Pope Francis declares evolution and Big Bang theory are right

So is there some kind of panel somewhere that decides what the Pope says is official or not official or is it left up to people such as yourself to explain what is and what is not official. If that is the case, do you have an official title of authority to explain his comments?

The only number of times a pope has made an official dogmatic declaration is twice in all of history. Only twice. This was not one of them. It is always said in an encyclical and is directly stated as an official dogmatic statement -- it isn't just based on personal opinion.

I must agree with Lance as well in comment #10.

Evolution contradicts all of the Biblical records of a finished creation.
The Bible says in Genesis 2:1-3 that God rested on the 7th day because He was finished with the creating process. However, evolution supports a continuous creative on-going process.

Evolution contradicts the doctrine of fixed and distinct kinds.
Evolution supports a constant change back to a common ancestor. The Bible says that all flesh is NOT the same in 1 Corth. 15:38-39. Biogenesis says life begets life is seen as "like begets like".

Evolution produces anti-Christian results.
A corrupt tree cannot produce good fruit according to Jesus in Matthew 7:18. Evolution is at the very heart of atheism.

If the RCC accepts evolution which it most certainly does, then that alone says that God is not divine which you stated as well in comment.

Not at all. It's only a scientific theory on how God chose to create the universe. Early Christian writings expressed this as valid and possible long before evolution, not as a way to demote God's divinity and power, to but explain the limitlessness of it. No Catholic is obligated to accept evolution as valid. I know a few Catholics who believe in young earth creationism and they are not contradicting Catholic teaching since it is only a scientific theory, not a dogmatic position on theology.

But we've had many, many discussions in here on whether evolution is wrong or not. That's not for this thread.

#11........
Your comment was...."He even said that God is not a divine being, and he's right."

God is not a divine being????

It does not require a Doctors degree to figure out that if evolution is the vehicle by which we are all here, then God NOT being divine had nothing to do with us being here, we see right there that evolution does in fact produce anti-Christian thoughts.

Don't misinterpret what I said, Major. The key word is being, not divine. God is 100% divine. He is the essence of divinity and is divinity itself. No question. However, God is not a being. He isn't. He isn't a supreme being even, because a being is a substance of creation. God isn't a substance of creation just as He isn't bound by the constructs of time or motion. As God said "I am who I am" -- He is the substance of to be. He is. No beginning or end. He doesn't live through moments -- what we call 9:30 and then later 10:30 is all the same moment for God.

A lot of the problem is the misunderstanding of the key words. When I agreed that God is not a divine being, I wasn't saying that God is not divine -- I was saying that God is not a being. He is God -- He simply is to be and will always be, unchanging.

Many will not agree with me and that is perfectly fine with me. But IMO dangerous and deadly social problems are deeply rooted in the purposefully thinking of materialistic evolution. Basically, if we tell children that they are products of pond scum, sooner or later they begin to believe that.

That then leads to promiscuity, suicide, abortion, drug abuse just to name a few that we see today. You see, lowering self esteem causes animalistic behavior and depression due to a feeling of meaningless in their lives. IMO that is what evolution has been doing now to our grandchildren and that is why we are seeing such a degradation in human society.

Evolution (which I don't side with, nor against), doesn't instantly lead to the idea that God didn't make man in His likeness. Let's pretend for a moment that Evolution still take place -- before God created the universe, would that mean He didn't intend for man to made in His image? Of course not. His idea of mankind's value because of Him existed regardless.

Now some are macro and some are micro, but what is really important is 1) whether you believe in God, 2) whether you believe He is the Father of us all and must be submitted to, 3) If you love Him because of His value and mercy, and 4) the gift of His son is accepted and lived by continuously.

Joe, Frank, and Tom all believe in three different idea of the Universe's creation. Joe believes in micro-Evolution. Frank believes in macro-Evolution. Tom believes in young earth Creationism. However, all three believe in mankind's original sin, God's authority over us, His mercy, His love, and His gift of salvation through His Son and how it can be received. Are any of these three likely to not reach heaven because of their differing positions on how God created the Universe?

But again, this thread isn't for debating the validity or faulty idea of Evolution. This is in regards to the statement made by the pope, what it means, and whether it is a problem or not.

My position is that this is no different from any pope since, at least, the 1940s, and even before that, popes had no opposing position on a concept like this. But also, this isn't a declaration. A Catholic who intends to follow the Catholic faith 100% is not now limited to only accepting Evolution as valid. This is not dogmatic, in fact, it's not even doctrinal. In fact, it's not even a little T tradition. That's how insignificant this is.
 
