What day is the Sabbath ? (Staff edit of title by request)

#1
The current week on our Gregorian calendar continued without break from the previous Julian calendar; from
THURSDAY 4th October 1582
to FRIDAY 15th October 1582
on the Gregorian calendar:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gregorian_calendar

However this calendar took hundreds of years to be accepted by other countries, England didn't accept the new Gregorian calendar till the 2nd September 1752):

https://www.timeanddate.com/calendar...1752&country=9

The Julian calendar began on the 1st January 45BC:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_calendar


However this calendar also took hundreds of years to be accepted by other countries and over the 1st to 3rd centuries AD, the Roman Empire gradually replaced it's old 8 day Roman week calendar with this new 7 day week Julian calendar:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_calendar

Now the 1st of January 1 AD was a SATURDAY:
https://www.timeanddate.com/calendar/?year=1&country=9

This matches Torahcalendar.com:

http://www.torahcalendar.com/Calendar.asp?YM=Y-1M10

Which would make the 1st of January 45 BC a FRIDAY:

http://www.torahcalendar.com/Calendar.asp?YM=Y-46M10


But what was the day before? Because the Romans were previously using an 8 day week calendar before this date and the days were not called Monday, Tuesday etc (which are names based on Roman gods), but instead the days were listed simply as; A, B, C, D, E, F, G, & H (8 Days):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_calendar


Therefore how can the Roman Julian 7 day week calendar invented by the pagan Greek Mathematician Sosigenes in 45 BC over a 1000 miles away from Israel? have anything to do with the 7 day week the Jews and Israelites had been using for hundreds of years before this new 7 day week was ever invented?

The answer to this problem may surprise you and you can find out by studying any of these links:

Texts:

https://guidetothebible.wordpress.com/start-reading-the-book/
http://www.hope-of-israel.org/sabtosat.htm

Videos:

The Creator's Calendar
9 min long (or faster with the high speed setting):


15 mins (or faster with the high speed setting):
International Date Line Change: The Sabbath Unchanged by Worlds Last Chance Ministries?

79 min (or faster with the high speed setting):
Robert-Aaron Richmond explains from scripture how God’s Calendar works:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=wJq8tKvnemU

All links deemed ok
 
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Fish Catcher Jim

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Senior Moderator
#2
After review we have decided to open this thread back up with the Friendly Reminder
That arguing and insisting one is correct over another is in violation of forum policies.

If this should happen then the thread will be closed and removed and points and or bans may be issued.

Be polite and Let God's Word Speak For You.
Blessings
 

Cturtle

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Senior Moderator
#5
I think it depends upon what's important to others (priority wise) and what their opinion is on the validity of the information presented. And the time they have, to spend trying to figure things out.

There is a lot more important things than trying to figure out times and how close we are... when only the Father knows anyway. Figuring out how to walk, and put Jesus commands into practice is more important than putting energy into figuring out exactly how much time is left.

Soul winning is of the utmost importance/priority .... getting as many into the kingdom, and teaching them to be ready is where the Father's heart is at.

If we spend more time on wood, hay and stubble... it will be burnt up at judgement and we will have allowed those things to distract us from what The Father has truly called us to do.


Blessings
 
#6
I think it depends upon what's important to others (priority wise) and what their opinion is on the validity of the information presented. And the time they have, to spend trying to figure things out.

There is a lot more important things than trying to figure out times and how close we are... when only the Father knows anyway. Figuring out how to walk, and put Jesus commands into practice is more important than putting energy into figuring out exactly how much time is left.

Soul winning is of the utmost importance/priority .... getting as many into the kingdom, and teaching them to be ready is where the Father's heart is at.

If we spend more time on wood, hay and stubble... it will be burnt up at judgement and we will have allowed those things to distract us from what The Father has truly called us to do.

Blessings
Why did you think it was about that? It's to do with when the Sabbath is. Perhaps I should change the title to 'When is the Sabbath?' Is there a way to do that?
 
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ModeratorTeam

CFS Moderators
#7
In light of new details, the Staff at CFS is once again closing this thread, for the time being, while the content and direction of this topic is discussed in private with the originator of this thread.

ADD ON: Staff has completed evaluation. The title has been edited, as per a request, and this thread can continue. We would like to remind readers that the actual time line of the Sabbath has been somewhat subjective for centuries and we ask all participants not to criticize others for their thoughts on this topic.
 
