Which branch of Dispy Theology are you currently part of now?

I read Daniel 9? I didn't see 7yrs ... I saw 70 weeks... 7 weeks and 62 weeks...
If dispensationalist believe in the literal Interpretation of the Bible... how and what kind of math is used to determine that indicates 7yrs?

Or was I in the wrong chapter.

Is there new testament references to 7yrs tribulation?
Excellent question and thank you for asking it. In this forum, under the heading of "DANIEL" I did a verse by verse comprehensive Bible study about 2-3 years ago. I would encourage you to search it out and go through it as I detailed in there the answer.

However....It is NOT math but actual interpretation of what is said.

Stongs #7620 says that the Hebrew word for "WEEK" is literally translated a "a time peroid of seven".
So then, Upon seeing this word one must ask, "a time period of seven whats?"
Daniel chapter 9 uses the Hebrew word (שבעים ~ Shavuim) to represent a period of time multiplied by seven. For various reasons this word is translated as “weeks” and means a multiple of seven years rather than a multiple of seven days.

So then, by that understanding, lets read Daniel 9:1 to see what the word "WKKS" means bu context as used in the Scriptures...........
" In the first year of Darius the son of Ahasuerus, by descent a Mede, who was made king over the realm of the Chaldeans the first year of his reign, I, Daniel, perceived in the books the number of YEARS that, according to the word of the Lord to Jeremiah the prophet, must pass before the end of the desolations of Jerusalem, namely, seventy years."

So Daniel was using the word "Shavuim" to mean a "SET OF SEVENTY YEARS". That means 70 x 70 or 490 YEARS.


From the study in Daniel I posted we see this............

"In verse 24, Gabriel says, “Seventy ‘sevens’ are decreed for your people and your holy city.” All commentators and those I have read and accept, agree that the seventy “sevens” should be understood as seventy “weeks” of years, in other words, a period of 490 years just as Daniel said. These verses provide a sort of “clock” that gives an idea of when the Messiah would come and some of the events that would accompany His appearance but does not in any way set a date.

The prophecy goes on to divide the 490 years into three smaller units:
1. one of 49 years,
2. one of 434 years,
3. and one 7 years.

The final “week” of 7 years is further divided in half. Verse 25 says, “From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven ‘sevens,’ and sixty-two ‘sevens.’” Seven “sevens” is 49 years, and sixty-two “sevens” is another 434 years:

49 years + 434 years = 483 years.

Those final Seven years are what has not yet been lived and is called The Tribulation Period. They begin when the church is removed and end when Jesus returns 7 years later.
 
I read Daniel 9? I didn't see 7yrs ... I saw 70 weeks... 7 weeks and 62 weeks...
If dispensationalist believe in the literal Interpretation of the Bible... how and what kind of math is used to determine that indicates 7yrs?

Or was I in the wrong chapter.

Is there new testament references to 7yrs tribulation?
In Matthew 24:21-22 Jesus Himself speaks about the tribulation where He says..........
"For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, and never will be. And if those days had not been cut short, no human being would be saved. But for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short."

Revelation 7:
"Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, “Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?”
And I said to him, “Sir, you know.” So he said to me, “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb."
 
Excellent question and thank you for asking it. In this forum, under the heading of "DANIEL" I did a verse by verse comprehensive Bible study about 2-3 years ago. I would encourage you to search it out and go through it as I detailed in there the answer.

However....It is NOT math but actual interpretation of what is said.

Stongs #7620 says that the Hebrew word for "WEEK" is literally translated a "a time peroid of seven".
So then, Upon seeing this word one must ask, "a time period of seven whats?"
Daniel chapter 9 uses the Hebrew word (שבעים ~ Shavuim) to represent a period of time multiplied by seven. For various reasons this word is translated as “weeks” and means a multiple of seven years rather than a multiple of seven days.

So then, by that understanding, lets read Daniel 9:1 to see what the word "WKKS" means bu context as used in the Scriptures...........
" In the first year of Darius the son of Ahasuerus, by descent a Mede, who was made king over the realm of the Chaldeans the first year of his reign, I, Daniel, perceived in the books the number of YEARS that, according to the word of the Lord to Jeremiah the prophet, must pass before the end of the desolations of Jerusalem, namely, seventy years."

