What does it mean?

[In Awe of Him]

I am hoping that this thread will birth a healthy and loving discussion on what it means to speak truth with love?

Are we so eager to correct a brother/sister in error/sin that we forget to pray and consult the Lord on how we should approach?

Are we just looking to correct so that we might feel better ourselves so as to wash the blood off our hands?

Are we able to have a healthy discussion with the one who is in error/sin? or do we simply speak and close the discussion without listening and offering Godly counsel?

In my life... I have experienced those who point their fingers and judge without much else to add.... but.... BUT.... I have also experienced the believer who is so FILLED with WISDOM... HUMILITY and LOVE... that they understand the need for careful consideration in how they go about with their correction. Their counsel invites dialogue. They do not seem afraid of getting "dirty" so to speak... and because of this.... trust is earned and the one who is in error is gently led to the TRUTH without guilt or condemnation.

THAT to me is what a spirit filled Christian is supposed to be. That is how Jesus operated. He NEVER condemned... He gently corrected and offered the TRUTH.

Heavenly Father... I desire to be the type of Christian that is not afraid to get dirty... and not afraid to speak truth. Jesus did this so effortlessly. Why is it so difficult for us to humble ourselves and lead by example?

I know for myself... I have NEVER been changed by the one who dare point a finger of judgement at me... but I have been deeply changed by the one who dared explain things to me in a loving and nurturing manner.

 

[forgiven61]

speak truth with love?

you speak it out of Love just because its told to them its wrong does not mean its not in Love. you correct a child out of Love if they steal something you tell them its wrong. in most cases you make them take it back and apologize or pay and apologize . we spank the Child out of Love .

just because your told its WRONG does not mean one is judging or finger pointing . wrong is wrong and right is right most of the time the problem is how it is received due to the fact the person getting corrected has a attitude problem

Galatians 2:11-13



​

11 But when Peter was come to Antioch," I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed."
12 For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
13 And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.

 

[In Awe of Him]

you speak it out of Love just because its told to them its wrong does not mean its not in Love. you correct a child out of Love if they steal something you tell them its wrong. in most cases you make them take it back and apologize or pay and apologize . we spank the Child out of Love .

just because your told its WRONG does not mean one is judging or finger pointing . wrong is wrong and right is right most of the time the problem is how it is received due to the fact the person getting corrected has a attitude problem

Galatians 2:11-13​

I absolutely agree with you forgiven61. Speaking truth is important... correction within the body of Christ is important... however... so is prayerful consideration on how a situation should be dealt with.

Like I expressed in the original post... I have had experience with those who just seem to DELIGHT in correcting = you're wrong and END of DISCUSSION.... as well as those who will work with an individual who is in error so that they might SEE the truth clearly.

I think the problem is honestly that some people can SAY they are speaking the truth in LOVE but their actions and non-verbal behaviour state quite the opposite.

This is a tender topic for me because I come from a legalistic family and it got so bad that I chose to walk away from them.

Thank you for your contribution Forgiven.

 

[forgiven61]

would it be love if you did not speak up?

I come from a legalistic family and it got so bad that I chose to walk away from them.

rest assured i am not legalistic . Love covers a multitude of sins Grace for the sinner and anyone who has fell short. the legalist has to beg to stay saved due to anything will send you to hell.

I think the problem is honestly that some people can SAY they are speaking the truth in LOVE but their actions and non-verbal behaviour state quite the opposite.

once again its a 2 way street there are those who say one thing but do another. if i say to a individual that is drunk. your drunk . that is not judging. they judged them self . how ever if i go out drinking after saying that .i go out and get drunk then i just judged my self.

the 2 popular scriptures a person uses when they take offense judge not lest ye be judged and those with out sin cast the. first stone . the lgbt use this alot

 

[In Awe of Him]

once again its a 2 way street there are those who say one thing but do another

I think every human being on the face of the earth at times falls into that category.

As I have often said... I am absolutely on the side of TRUTH. What I'm not on the side of is harshness and those who simply have nothing better to do than get their last two cents worth.
I believe that sometimes saying NOTHING is the best policy.... and that does NOT mean one is condoning something... it just means knowing thyself and understanding that if we are lacking something... then perhaps we should let someone else take over who is better equipped.

Perhaps this is a bigger problem in forums like this where it is impossible to judge the tone and sometimes our words fall hard.
This is where flowery words are sometimes a benefit ( HAHAHA.... that's a joke ).

 

[In Awe of Him]

I am hoping others will contribute on how they deal with correction of error/sin.

