have some kind of grudge, or thin skin. If he gets angry or accusatory, just wish him well and tell him Jesus loves him and that you love him. And as you said, all in the most respectful manner.
 
I made a time to speak with the senior pastor tomorrow. Last week's Christmas event was my last one there.

New church today :)
One that my sister joined about 6 months ago (she had similar issues).

She gets back this week too from missionary work the last 3.5 months in Nepal.

An exciting change. I don't expect a perfect church but hopefully more aligned to my understanding if the Gospel!
 
pavilion103 said:
I made a time to speak with the senior pastor tomorrow. Last week's Christmas event was my last one there.

New church today :)
One that my sister joined about 6 months ago (she had similar issues).

She gets back this week too from missionary work the last 3.5 months in Nepal.

An exciting change. I don't expect a perfect church but hopefully more aligned to my understanding if the Gospel!
Click to expand...


Just a thought...somewhere to add to your relationship with God, not replace your new church. try kcm Austrailia, here is the link........ http://www.kcm.org.au/

God Bless
 
Well this story doesn't get any stranger...

In short.
I met with my pastor this afternoon.
I asked him if there was anything in particular he could point to that I said that could be considered "higher revelation." He then said it's not so much the words but the spirit of the words that I said.


I told him that I've made the decision to leave.
He said that he understands that I'm still friends with some of the youth (guys 16-17ish). He then said that he would recommend that I don't keep in contact with them because, as the shepherd he wants to protect them and doesn't agree with my views.
I said that I didn't believe that he could legitimately make this suggestion.
He said that because the friendships where formed while I was in a leadership position (2013-14) of some sort (running a group of guys) that it wasn't just a friendship.
I asked if he could provide scriptural support and he said "Obey the leader."
I said that I disagree that he has the authority to instruct this.
He then said that I don't get it and some day I will.
So I left it there.

I suppose an attempt will be made to discredit me now. I wouldn't be surprised if the youth are told something.
I am sure there will be something said in some form.
Thankfully, I have an incredibly good reputation among the people and am highly respected. Even with the other pastors.

So now I leave.
An end.
And a new beginning.


Curious to people's thoughts on this latest instruction?
 
Honestly, this is one of the signs of a cult leader. Not saying the church was a colt, but one alarm for a cult leader is threatening to remove contact from friends if they leave the group.

You did the right thing, this man is not operating under the lord, he is acting in fear.
 
pavilion103 said:
Well this story doesn't get any stranger...

In short.
I met with my pastor this afternoon.
I asked him if there was anything in particular he could point to that I said that could be considered "higher revelation." He then said it's not so much the words but the spirit of the words that I said.


I told him that I've made the decision to leave.
He said that he understands that I'm still friends with some of the youth (guys 16-17ish). He then said that he would recommend that I don't keep in contact with them because, as the shepherd he wants to protect them and doesn't agree with my views.
I said that I didn't believe that he could legitimately make this suggestion.
He said that because the friendships where formed while I was in a leadership position (2013-14) of some sort (running a group of guys) that it wasn't just a friendship.
I asked if he could provide scriptural support and he said "Obey the leader."
I said that I disagree that he has the authority to instruct this.
He then said that I don't get it and some day I will.
So I left it there.

I suppose an attempt will be made to discredit me now. I wouldn't be surprised if the youth are told something.
I am sure there will be something said in some form.
Thankfully, I have an incredibly good reputation among the people and am highly respected. Even with the other pastors.

So now I leave.
An end.
And a new beginning.


Curious to people's thoughts on this latest instruction?
Click to expand...
He sure seems to be a wolf in sheep's clothing to me. You obey the Spirit of God, not man. Do what you sense His guidance would be in all matters and you may help save someone else. God bless.
 
P.S. This sort of happened to me. I was raised Catholic, got saved and attended an Independent Baptist for many years, then I joined the military and was stationed in Italy and there was only a Southern Baptist church to attend. I began praying for MORE of Jesus and live like Matthew 10. Then a woman came to the church and spoke directly to my prayer one Wednesday night as I was teaching. I was totally in awe and thrilled with how the Lord heard my prayer to that degree! While I was listening and soaking in her words, when she was done the pastor said "Thank you for YOUR comments." And WHAAM!! The Holy Spirit left! That was the first time since I got saved I felt Him. I was devastated and confused how the pastor could be so rude and lacked understanding of something so wonderful. Needless to say I left that church and four people came with me to go with the speaker. My life changed forever for the good because of it. So, God bless and follow the Holy Spirit; He'll never lead you astray.
 
Euphemia said:
He is right in advising you to cease contact with others in the church if you are leaving. He has that right and you need to respect that.
Click to expand...

If a Mormon bishop doesn't want me to hangout with members of his congregation, I'll still be hanging out with members of his congregation regardless of his request.
 
Klub said:
If a Mormon bishop doesn't want me to hangout with members of his congregation, I'll still be hanging out with members of his congregation regardless of his request.
Click to expand...
If you are part of a ministry and remove yourself from under the authority of its pastor, you need to have some integrity and remove yourself completely.
 
Euphemia said:
If you are part of a ministry and remove yourself from under the authority of its pastor, you need to have some integrity and remove yourself completely.
Click to expand...

Why remove personal relationships because the pastor is doing something that is outright wrong? I have plenty of friends who left my specific church because of personal reasons, and we still maintain a relationship. In the end we are all members of the same family.
 
pavilion103 said:
Well this story doesn't get any stranger...

In short.
I met with my pastor this afternoon.
I asked him if there was anything in particular he could point to that I said that could be considered "higher revelation." He then said it's not so much the words but the spirit of the words that I said.


I told him that I've made the decision to leave.
He said that he understands that I'm still friends with some of the youth (guys 16-17ish). He then said that he would recommend that I don't keep in contact with them because, as the shepherd he wants to protect them and doesn't agree with my views.
I said that I didn't believe that he could legitimately make this suggestion.
He said that because the friendships where formed while I was in a leadership position (2013-14) of some sort (running a group of guys) that it wasn't just a friendship.
I asked if he could provide scriptural support and he said "Obey the leader."
I said that I disagree that he has the authority to instruct this.
He then said that I don't get it and some day I will.
So I left it there.

I suppose an attempt will be made to discredit me now. I wouldn't be surprised if the youth are told something.
I am sure there will be something said in some form.
Thankfully, I have an incredibly good reputation among the people and am highly respected. Even with the other pastors.

So now I leave.
An end.
And a new beginning.


Curious to people's thoughts on this latest instruction?
Click to expand...
While most Church's have what is known as a class that describes what they believe, and if you agree with what they teach you can join to become a member.
If you agree with what they believe, and become a member the pastor would have authority to ask you to do, or not do certain things. If you leave the Church, they have no more authority over you anymore. To tell you not to associate with other believers is not right. You must discern in your heart what is best, as God has given every one in his body to know the truth, as it not exclusive to just those in the five fold ministry. I think a lot of Church's operate in fear of loosing their congregations, and do not trust in the Lord for their flock. They will do just about anything to stop this from happening. If a pastor / teacher is doing the will of God under the direction of the Holy Spirit, there is no threat from the believers, only from the unbelievers..
 
Last edited:
They often just cease on their own. If you had true friendships, they may not fizzle, but you will need to curb any talk concerning that church and its ministry.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top