As a Christian we are living in two different worlds all at the same time. The physical which is "time based", and the "eternal realm" while we are sitting on the right hand of God in Christ. Certainly we should be fully aware of all our spiritual eternal surroundings in Christ in the Kingdom of light. We have no problems being fully aware of this time based world, while living in these temporary physical bodies. We should be fully aware of both realms all at the same time, and if we are not then there is a problem in our spiritual growth.
Third and Fourth Dimensional Living
- Thread starter Noblemen
- Start date
As a Christian we are living in two different worlds all at the same time. The physical which is "time based", and the "eternal realm" while we are sitting on the right hand of God in Christ. Certainly we should be fully aware of all our spiritual eternal surroundings in Christ in the Kingdom of light. We have no problems being fully aware of this time based world, while living in these temporary physical bodies. We should be fully aware of both realms all at the same time, and if we are not then there is a problem in our spiritual growth.
But, if you start with a singularity, (ie no dimension) then you move along the fist dimension; 'X';
A--------B---------------------->>>
since there is no limit to this dimension, how can it contain time? Only when we place an arbitrary limit such as from A to B (distance) can we experience, or envision some kind of noticeable difference. We can name this noticeable difference.'time'
So what if we now have an extra dimension,,'Y', ......same thing?
But what if we were to move in a mix of 'X' and 'Y' ie. at say 30 degrees to 'X'.?
This thing we have called time would be AB/cos30.
can't happen, so I would question the soundness of these Assumptions.....what do you think?
How can we really relate time as a 4th dimension to the other three?
1. You cannot move without time.
2. No limit is infinite time is like going in a circle with no start or end. It is the Alpha and Omega.
3. A mix of 'X' and 'Y' is 2D.
4. Time as a dimension is up to how you wish the think it. (see link). I prefer to think 'time' as a dimension due to the nature of 'light' which is the basis of our perceived reality. The 3D vs 4D has been going since 1905, Einstein's Theory of Relativity.
In relation to the Original Thread, and as previous posts have mentioned. We are multidimensional beings. Firstly, because we have a spirit as well as a body. Secondly, all matter contain mutli-dimensionality beyond 3D/4D - according to String Theory. Our spirit is a life at home in another realm within our own physical-body worldly one (3D/4D).
I like a simple cosmogony with no strings attached.....but that is me.
Hello there,
These things are truly beyond the realm of our understanding. The Truth is in Jesus. The simplicity that is in Him, is something that we should cherish, for it is God's provision for us, and live in thankfulness and praise for His love and grace.
We can only conjecture about such matters as dimensions, time and space etc., and our imaginings are vain at best.
Let God be true and every man a liar.
In Christ Jesus
Chris
These things are truly beyond the realm of our understanding. The Truth is in Jesus. The simplicity that is in Him, is something that we should cherish, for it is God's provision for us, and live in thankfulness and praise for His love and grace.
We can only conjecture about such matters as dimensions, time and space etc., and our imaginings are vain at best.
Let God be true and every man a liar.
In Christ Jesus
Chris
This is not necessarily so. Each to their own level of understanding.
I have found much depth of conviction and faith in God's marvelous and mysterious creation. I love the humility and wonder of God's omniscience. I am not trying to prove that God can be claimed, categorized, put in a box, or to disprove. For me, it is an invitation to glorify God's Truth.
Many a scientist has found God through deep science and mathematics, and I am one of them.
'But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God:
for they are foolishness unto him:
neither can he know them,
because they are spiritually discerned.'
(1 Cor.2:14 )
'That we henceforth be no more children,
tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine,
by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness,
whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
But speaking the truth in love,
may grow up into Him in all things,
which is The Head, even Christ:
From whom the whole body fitly joined together
and compacted by that which every joint supplieth,
according to the effectual working in the measure of every part,
maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.
This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord,
that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk,
in the vanity of their mind,
Having the understanding darkened,
being alienated from the life of God
through the ignorance that is in them,
because of the blindness of their heart:
Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness,
to work all uncleanness with greediness.
But ye have not so learned Christ; ... '
(Eph 4:14-20)
'Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh:
yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh,
yet now henceforth know we Him no more.