The only number of times a pope has made an official dogmatic declaration is twice in all of history. Only twice. This was not one of them. It is always said in an encyclical and is directly stated as an official dogmatic statement -- it isn't just based on personal opinion.



Not at all. It's only a scientific theory on how God chose to create the universe. Early Christian writings expressed this as valid and possible long before evolution, not as a way to demote God's divinity and power, to but explain the limitlessness of it. No Catholic is obligated to accept evolution as valid. I know a few Catholics who believe in young earth creationism and they are not contradicting Catholic teaching since it is only a scientific theory, not a dogmatic position on theology.

But we've had many, many discussions in here on whether evolution is wrong or not. That's not for this thread.



Don't misinterpret what I said, Major. The key word is being, not divine. God is 100% divine. He is the essence of divinity and is divinity itself. No question. However, God is not a being. He isn't. He isn't a supreme being even, because a being is a substance of creation. God isn't a substance of creation just as He isn't bound by the constructs of time or motion. As God said "I am who I am" -- He is the substance of to be. He is. No beginning or end. He doesn't live through moments -- what we call 9:30 and then later 10:30 is all the same moment for God.

A lot of the problem is the misunderstanding of the key words. When I agreed that God is not a divine being, I wasn't saying that God is not divine -- I was saying that God is not a being. He is God -- He simply is to be and will always be, unchanging.



Evolution (which I don't side with, nor against), doesn't instantly lead to the idea that God didn't make man in His likeness. Let's pretend for a moment that Evolution still take place -- before God created the universe, would that mean He didn't intend for man to made in His image? Of course not. His idea of mankind's value because of Him existed regardless.

Now some are macro and some are micro, but what is really important is 1) whether you believe in God, 2) whether you believe He is the Father of us all and must be submitted to, 3) If you love Him because of His value and mercy, and 4) the gift of His son is accepted and lived by continuously.

Joe, Frank, and Tom all believe in three different idea of the Universe's creation. Joe believes in micro-Evolution. Frank believes in macro-Evolution. Tom believes in young earth Creationism. However, all three believe in mankind's original sin, God's authority over us, His mercy, His love, and His gift of salvation through His Son and how it can be received. Are any of these three likely to not reach heaven because of their differing positions on how God created the Universe?

But again, this thread isn't for debating the validity or faulty idea of Evolution. This is in regards to the statement made by the pope, what it means, and whether it is a problem or not.

My position is that this is no different from any pope since, at least, the 1940s, and even before that, popes had no opposing position on a concept like this. But also, this isn't a declaration. A Catholic who intends to follow the Catholic faith 100% is not now limited to only accepting Evolution as valid. This is not dogmatic, in fact, it's not even doctrinal. In fact, it's not even a little T tradition. That's how insignificant this is.

"A Catholic who intends to follow the Catholic faith 100% is not now limited to only accepting Evolution as valid. This is not dogmatic, in fact, it's not even doctrinal. In fact, it's not even a little T tradition. That's how insignificant this is."

But doesn't the Bible say in Gal. 5:9.....
"A little leaven leavens the whole lump."

Do you believe that doctrinal fermentation begins with the 1st small insignificant step?
 
"A Catholic who intends to follow the Catholic faith 100% is not now limited to only accepting Evolution as valid. This is not dogmatic, in fact, it's not even doctrinal. In fact, it's not even a little T tradition. That's how insignificant this is."

But doesn't the Bible say in Gal. 5:9.....
"A little leaven leavens the whole lump."

Do you believe that doctrinal fermentation begins with the 1st small insignificant step?

Absolutely. Luckily, this isn't in regards to doctrine. It's not even in regards to small T tradition. That's my point. Doctrine must be followed entirely, and Dogma far more so. But this is none of the two. It's an opinion based on a theory.

I mean absolutely no disrespect because if someone doesn't understand what the Pope's role is, then misunderstanding is understandable. However, if people are taking the pope's statement as a declaration of change or even to make official, then they need to do a bit of homework before they jump to that conclusion because it is the wrong conclusion.
 
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What is the Pope's role if you don't mind telling me?

His title is vicar of God. Vicar means representative. He isn't a replacement of God as God cannot be replaced and is the authority of the Church.

Before we get too far in, let's try to steer clear from making this about the invalidity of validity of having a pope. I think we've had discussions on that too.
 
