The Letters To The Churches

On translating from the original, I have always chuckled about the translations in 1 Samuel and 1 & 2 Kings of a male urinating against a wall as "any that pisseth against the wall". Gotta love that phrase. What a way to distinguish a male from female.
 
So, you think that we can't be Christians without the Bible? What about the early Christians, or the ones that don't have a translation in their language yet? I don't consider the Word of God to only be the Bible.

There are no errors in what Bible? Your English Bible? There are translation issues in every Bible. An English Bible cannot be perfect. What about all the discrepancies in the Gospels? Different things happened at different times depending on what book you're reading. Those are only errors if you believe that God wrote every word in the Bible. I believe that they are eye witness accounts, or based on eye witness accounts so they don't bother me. How do you answer that? Did God need four different authors to get the point across or did He keep messing up so He tried with another author?

I can't tell if my tone is coming off as aggressive so I apologize if it is. It's not my intention to sound insulting or anything either, so please forgive me if it sounds that way.

Heb 1:1 Long ago, at many times and in many ways, God spoke to our fathers by the prophets,
Heb 1:2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world.

They did have the Word of God spoken to them through the prophets, and they would teach their children and they would memorize the Word spoken to them. They even set up alters every where to remind them of what God had spoken to them. But now in these last days God has spoken to us through his Son Jesus Christ, that is Word that became flesh. Jesus Words weather written down on paper or spoken to us, is Spirit, and it is life to us. Every Word of God needs two or three witnesses to confirm it to us. That is why we have many different accounts in the gospels, each having it own outlook in how they saw things. Right now we have three witness to every truth and that comes by the Father, Son (Word of God) and Holy Spirit. Without all three witness we do not have the truth. The human mind is the easiest thing to deceive, which is why we need all three persons of the Godhead to confirm every truth.
 
On translating from the original, I have always chuckled about the translations in 1 Samuel and 1 & 2 Kings of a male urinating against a wall as "any that pisseth against the wall". Gotta love that phrase. What a way to distinguish a male from female.
My grandmother despises the word "piss." I told her it's in the Bible and tried to show her and she refused to look. It's funny how language changes throughout the times.
Heb 1:1 Long ago, at many times and in many ways, God spoke to our fathers by the prophets,
Heb 1:2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world.

They did have the Word of God spoken to them through the prophets, and they would teach their children and they would memorize the Word spoken to them. They even set up alters every where to remind them of what God had spoken to them. But now in these last days God has spoken to us through his Son Jesus Christ, that is Word that became flesh. Jesus Words weather written down on paper or spoken to us, is Spirit, and it is life to us. Every Word of God needs two or three witnesses to confirm it to us. That is why we have many different accounts in the gospels, each having it own outlook in how they saw things. Right now we have three witness to every truth and that comes by the Father, Son (Word of God) and Holy Spirit. Without all three witness we do not have the truth. The human mind is the easiest thing to deceive, which is why we need all three persons of the Godhead to confirm every truth.

Being as there are no prophets today, how are the Christians without Bibles supposed to live? I mean, I agree with you that the people with Bibles need to be spending time in it daily, which is why I've made it such a big part of my life but I don't see how that relates to the Bible being imperfect.

You said that each Gospel account is their own outlook and how they saw things. That is exactly the way I see it too and that means God did not tell them what to write.
 
My grandmother despises the word "piss." I told her it's in the Bible and tried to show her and she refused to look. It's funny how language changes throughout the times.


Being as there are no prophets today, how are the Christians without Bibles supposed to live? I mean, I agree with you that the people with Bibles need to be spending time in it daily, which is why I've made it such a big part of my life but I don't see how that relates to the Bible being imperfect.

You said that each Gospel account is their own outlook and how they saw things. That is exactly the way I see it too and that means God did not tell them what to write.

When Adam and Eve ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil that information was passed down through to their off spring. We know the difference between right and wrong, good and evil. It is built into every human being born on planet earth.
When someone hears the Gospel they know it is right because their conscience tell them it is. Even if we don't know what the Bible, says it is still revealed inside of us what is right and wrong. There are no excuses not to believe the truth. As you become more familiar with the Bible the Lord will reveal to you the importance of his Word, and how its the Word that sustains all life.
 
No prophets today?

Not in the OT sense.

When Adam and Eve ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil that information was passed down through to their off spring. We know the difference between right and wrong, good and evil. It is built into every human being born on planet earth.
When someone hears the Gospel they know it is right because their conscience tell them it is. Even if we don't know what the Bible, says it is still revealed inside of us what is right and wrong. There are no excuses not to believe the truth. As you become more familiar with the Bible the Lord will reveal to you the importance of his Word, and how its the Word that sustains all life.

I have no idea how this relates to what we're talking about.

There is no excuse in someone not believing in the God and Jesus of the Bible when they've never heard of them?

I read my Bible daily and consider it one of the most important things in my life, so I'm not sure what you mean by your last sentence either. Just because I don't hold the same view as you doesn't mean I don't take it just as seriously as you do.
 
