Should any Christian Hold to Theistic Evolution then?

[crossnote]

I'm sorry, I can't really grasp what you're saying. Would you clarify, please?

Sorry for the confusion, taking the Bible as an unscientific text, when Moses wrote, he was addressing the people who lived at least hundreds of years after the creation account and by that time they would've understood what 'evening and morning... one day' meant.

 

[BibleLover]

Sorry for the confusion, taking the Bible as an unscientific text, when Moses wrote, he was addressing the people who lived at least hundreds of years after the creation account and by that time they would've understood what 'evening and morning... one day' meant.

Thanks, now I understand; you are right. Since today we have a much greater scientific literacy than those people, I think, that since time didn't exist then, that the first 3 days serve as rhetorical dividers between elements in a sequence rather than days as we know them. After day 4, time goes on normally as described in the text.

 

[crossnote]

I asked Google AI..."When did the old Earth theory begin to appear in theology?"...and got this answer

The concept of an "old Earth" began appearing in theological discussions in the late 18th and early 19th centuries, predating Darwin's theory of evolution. This shift was driven by geological discoveries and scientific observations that suggested Earth was much older than the traditional 6,000 years derived from biblical interpretations.
Makes you wonder if the previous 'geological discoveries and scientific observations' floating around did not influence Darwin, and lead to a biased opinion of his findings.

 

[crossnote]

I think, that since time didn't exist then, that the first 3 days serve as rhetorical dividers between elements in a sequence rather than days as we know them. After day 4, time goes on normally as described in the text.

Not being a scientific text, I would still hold that the intent of the text, was intact even before the first three days.

 

[BibleLover]

Not being a scientific text, I would still hold that the intent of the text, was intact even before the first three days.

I can't argue with that because it's true. Genesis chapter one was never intended to do anything but teach that God is the Creator of everything.

 

[Major]

Time is a creation of God just like the other 3 dimensions, and time was created for our benefit so that we might have a way of measuring it so that we would have benefit of knowing our mortality so as to give a sense of urgency to making use of our lifetime for God’s glory.

However, for time to exist, it must have a means for measuring it. That's where the sun comes in. We use our planetary orbit around the sun in combination with the earth's rotation to mark the passage of time. If the sun didn't exist, time would not exist.

Thus, from the first day until the fourth day, time didn't exist. Therefore, it is impossible to put a time frame onto those first three "days" of creation.

I agree. Without the Sun for the Earth to rotate around, there would be no time, therefore no days...no days, no weeks or months or years.

Using your comment, then an Old Earth believer would then say that the "time frame" you just mentioned could have been a "YOM"....or a very long age of time.

 

[Major]

Not being a scientific text, I would still hold that the intent of the text, was intact even before the first three days.

The Bible never declare that it is a book of Creation, or biology or geography or astromy but it does include all of those sciences.

 

[Major]

Yet, Moses was addressing the people of his time and beyond who lived after the first three days of creation.

"who lived after the first three days of creation."

NO human lived until day 6. Maybe I am reading your comment wrong????

 

[crossnote]

...but it does include all of those sciences.

It is also God's Word. If the two come into conflict, I'm siding with Scripture.

 

[crossnote]

"who lived after the first three days of creation."

NO human lived until day 6. Maybe I am reading your comment wrong????

I'm just referring to the time Moses wrote and from the human vantage point.... hundreds of years later.

 

[BibleLover]

I agree. Without the Sun for the Earth to rotate around, there would be no time, therefore no days...no days, no weeks or months or years.

Using your comment, then an Old Earth believer would then say that the "time frame" you just mentioned could have been a "YOM"....or a very long age of time.

When you read those first 3 verses, you see several things occurring in sequence.

First the universe is created. Then the earth is created. After that light is created. Then the atmosphere is created followed by the rising of the continents. After that God creates plant life, probably by planting seeds in anticipation of the coming of the sun.

Those 3 "days" serve as rhetorical dividers to break up that vast narrative into smaller chunks.

 

[Major]

When you read those first 3 verses, you see several things occurring in sequence.

First the universe is created. Then the earth is created. After that light is created. Then the atmosphere is created followed by the rising of the continents. After that God creates plant life, probably by planting seeds in anticipation of the coming of the sun.

Those 3 "days" serve as rhetorical dividers to break up that vast narrative into smaller chunks.

Isn't that reading into the Scriptures something that is not openly presented.....or assuming?

 

[Major]

I'm just referring to the time Moses wrote and from the human vantage point.... hundreds of years later.

OK. It just sounded different when I read it.

 

[Major]

It is also God's Word. If the two come into conflict, I'm siding with Scripture.

Me too.

 

[BibleLover]

Isn't that reading into the Scriptures something that is not openly presented.....or assuming?

Not really. It follows the principles of rhetoric which developed from the reasoning with which God gifted us.

 

[Major]

Not really. It follows the principles of rhetoric which developed from the reasoning with which God gifted us.

Rhetoric is the ability to write or comunicate effectively.

When you say.......
"Those 3 "days" serve as rhetorical dividers to break up that vast narrative into smaller chunks", that does not seem to be rhetorical.

It seems to me to be more narrative of something that is not there.

Just my opinion.

 

[BibleLover]

Rhetoric is the ability to write or comunicate effectively.

When you say.......
"Those 3 "days" serve as rhetorical dividers to break up that vast narrative into smaller chunks", that does not seem to be rhetorical.

It seems to me to be more narrative of something that is not there.

Just my opinion.

Rhetoric also encompasses structure. It's synonymous with composition.

We know the "days" can't be literal because time doesn't exist at that point.

 

[cocoa]

I think we should take the Bible for what it says. It's dangerous to try and fit atheistic teachings into scripture.

Also if evolution had taken place, wouldn't it still be taking place? Chickens still hatch from eggs, humans are still born from sperm and egg. When was the last time you saw an ape in the transition process?

 

[Major]

Rhetoric also encompasses structure. It's synonymous with composition.

We know the "days" can't be literal because time doesn't exist at that point.

That is exactly what Old Earthers say as well.

 

[Major]

I asked Google AI..."When did the old Earth theory begin to appear in theology?"...and got this answer

The concept of an "old Earth" began appearing in theological discussions in the late 18th and early 19th centuries, predating Darwin's theory of evolution. This shift was driven by geological discoveries and scientific observations that suggested Earth was much older than the traditional 6,000 years derived from biblical interpretations.
Makes you wonder if the previous 'geological discoveries and scientific observations' floating around did not influence Darwin, and lead to a biased opinion of his findings.

That could be that scientific and physics as well as mathematics and astronomy caught up. The more telescopes and satellites and AI computers produced have increased our knowledge.

Consider that just a few years ago, the diagnosis of cancer was a death sentence.

IMHO, we must note that the Bible does not claim that the universe or the earth is only 6,000 years old. Instead, it simply states that God created the universe "in the beginning" (Genesis 1:1), without specifying how long ago that was.