#8
Thanks staff; Yes it does seem that way. I mean if we trace the Sabbath using our familiar Gregorian and Julian calendars we get back to Friday 1st of January 45BC but the day before this on the ancient Roman calendar that had been in use for several hundred years, was calculated by using an 8 day week. So it's hard to trace the Sabbath using any of these calendars; because of course the Israelite's had been obviously using there own 7 day week calendar for hundreds of year prior to the Roman people even existing. Something for us to ponder no doubt.
 
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#9
I look at the Sabbath as my "personal day" with the Lord: here is my reasoning.

In Leviticus 16 KJV, the Lord is talking to Moses.
30 For on that day shall the priest make an atonement for you, to cleanse you, that ye may be clean from all your sins before the Lord.
31 It shall be a sabbath of rest unto you, and ye shall afflict your souls, by a statute for ever.

I read this as Moses' sabbath because,
Leviticus 23 KJV
24 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation.
25 Ye shall do no servile work therein: but ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the Lord.
26 And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying,
27 Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be a day of atonement: it shall be an holy convocation unto you; and ye shall afflict your souls, and offer an offering made by fire unto the Lord.
28 And ye shall do no work in that same day: for it is a day of atonement, to make an atonement for you before the Lord your God.
29 For whatsoever soul it be that shall not be afflicted in that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people.
30 And whatsoever soul it be that doeth any work in that same day, the same soul will I destroy from among his people.
31 Ye shall do no manner of work: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations in all your dwellings.
32 It shall be unto you a sabbath of rest, and ye shall afflict your souls: in the ninth day of the month at even, from even unto even, shall ye celebrate your sabbath.
(the 1st day of 7th month they shall have a sabbath - also the 10th day of 7th month shall be unto you a sabbath of rest) = only 3 day later.

So this brings up the question - are there two types of sabbaths? The Lord's and personal?
Even though I presented my feelings, I agree with what "cturtle" said and this is why:

Exodus 20:8 KJV Remember the Sabbath and keep it Holy.

Matthew 12:7-8 KJV 7 But if ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless. 8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.

Colossians 2:15-17 AMP 15 [God] disarmed the principalities and powers that were ranged against us and made a bold display and public example of them, in triumphing over them in Him and in it [the cross]. 16 Therefore let no one sit in judgment on you in matters of food and drink, or with regard to a feast day or a New Moon or a Sabbath. 17 Such [things] are only the shadow of things that are to come, andthey have only a symbolic value. But the reality (the substance, the solid fact of what is foreshadowed, the body of it) belongs to Christ.
 
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#10
I look at the Sabbath as my "personal day" with the Lord: here is my reasoning.

In Leviticus 16 KJV, the Lord is talking to Moses.
30 For on that day shall the priest make an atonement for you, to cleanse you, that ye may be clean from all your sins before the Lord.
31 It shall be a sabbath of rest unto you, and ye shall afflict your souls, by a statute for ever.

I read this as Moses' sabbath because,
Leviticus 23 KJV
24 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation.
25 Ye shall do no servile work therein: but ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the Lord.
26 And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying,
27 Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be a day of atonement: it shall be an holy convocation unto you; and ye shall afflict your souls, and offer an offering made by fire unto the Lord.
28 And ye shall do no work in that same day: for it is a day of atonement, to make an atonement for you before the Lord your God.
29 For whatsoever soul it be that shall not be afflicted in that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people.
30 And whatsoever soul it be that doeth any work in that same day, the same soul will I destroy from among his people.
31 Ye shall do no manner of work: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations in all your dwellings.
32 It shall be unto you a sabbath of rest, and ye shall afflict your souls: in the ninth day of the month at even, from even unto even, shall ye celebrate your sabbath.
(the 1st day of 7th month they shall have a sabbath - also the 10th day of 7th month shall be unto you a sabbath of rest) = only 3 day later.

So this brings up the question - are there two types of sabbaths? The Lord's and personal?
Even though I presented my feelings, I agree with what "cturtle" said and this is why:

Exodus 20:8 KJV Remember the Sabbath and keep it Holy.

Matthew 12:7-8 KJV 7 But if ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless. 8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.

Colossians 2:15-17 AMP 15 [God] disarmed the principalities and powers that were ranged against us and made a bold display and public example of them, in triumphing over them in Him and in it [the cross]. 16 Therefore let no one sit in judgment on you in matters of food and drink, or with regard to a feast day or a New Moon or a Sabbath. 17 Such [things] are only the shadow of things that are to come, andthey have only a symbolic value. But the reality (the substance, the solid fact of what is foreshadowed, the body of it) belongs to Christ.
Yes me too, and in some ways every day is a Sabbath, spiritually speaking. Yet there are many Christians who hold to a particular day for their worship to be held on. Such as Catholics with Sunday or 7th day Adventist and Saturday. Also there are the Jews who hold to this day too and Muslims on Friday. However, this simple piece of information about the history of the Roman calendar and it's total separate 7 day cycle to that of the Israelite 7 day weekly cycle makes them seem rather lost in a false paradigm. Funny really when you think about it.
 