Rom 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth.
Rom 1:19 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them.
Rom 1:20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.

Every thing created by God is a testimony to who He is and that he exists. There is a intelligent design in everything created, nothing is in a random order. There is a pattern to everything. Looking at these things tells us that God exists, even in our own conscience testifies to him being real and alive. The grace needed for people to be saved has been revealed to all men, and this happened when God shined his light into our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the Glory of God, shining in the face of Jesus Christ. Even though some people might not have the Bible to read, all of creation and their own conscience is a testimony to the truth.

2Co 4:6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.
 
Rom 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth.
Rom 1:19 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them.
Rom 1:20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.

Every thing created by God is a testimony to who He is and that he exists. There is a intelligent design in everything created, nothing is in a random order. There is a pattern to everything. Looking at these things tells us that God exists, even in our own conscience testifies to him being real and alive. The grace needed for people to be saved has been revealed to all men, and this happened when God shined his light into our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the Glory of God, shining in the face of Jesus Christ. Even though some people might not have the Bible to read, all of creation and their own conscience is a testimony to the truth.

2Co 4:6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.
But the only way to God is through Jesus. How can someone know Jesus died for them by looking at nature? Surely you realize that doesn't make sense. Most cultures worship a creator or a controller of nature. Are they going to heaven?
 
But the only way to God is through Jesus. How can someone know Jesus died for them by looking at nature? Surely you realize that doesn't make sense. Most cultures worship a creator or a controller of nature. Are they going to heaven?

The days in which we are living there are very few places where there is not TV, or internet, or even radio broadcasts with some form of the Gospel being proclaimed. It was more evident back during the early days of the Gospel that we find places where people never heard the truth. God holds man accountable for what he knows and how he lived according to that knowledge. Unto much is given, much is required. The more you know about God's Word the more is required, and accountable for you to do it.
The Lord is just in all his dealings with man, and knows all the circumstances man was placed in during his life and judges him based on that. Someone might not have known or heard the name of Jesus Christ, but they did have his Word written on their heart and conscience to know between right and wrong.

Rom 2:14 When Gentiles who have not the [divine] Law do instinctively what the Law requires, they are a law to themselves, since they do not have the Law.
Rom 2:15 They show that the essential requirements of the Law are written in their hearts and are operating there, with which their consciences (sense of right and wrong) also bear witness; and their [moral] decisions (their arguments of reason, their condemning or approving thoughts) will accuse or perhaps defend and excuse [them]
Rom 2:16 On that day when, as my Gospel proclaims, God by Jesus Christ will judge men in regard to the things which they conceal (their hidden thoughts). [Eccl. 12:14.]
 
The days in which we are living there are very few places where there is not TV, or internet, or even radio broadcasts with some form of the Gospel being proclaimed. It was more evident back during the early days of the Gospel that we find places where people never heard the truth. God holds man accountable for what he knows and how he lived according to that knowledge. Unto much is given, much is required. The more you know about God's Word the more is required, and accountable for you to do it.
The Lord is just in all his dealings with man, and knows all the circumstances man was placed in during his life and judges him based on that. Someone might not have known or heard the name of Jesus Christ, but they did have his Word written on their heart and conscience to know between right and wrong.

Rom 2:14 When Gentiles who have not the [divine] Law do instinctively what the Law requires, they are a law to themselves, since they do not have the Law.
Rom 2:15 They show that the essential requirements of the Law are written in their hearts and are operating there, with which their consciences (sense of right and wrong) also bear witness; and their [moral] decisions (their arguments of reason, their condemning or approving thoughts) will accuse or perhaps defend and excuse [them]
Rom 2:16 On that day when, as my Gospel proclaims, God by Jesus Christ will judge men in regard to the things which they conceal (their hidden thoughts). [Eccl. 12:14.]
So is what we have naturally enough for salvation or not?

I don't know why you changed the subject.
 
Rom 2:14 When Gentiles who have not the [divine] Law do instinctively what the Law requires, they are a law to themselves, since they do not have the Law.
Rom 2:15 They show that the essential requirements of the Law are written in their hearts and are operating there, with which their consciences (sense of right and wrong) also bear witness; and their [moral] decisions (their arguments of reason, their condemning or approving thoughts) will accuse or perhaps defend and excuse [them]
Rom 2:16 On that day when, as my Gospel proclaims, God by Jesus Christ will judge men in regard to the things which they conceal (their hidden thoughts). [Eccl. 12:14.]
These scriptures are describing a "born-again" gentile believer! "the law written upon the heart" is the Spirit

Gentiles and all unsaved folks are by "nature" children of wrath...


Ro 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another

Read the bible IN CONTEXT! And DONT ADD TO IT!

Ro 2:26 Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?
27 And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?
28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
 
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So is what we have naturally enough for salvation or not?

I don't know why you changed the subject.