 

[forgiven61]

I believe that sometimes saying NOTHING is the best policy..

very seldom ive seen sparks that should have been tended to. that turned into huge fires

 

[In Awe of Him]

very seldom ive seen sparks that should have been tended to. that turned into huge fires

God bless you forgiven... I think we are going to agree to disagree with this issue. However... I am delighted we were able to get over our little locking of horns.

 

[BibleLover]

I am hoping that this thread will birth a healthy and loving discussion on what it means to speak truth with love?

Are we so eager to correct a brother/sister in error/sin that we forget to pray and consult the Lord on how we should approach?

Are we just looking to correct so that we might feel better ourselves so as to wash the blood off our hands?

Are we able to have a healthy discussion with the one who is in error/sin? or do we simply speak and close the discussion without listening and offering Godly counsel?

In my life... I have experienced those who point their fingers and judge without much else to add.... but.... BUT.... I have also experienced the believer who is so FILLED with WISDOM... HUMILITY and LOVE... that they understand the need for careful consideration in how they go about with their correction. Their counsel invites dialogue. They do not seem afraid of getting "dirty" so to speak... and because of this.... trust is earned and the one who is in error is gently led to the TRUTH without guilt or condemnation.

THAT to me is what a spirit filled Christian is supposed to be. That is how Jesus operated. He NEVER condemned... He gently corrected and offered the TRUTH.

Heavenly Father... I desire to be the type of Christian that is not afraid to get dirty... and not afraid to speak truth. Jesus did this so effortlessly. Why is it so difficult for us to humble ourselves and lead by example?

I know for myself... I have NEVER been changed by the one who dare point a finger of judgement at me... but I have been deeply changed by the one who dared explain things to me in a loving and nurturing manner.

When we correct anyone, we must first check our field of view; a beam might be obstructing our vision .

 

[forgiven61]

look at why the apostle paul wrote this. speaking the truth in love

11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;

15 But speaking the truth in love, { the reason for } may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:

growing up in grade school --- i had some of the old School teachers i had one a mrs agnus she was good as gold but if she caught you talking she threw a chalk board eraser at you. she was never hateful but demanded your attenion . when telling some one there error . it depends on the method/ tone used. if some one ask for help or says is it wrong?
90% of the time if you have to ask , it is wrong. we are living in a world where some fail to correct a child or even say no your wrong they grow up too be adults who was never wrong



16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

17 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,

18 Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:

19 Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.

20 But ye have not so learned Christ;

21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:

22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;

23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;

24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

25 Wherefore putting away lying, speak every man truth with his neighbour: for we are members one of another.

26 Be ye angry, and sin not: let not the sun go down upon your wrath:

27 Neither give place to the devil.

28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.

29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.

30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:

32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

 

[In Awe of Him]

I guess the question needs to be What sins should we as Christians correct in others??

I say NOT MANY... ( unless they are blatantly living in a sinful condition and attending church) and/or are in a leadership role within the church...and/or IF they ask for counsel.

Christian parents have a duty of correcting their children and when those children become adults... it is my opinion that we no longer have the right to do so. Our roles change to accepting the choices our children make.
When adult children are living outside the will of God... it only takes ONE declaration of disapproval on our part and then we need to move on... but far too often... I see relationships destroyed because of a nagging and relentless parent.

As Christians... we have the right to work out our own salvation with trembling and fear. God has a way of getting the attention of His children when they are disobedient. There are also what is known as CONSEQUENCES to bad behaviour. There is no such thing as someone getting away with bad behaviour. I guess I call this the school of hard knocks.

God is faithful to work within the souls of His children.

There is also a certain ORDER of doing things within the church and I wonder how often THAT is followed properly?

I remember being a single mother and I could not find a job other than working in a bar. I was not a believer at this time.
I lived in a large house with divided apartments... my neighbour offered to care for my child. All was well until one day... she confronted me and stated that she is a CHRISTIAN and she cannot in good conscience continue to watch my child BECAUSE I worked in a bar.
That was 30 years ago... and I am still left with a deep STING of DISGUST over this. It is this type of Christian "thinking" that causes me deep concern because those who seek to go around CORRECTING others are often found to lack much LOVE in their delivery ( yet claim to simply be bearing their version of TRUTH ).

BibleLover quoted some wise words.

When we correct anyone, we must first check our field of view; a beam might be obstructing our vision .