#11
I have translations to blame for this continued misunderstanding.

Genesis 2:2 (KJV)
And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.​

As if God can get tired... the word "rested" here is really "ceased", He stopped what He was doing. The first "it is finished" if you will. Furthermore, you have the day of the week it happened, the seventh. The word for seven in Hebrew is an extension of what happened that day: ceased.

Sabbath: שבת
Seven: שביעי (ordinal of seven which is שבע)

שבע is a special word because it is also used to indicate completeness and has these meanings: joy, satisfaction, complete, fulfill, plenty, abundance, enough, oath, swear

So the completion of a week is the last day, seven. Sabbath.
 

bobinfaith

Helper
Staff member
Helper
#12
I have translations to blame for this continued misunderstanding.

Genesis 2:2 (KJV)
And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.​

As if God can get tired... the word "rested" here is really "ceased", He stopped what He was doing. The first "it is finished" if you will. Furthermore, you have the day of the week it happened, the seventh. The word for seven in Hebrew is an extension of what happened that day: ceased.

Sabbath: שבת
Seven: שביעי (ordinal of seven which is שבע)

שבע is a special word because it is also used to indicate completeness and has these meanings: joy, satisfaction, complete, fulfill, plenty, abundance, enough, oath, swear

So the completion of a week is the last day, seven. Sabbath.
Hello Abdicate;

Thank you for sharing. Its very interesting how the Hebrew takes the meanings beyond "rest" to fulfill, abundance, etc...and "days completed." In Hebrews is there an instance when a "meaning" will be used over another, not just in Genesis 2:2 but throughout the Old Testament?

God bless you, brother, and your family.
 
#14
Hello Abdicate;

Thank you for sharing. Its very interesting how the Hebrew takes the meanings beyond "rest" to fulfill, abundance, etc...and "days completed." In Hebrews is there an instance when a "meaning" will be used over another, not just in Genesis 2:2 but throughout the Old Testament?

God bless you, brother, and your family.
Oh indeed there is. See Hebrew is a very creative language and so there are themes to words instead of a one-to-one translation. Much like a root word that branches into other meanings. It's so amazing that even every letter has its own meaning. The word father is אב in Hebrew. The letters have the following meaning:

  • א - sacrifice, leader, strength, one, thousand
  • ב - "in", tent, house
So we can see from the letters that a father is the strength of the house. The meanings are derived by the context of the surrounding words - i.e. within context.
 
#16
I always thought it was Sunday....so which is it? Saturday or Sunday?
If we trace the Sabbath using our familiar Gregorian/Julian calendars we get all the way back to Friday 1st of January 45BC which was the very first day of the new Julian calendar but the day before this was calculated using an ancient Roman calendar that had an 8 day week and had been used for several hundred years. Here's a picture of it:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_calendar

Meanwhile the Israelites had been using using there own separate 7 day week calendar for hundreds of year prior to the Roman people even existing. Therefore the Sabbath can not be calculated using our modern Julian/Gregorian calendar.

If you want to know when the Sabbath really is please read the OP.
 
#18
Hello Christian Guy;

This has been most interesting with good learning. Thank you for blessing us with your thread.

God bless you and your family.
God bless you Bob

When I discovered this myself it was quite the revelation, as it is not widely know about and when I've tried to discuss it most Christians will dismiss it which only adds to the reason why more people are not talking about it, but this is probably it is quite complicated to understand and it took me quite a while to understand myself when I happened to stumble across it when I found this rather long article:

http://www.hope-of-israel.org/sabtosat.htm

However, it is always a joy when someone like yourself sees what I am on about.

God bless you
 
#19
The Sabbath of the Jews, instituted by God ends on Saturday, the 7th day, because it was the day He ceased from His work of Creation. Rome didn't exist then. Don't muddle man's ideas with God's commandments and institution.
 
#20
The Sabbath of the Jews, instituted by God ends on Saturday, the 7th day, because it was the day He ceased from His work of Creation. Rome didn't exist then. Don't muddle man's ideas with God's commandments and institution.
No your are 'muddling' it. The Israelite's came before the Romans. The Roman 7 day week was made totally independently from the Israelite 7 day week, all the evidence shows this.