To be able to understand the mysteries of the Kingdom of God you need the written Word of God, as the Lord uses His Word to teach and confirm everything. As new born Christians we are unsure of the voice of God, and need his written Word that we can see and hear by their physical senses. As we grow in the Lord, his voice becomes much more discernible, yet we still need to have the Bible as a confirmation so we do not go astray. No man can come to Jesus unless the Father draw him. This can be done without having the Bible in hand, but once the Father draws a person to himself that person comes to the risen Lord and to his written Word. This were we get our strength from. Like Jesus said, "unless you eat my flesh, and drink my blood you have no life in you"

John 6:53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
John 6:54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
John 6:55 For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
John 6:56 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.

John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
 
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To be able to understand the mysteries of the Kingdom of God you need the written Word of God, as the Lord uses His Word to teach and confirm everything. As new born Christians we are unsure of the voice of God, and need his written Word that we can see and hear by their physical senses. As we grow in the Lord, his voice becomes much more discernible, yet we still need to have the Bible as a confirmation so we do not go astray. No man can come to Jesus unless the Father draw him. This can be done without having the Bible in hand, but once the Father draws a person to himself that person comes to the risen Lord and to his written Word. This were we get our strength from. Like Jesus said, "unless you eat my flesh, and drink my blood you have no life in you"

John 6:53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
John 6:54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
John 6:55 For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
John 6:56 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.

John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
That has nothing to do with inerrancy or the subject. We aren't talking about anyone's relationship with God. That wasn't what we were talking about. Let's bring it back to the original topic.
 
When Adam and Eve ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil that information was passed down through to their off spring. We know the difference between right and wrong, good and evil. It is built into every human being born on planet earth.
When someone hears the Gospel they know it is right because their conscience tell them it is. Even if we don't know what the Bible, says it is still revealed inside of us what is right and wrong. There are no excuses not to believe the truth. As you become more familiar with the Bible the Lord will reveal to you the importance of his Word, and how its the Word that sustains all life.
Alright, here's where we got off track. Are you going to answer my questions about the Gospels or not? There is no point in questioning my relationship with God or my knowledge of the Bible as that is not relevant to our discussion. I shouldn't have even responded to this so that we could have stayed on topic.
 
Alright, here's where we got off track. Are you going to answer my questions about the Gospels or not? There is no point in questioning my relationship with God or my knowledge of the Bible as that is not relevant to our discussion. I shouldn't have even responded to this so that we could have stayed on topic.

Maybe I am not understanding your question. Tell me again.
 
Maybe I am not understanding your question. Tell me again.
You said that each of the Gospels is an individuals account as they saw it. If God wrote the Bible then why are individuals writing their view? If they are only being used to write God's words then the Gospels don't make any sense. There would be no view according to people, only according to God. Is that not right?
 
You said that each of the Gospels is an individuals account as they saw it. If God wrote the Bible then why are individuals writing their view? If they are only being used to write God's words then the Gospels don't make any sense. There would be no view according to people, only according to God. Is that not right?

All scripture in the Bible is God breathed, which means as God moved upon the hearts of men through the Holy Spirit men spoke words out of their mouth. These words were written down as scripture. Even though every child of God is born of the Spirit, and filled with his Spirit, the way God's anointing and Spirit that flows out of me would be different then how it would flow and come out of you. Same Spirit, same anointing, same God, yet this is what makes us individuals, and unique as Christians. If not we would just all be the same! The account of each Apostle was given by the Spirit of God so we would see things a little bit different from the others, even though there are many similarities between the Gospels. This was God's doing not man.
 
All scripture in the Bible is God breathed, which means as God moved upon the hearts of men through the Holy Spirit men spoke words out of their mouth. These words were written down as scripture. Even though every child of God is born of the Spirit, and filled with his Spirit, the way God's anointing and Spirit that flows out of me would be different then how it would flow and come out of you. Same Spirit, same anointing, same God, yet this is what makes us individuals, and unique as Christians. If not we would just all be the same! The account of each Apostle was given by the Spirit of God so we would see things a little bit different from the others, even though there are many similarities between the Gospels. This was God's doing not man.
But wouldn't that mean that the Bible wasn't actually dictated by God? I guess that's what I'm not understanding. If you are "inspired" by the Holy Spirit and you write something then God didn't actually write it, you did. Right? I mean, there is a difference between that and God telling you what to write.
 
The bible---in particular, the gospels---is not a dictation. It is written by men who have been inspired by Holy Spirit to write God's message of truth, but not without the human perspective each has. The miracle of it all is that each gospel correlates, as does each single book of the entire bible. Not one single contradiction is found among the 40 writers of all scripture.
 
The bible---in particular, the gospels---is not a dictation. It is written by men who have been inspired by Holy Spirit to write God's message of truth, but not without the human perspective each has. The miracle of it all is that each gospel correlates, as does each single book of the entire bible. Not one single contradiction is found among the 40 writers of all scripture.

I don't believe that the Bible was dictated by God either. But I also don't hold that it's inerrant in it's current form.
 
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