 

[forgiven61]

I am still left with a deep STING of DISGUST over this. It is this type of Christian "thinking" that causes me deep concern because those who seek to go around CORRECTING others are often found to lack much LOVE in their delivery ( yet claim to simply be bearing their version of TRUTH ).

not everyone is like this the working in the bar. should have if nothing else everything for watching the child .everyone of us has been stung /burned .. i been burned as a pastor but this does not change the calling. yes sometime advice even correction stings. if i have to ask is it ok for me to say i want to get married to another mans wife who is still married. the answer should be with a swift no its not Right and you need to drop it like a hot coal . every case must be weighed out before the answer . something can be settled in a private conversation . in todays world a single mom would be given assistance and not have to work . i see it every day we took care of 4 kids for a single mom. we encouraged her complimented her kept her kids while she was working.. only to find out she was out d
bar hoping and God knows what else. we never complained to her never asked money from her. we same as raised those kids.. till one day she moved never letting us see the kids.. she took up house keeping with a distant cousin.. yes shaking up .

so we have just a tad bit of experience.. we ended up giving trash bags of clothes away. we kept at the house. due to the mother would not make them take care of there good clothes .. sometimes never take a bath . we just moved on and we dont put pur self in that big a position.
life is tough and times one has to be tough. that is words of wisdom from the school of hard knocks

 

[Lanolin]

Kindness leads to repentance. Is that it?

The bar hopping...is this like the 'publicans' in the Bible. People go to bars to connect though for a lot of Christians they are no-go areas. I have been to karaoke with another Christian friend and didn't drink but there to sing...but now, I won't go back and I understand that a Christian wouldn't want to go to a place of darkness or a place where they feel vulnerable with potential bad company.

I think in this situation maybe this Christian person who you kindly looked after your child wasn't able to tell you the gospel? But then open rebuke is better than secret love and they were able to let you know as a Christian that she couldn't associate with you or look after your child anymore. And maybe as an adult she thought you could handle it.

Perhaps forgive that person because as Christians we can't enable people and sometimes there are hard truths and have to say no or judge that something is wrong. Of course it stings. I think Jesus had both ways of telling the truth, gentle and loving and teaching (as with children) but also testifying this is the way of the Lord walk in it to adults.

 

[In Awe of Him]

if i have to ask is it ok for me to say i want to get married to another mans wife who is still married. the answer should be with a swift no its not Right and you need to drop it like a hot coal .

This is an issue of a blatant lifestyle sin... on several levels. I am not trying to water it down Forgiven. I understand the dynamics here.

**** backtracking here to the other day.
I have a rule about NOT responding with COUNSEL/ADVICE to men.... thus my request was to change the title of the thread... because it was really bothering me.
That would have set the counsel from man to man... to follow on a proper and right footing. The thread did not get very far before being shut down because you and I had a stale mate. HA. These are all learning situations and I am grateful that these forums are a safe and solid place to speak freely. I have been blessed to be nurtured and fed here... and I know we don't agree on this... but I consider these forums my church. It is what it is and I am NOT sorry.

Now then... with the above said... .CORRECTION in the confines of the church... How does that work?? I am truly asking this as a QUESTION.

Where does the correction begin and end?? I have all these questions and thoughts about correction but have not seen this topic played out in proper form.

It is my belief that someone who is blatantly living in a state of sinful lifestyle.... would NOT desire to be in church... because if they were raised in a Christian home... they would know that they are "living in sin". This is where I believe ONLY GOD can intervene. They must repent and turn back to Godly living. All the correction in the world cannot fix something that is REBELLION against God.

We as humans often meddle in things that only GOD can fix. I have seen this time and time again.

I think one of the problems with correction is that churches got too big and discipleship STOPPED happening.. .and the order of the church got neglected and even abandoned.

You might think me to be a push over Forgiven... one who waters down the truth but this is NOT the case at all. I am very aware that SIN is SIN and all of it is offensive to God.

I guess the issue for me is how do we go about dealing with this situation when we ALL fall short ourselves.

God bless you Forgiven... I have to say that I appreciate that you chose to work at continuing communication with me.

Tenderly, In Awe of Him

 

[In Awe of Him]

I'm still hoping others will pipe in here. This was not meant to be a one on one conversation.

 

[Dave F.]

We should all be able to offer correction from the word of God, we should also be willing to receive correction as well. The truth does hurt sometimes. Jesus was not always gentle, he called the religious leaders a brood of vipers. He always spoke the truth. Yes, we are to love one another and offer gentle advice from the bible, but, sometimes people are hard headed and hard hearted. I have seen what you are talking about first hand, it's like they are verbally beating you over the head with the bible, instead of talking to you they are talking down to you. I agree that this method is offensive and does little to help lift someone up.