Therefore if any man be in Christ,
He is a new creature:
old things are passed away;
behold, all things are become new.
And all things are of God,
Who hath reconciled us to Himself by Jesus Christ, ... '
(2Cor 5:16-18)
Praise God!
Thank you @Noblemen
In Christ Jesus
Our risen and glorified
Saviour, Lord and Head.
Chris
Hello @Peter Luke,
Yes, I understand. I also glory in the wonder of creation and in the findings of scientific research, for I see in it the hand of God and rejoice in it.
God Bless
(From one new creation to another)
In Christ Jesus
Chris
Hello there,
I believe that staying within the parameters of the wording of Scripture is the only safe place to be. So I will content myself with the only reference that speaks of four dimensions, and rest there (Eph 3:14-21) in faith, actively believing that what God says He will surely do.
'For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
Of Whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named,
That He would grant you,
according to the riches of His glory,
to be strengthened with might by His Spirit in the inner man;
That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith;
that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,
May be able to comprehend with all saints
what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge,
that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.
Now unto Him that is able
to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think,
according to the power that worketh in us,
Unto HIM be glory in the church
by Christ Jesus
throughout all ages,
world without end.
Amen.'
Praise His Holy Name!
In Christ Jesus
Chris
I believe that staying within the parameters of the wording of Scripture is the only safe place to be. So I will content myself with the only reference that speaks of four dimensions, and rest there (Eph 3:14-21) in faith, actively believing that what God says He will surely do.
'For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
Of Whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named,
That He would grant you,
according to the riches of His glory,
to be strengthened with might by His Spirit in the inner man;
That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith;
that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,
May be able to comprehend with all saints
what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge,
that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.
Now unto Him that is able
to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think,
according to the power that worketh in us,
Unto HIM be glory in the church
by Christ Jesus
throughout all ages,
world without end.
Amen.'
Praise His Holy Name!
In Christ Jesus
Chris
OK peoples, all levity aside, I think it is dangerous,(though not perilous) to toy with these ideas of extra dimensions extending into the spiritual realms.
We do know from God's word that the physical creation is to be done away with in the proper time.
If, if the spiritual was a forth dimension, when the first three are done away with, the forth would possibly be cut loose so to speak and well, be something like a ship drifting aimlessly.
I think Complete in post #25 is right on the money.
We do know from God's word that the physical creation is to be done away with in the proper time.
If, if the spiritual was a forth dimension, when the first three are done away with, the forth would possibly be cut loose so to speak and well, be something like a ship drifting aimlessly.
I think Complete in post #25 is right on the money.
The physical time based world is not the same as the eternal (timeless) spiritual world, but they are similar. The physical temporary realm is only a shadow of the eternal, and this is why God created the physical world so as to give spiritually dead men the ability to understand the eternal spiritual realm as is stated in the book of Romans.
Rom 1:20.. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
God is not a part of any forth dimension in this physical realm, but he does have four dimensions that scripture tells us we can understand once we get rooted and grounded in love (God).
Eph 3:17.. That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,
Eph 3:18.. May be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
Eph 3:19.. And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.
This comprehension can never be understood by man's "brain" in his head, but the heart of man (rebirth spirit) can. The word "knowledge" that this comprehension of these dimensions of God passes, is information gained by man physical senses, including his physical brain. The truth of these four dimensions of God can only be revealed by God himself through his Spirit.
If we say we can never understand these things, that would be a "cop out", and we will truly never know them, as you can not know, or understand anything beyond your faith. You have to "believe" first before you can know them.
Rom 1:20.. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
God is not a part of any forth dimension in this physical realm, but he does have four dimensions that scripture tells us we can understand once we get rooted and grounded in love (God).
Eph 3:17.. That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,
Eph 3:18.. May be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
Eph 3:19.. And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.
This comprehension can never be understood by man's "brain" in his head, but the heart of man (rebirth spirit) can. The word "knowledge" that this comprehension of these dimensions of God passes, is information gained by man physical senses, including his physical brain. The truth of these four dimensions of God can only be revealed by God himself through his Spirit.
If we say we can never understand these things, that would be a "cop out", and we will truly never know them, as you can not know, or understand anything beyond your faith. You have to "believe" first before you can know them.