If the Pope says something on or off the record then it will received by the masses as being the truth. He is the mortal leader of the Catholic Church.
 
If the Pope says something on or off the record then it will received by the masses as being the truth. He is the mortal leader of the Catholic Church.

He's the mortal representative, but only God is truly the leader.
Many people (some Catholics included who don't know their faith very well) misunderstand quite a lot about this. Some popes have been incredible with their writing and speaking where they make things extremely direct and clear. Pope Benedict XVI was very good with that. Pope Francis, however, it isn't his style. Sometimes he is very unclear and the media and modernists have a field day when he speaks off the cuff.

When Pope Francis wrote in his most recent encyclical in regards to Capitalism, many Catholics knew this was not an official statement and were still free to disagree with him. What was necessary to accept was the role of dignity for every human being. This is why the Vatican sends out reports and official commentary on statements and encyclicals -- so that people do not misinterpret or get confused. But a lot of people don't check those.
 
If the Pope says something on or off the record then it will received by the masses as being the truth. He is the mortal leader of the Catholic Church.

not on Science and remembering person names...

Being from a Catholic school, elementary and College: Evolution of man (not the evolution as to adaptation) natural selection that includes man, the rational being, is of impossible acceptance ....

“scientifically inadequate” is used for diplomacy…

thanks to Protestants to calling it as it is….as it address the popular/ wrong notion that Darwinism = theory of Evolution

In my personal observation….
 
He's the mortal representative, but only God is truly the leader.
Many people (some Catholics included who don't know their faith very well) misunderstand quite a lot about this. Some popes have been incredible with their writing and speaking where they make things extremely direct and clear. Pope Benedict XVI was very good with that. Pope Francis, however, it isn't his style. Sometimes he is very unclear and the media and modernists have a field day when he speaks off the cuff.

When Pope Francis wrote in his most recent encyclical in regards to Capitalism, many Catholics knew this was not an official statement and were still free to disagree with him. What was necessary to accept was the role of dignity for every human being. This is why the Vatican sends out reports and official commentary on statements and encyclicals -- so that people do not misinterpret or get confused. But a lot of people don't check those.

Lysander.....are you in fact a Catholic Priest?
 

Don't hearken to a man based on his title for wisdom is rarely in the high esteemed of this world

For I tell u a wolf howls like a wolf and a sheep walk like a sheep.
Therefore if u see a sheep howling like a wolf and walking like a wolf tho his outer appearance is that of a sheep brethren I tell u that is no sheep but a wolf.

The same with the pope don't listen to him for wisdom is not in him
 
Don't hearken to a man based on his title for wisdom is rarely in the high esteemed of this world

For I tell u a wolf howls like a wolf and a sheep walk like a sheep.
Therefore if u see a sheep howling like a wolf and walking like a wolf tho his outer appearance is that of a sheep brethren I tell u that is no sheep but a wolf.

The same with the pope don't listen to him for wisdom is not in him

We're not going in that direction.
 
Not sure if you know by now but that article was nonsense, here is the truth: http://time.com/3545844/pope-francis-evolution-creationism/

This is what he actually said:

“God is not a divine being or a magician, but the Creator who brought everything to life,” “Evolution in nature is not inconsistent with the notion of creation, because evolution requires the creation of beings that evolve.”
 
Not sure if you know by now but that article was nonsense, here is the truth: http://time.com/3545844/pope-francis-evolution-creationism/

This is what he actually said:

“God is not a divine being or a magician, but the Creator who brought everything to life,” “Evolution in nature is not inconsistent with the notion of creation, because evolution requires the creation of beings that evolve.”

I thought about posting the Time piece on this. It was the only one, that I saw, that seemed to take it seriously and not push for any agenda. The NBC News piece may have been the absolute worst.
 
Don't hearken to a man based on his title for wisdom is rarely in the high esteemed of this world

For I tell u a wolf howls like a wolf and a sheep walk like a sheep.
Therefore if u see a sheep howling like a wolf and walking like a wolf tho his outer appearance is that of a sheep brethren I tell u that is no sheep but a wolf.

The same with the pope don't listen to him for wisdom is not in him

This is not the kind of attitude that is going to make friends and influence people. I am not a Catholic but respect is something that every man deserves.

If you do not agree with someone......it is acceptable to simply say....."I do not agree with you".

Watch..........."I do not agree with the Popes recent comments on evolution".

See how easy that was and no one is offended at all.

Just some friendly advice ......take it or leave it.
 
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