 

[In Awe of Him]

We should all be able to offer correction from the word of God, we should also be willing to receive correction as well. The truth does hurt sometimes. Jesus was not always gentle, he called the religious leaders a brood of vipers. He always spoke the truth. Yes, we are to love one another and offer gentle advice from the bible, but, sometimes people are hard headed and hard hearted. I have seen what you are talking about first hand, it's like they are verbally beating you over the head with the bible, instead of talking to you they are talking down to you. I agree that this method is offensive and does little to help lift someone up.

You have expressed perfectly.... the PROBLEM and ONLY problem I have with what people call Christian correction. Thank you for articulating this properly and accurately.

 

[forgiven61]

Now then... with the above said... .CORRECTION in the confines of the church... How does that work??

in a nut shell you go to the person in private talk to them.. if that dont work you take someone with you and talk to them again. if that dont work you bring them before the Church. basically all that happens is you the church removes them from the membership of the Church. they are not kicked out and not allowed to come back. they can stay at the Church.. i dont think this is practiced much any more . here is a scripture turning them over to Satan

1 Corinthians 5

King James Version

​

1. It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife.
2 And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.
3 For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed,
4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?
7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.
11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolator, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

 

[Musicmaster]

I am hoping that this thread will birth a healthy and loving discussion on what it means to speak truth with love?

Are we so eager to correct a brother/sister in error/sin that we forget to pray and consult the Lord on how we should approach?

Are we just looking to correct so that we might feel better ourselves so as to wash the blood off our hands?

Are we able to have a healthy discussion with the one who is in error/sin? or do we simply speak and close the discussion without listening and offering Godly counsel?

In my life... I have experienced those who point their fingers and judge without much else to add.... but.... BUT.... I have also experienced the believer who is so FILLED with WISDOM... HUMILITY and LOVE... that they understand the need for careful consideration in how they go about with their correction. Their counsel invites dialogue. They do not seem afraid of getting "dirty" so to speak... and because of this.... trust is earned and the one who is in error is gently led to the TRUTH without guilt or condemnation.

THAT to me is what a spirit filled Christian is supposed to be. That is how Jesus operated. He NEVER condemned... He gently corrected and offered the TRUTH.

Heavenly Father... I desire to be the type of Christian that is not afraid to get dirty... and not afraid to speak truth. Jesus did this so effortlessly. Why is it so difficult for us to humble ourselves and lead by example?

I know for myself... I have NEVER been changed by the one who dare point a finger of judgement at me... but I have been deeply changed by the one who dared explain things to me in a loving and nurturing manner.

Hmm. How to correct someone, but with love... How about this:

"Look here, you lame brain! That verse doesn't mean what you falsely say it means, so get with the program, here! Oh, and I love you..."

How's that?

No?

Hmm. Well, perhaps there is a better way...

"I saw that you stated X about Y, and I'd like to share with you an alternative thought for consideration, if I may..."

Better?

As is always the case, people will fabricate the tone and tenor within how they read another's posts, mostly based upon their own frame of mind. Some people see disagreement as hostile and judgmental, no matter how much love one may put into their rebuttal. Some people just want to put others on notice that they are walking on this egg shells around them, and that just one crackle, and all bets are off.

So, love is always a two way street. When love is flowing only one direction, which is usually the case when addressing a youth who is deeply immersed in modern WOKE-ism, they gravitate toward the extreme, in that any and all disagreement, where there is no affirmation of their warped and twisted mindset about various topics, is always hate and destructive to them.

With some people, you simply can't win, no matter how much you may love them.

I'm sure we've all encountered that in some instances.

MM

 

[In Awe of Him]

So, love is always a two way street. When love is flowing only one direction, which is usually the case when addressing a youth who is deeply immersed in modern WOKE-ism, they gravitate toward the extreme, in that any and all disagreement, where there is no affirmation of their warped and twisted mindset about various topics, is always hate and destructive to them.

With some people, you simply can't win, no matter how much you may love them.

Ok... so a person who is "claiming" to be a Christian and living in a sinful lifestyle is to be SHUNNED???
Those who have given into progressive Christianity are to be thrown to the curb??

I get that many do not want correction from others... I will put myself in that category because I know when I have sinned so I don't need HOLIER than THOU...NOSEY NELLIE pointing her fingers at me.

I'm still not clear on what issues Christians are to correct one another on??