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Physical light has a specific speed at which it travels, which means "time" must be associated with light as it takes time for light to reach a certain spot in our universe. It takes about eight minutes for light from the sun to reach the earth. God is "light", yet he himself also travels at the speed of light, also known as his Glory. The difference between physical light, and the Glory (light) of God is that the light of God has no specific speed at which it travels. We know Jesus is coming back in a "moment" at the twinkling of an eye, (1 Cor 15:52) which means Jesus is going to be travailing from one place to another. The word, "moment" in 1 Cor 15:52 is the Greek word, "atomos". This is where we get our English word "atomic" from. We know atomic clocks are the most accurate in the world, and we can measure minutes, seconds, thousands of seconds, millionth of a second with great accuracy. But, the word "atomos" is something that can not be subdivided down into anything less than what it already is, which means atomos is instantaneous in its travel!! It takes God no time at all to travel from one side of the universe to the other as it is instantaneous in its speed.
Physical light (electro magnetic radiation) can not come anywhere close to that!!
Physical light (electro magnetic radiation) can not come anywhere close to that!!
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It is also very interesting that when Jesus had fasted for forty days, the devil came and took Jesus in "a moment of time" (Luke 4:5) to show him all the kingdoms of the world. The word "moment" here is not the word "atomos", but it is the word, "stigme" which means "a puncture in time". I think Albert Einstein believed that space time was like a "fabric" that can be folded, and punctured to be able to travel great distances that would not be possible if one was simply travailing in a straight line. According to Quantum physics this is possible.
Possibly if anyone really searched the scriptures we would have known many many years before Albert Einstein, that the heaven with all of its space, and time associated with it is "like" a "fabric", that eventually will be folded up up like a cloth.
Heb 1:10.. And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:
Heb 1:11.. They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment;
Heb 1:12.. And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.
Sorry to pick out your post Chris it wouldn't let me post any other way. This is not directed at you, just a quote toward the thread.
Science, mathematics, intellect has always been able to prove or disprove God.
If you have come to salvation by any of these means that is wonderful.
The point I would make toward this conversation is until the Holy Spirit reveals "Christ in you" as your only life, there will come a time in your Christian walk you will find yourself, flustrated, confused, in total chaos and "among men most miserable."
From the "Dawn 2000" talk, is taken from Evangelicals Now, April 1995, p.9 (Cho's words are in italic)
"One almost stood in awe at the amount of time this man spends in prayer each day, and yet one felt grave concern at his philosophy of prayer.
He gave us two reasons why we should pray. Firstly, "God has a tremendous need, and we minister to his need of fellowship"
Question. If Cho is right, how did the Godhead survive before we were created???
"If you have come to salvation by any of these means that is wonderful."
I always thought that salvation was through the Lord Jesus Christ by faith and nothing else.
I am not picking a fight with you here, just passing on some information which is very informative and available to everyone who wants to look it up at......http://www.christchurch-virginiawater.co.uk/articles/cho.html.
That is only one of many web sites where information can be found is one chooses to know.
"There is well attested documentary evidence that David Yonggi Cho's teaching is heretical. Hank Hanegraaff, in Christianity in Crisis, claims Cho's teaching "is nothing short of occultism..." and "a departure from historic Christian theology..." (p.353) Yonggi Cho's most famous book is entitled The Fourth Dimension. In it he dares to assert that we can control the Lord Jesus with our words.............
"You create the presence of Jesus with your mouth. If you speak about salvation, the saving Jesus appears. If you speak about divine healing, then you will have the healing Christ in your congregation. If you speak the miracle performing Jesus, then the presence of the miracle performing Jesus is released. He is bound by your lips and by your words. He is depending on you." Fourth Dimension, (page 83)
This is not the Lord Jesus Christ of the Christian faith as revealed in the Scriptures, but a "Jesus" of his own imagination or worse. "
Not true. How typical!
That excerpt is true and biblical!
Holy Spirit attests to the truth that when we speak the truth of God's word in faith concerning His promises...Jesus will perform it.
Too many people are nor being fed the right spiritual food in the churches today. Consequently, because they don't see the works of Christ bringing amazing results, they quickly poo poo them.
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It's so typical to lazily heed and parrot the critics. Read the book yourself.