So Daniel was using the word "Shavuim" to mean a "SET OF SEVENTY YEARS". That means 70 x 70 or 490 YEARS.


From the study in Daniel I posted we see this............

"In verse 24, Gabriel says, “Seventy ‘sevens’ are decreed for your people and your holy city.” All commentators and those I have read and accept, agree that the seventy “sevens” should be understood as seventy “weeks” of years, in other words, a period of 490 years just as Daniel said. These verses provide a sort of “clock” that gives an idea of when the Messiah would come and some of the events that would accompany His appearance but does not in any way set a date.

The prophecy goes on to divide the 490 years into three smaller units:
1. one of 49 years,
2. one of 434 years,
3. and one 7 years.

The final “week” of 7 years is further divided in half. Verse 25 says, “From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven ‘sevens,’ and sixty-two ‘sevens.’” Seven “sevens” is 49 years, and sixty-two “sevens” is another 434 years:

49 years + 434 years = 483 years.

Those final Seven years are what has not yet been lived and is called The Tribulation Period. They begin when the church is removed and end when Jesus returns 7 years later.
Interesting... thank you
 
Theology of Dr Scofield, taken from the Scofield study bible
C.I. Scofield's theology is primarily known for popularizing dispensationalism in the United States through his Scofield Reference Bible. Dispensationalism, a system of interpreting the Bible, emphasizes distinct periods (dispensations) in God's dealings with humanity and a literal, imminent rapture and future for Israel.

Here's a more detailed look:
  • Dispensationalism:
    Scofield's system divides history into seven dispensations, distinct periods where God relates to humans in different ways. This framework helps organize and interpret the Bible's message.

  • Premillennialism:
    Scofield's dispensationalism is typically associated with premillennialism, the belief that Christ will return to Earth before a literal 1,000-year reign (the millennium).

  • Literal Interpretation:
    Scofield advocated for a literal or plain reading of Scripture, which means interpreting the Bible's words in their ordinary, everyday sense.

  • Rapture Belief:
    Dispensationalism, as popularized by Scofield, also includes the belief in a pre-tribulation rapture, where Christians will be taken up to heaven before a period of great tribulation on Earth.

  • Future for Israel:
    Scofield emphasized a distinct future for the nation of Israel in God's plan, aligning with a literal interpretation of Old Testament prophecies.

  • Influence:
    The Scofield Reference Bible became a popular and influential resource, shaping the views of many fundamentalist Christians in the US and beyond.
It doesnt sit well with me?
 
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which bible says the "church will be removed"
ALL of them!

However, if you are talking about the "specific words............."church will be removed", then there are NO words that say that.
Also, the specific word Rapture is not in the Bible. However, the argument of SPECIFIC words to support a doctrine or not support it is a NONE starter.

The question is NOT and has never been "Will the church be removed". It is and has been WHEN will the church be removed.

If you have not read the transaction it can be found in 1 Thess. 4:13-18 and also in 1 Corth. 15:50-54.


Mark 13:32...........
"“But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father."

Rev. 3:10............
"Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come on the whole world to test the inhabitants of the earth."

Philippians 3:20-21........
"But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ,
who, by the power that enables him to bring everything under his control, will transform our lowly bodies so that they will be like his glorious body."
 
What does the 483 years relaate to, going backwards in time?
It refers to the Biblical prophesy of Daniels 70th week. in chapter 9. I encourage you to read it and do the in depth study.

I posted a verse by verse systamatic Bible study of Daniel on this site and you are welcome to read it.

IF and when you do, you will see that The Bible tells us that while held captive in Babylon, a man named Daniel was visited by the angel Gabriel. During this visitation, Gabriel revealed that precisely 483 years would pass from the time the command is given to rebuild Jerusalem until "the Anointed One" comes (Daniel 9:25).

In other words, the Messiah (the Anointed One) would appear exactly 483 years after the command to rebuild Jerusalem. So, did this happen? To find out, we only need to count forward 483 years from the time of the command to rebuild Jerusalem.

In the year 457 B.C., the King of Persia, Artaxerxes, issued a decree instructing officials in the province west of the Euphrates to give Ezra "whatever he requests of you" in his efforts to rebuild Jerusalem."

Fast forward 483 years from 457 B.C., and you end up in the year A.D. 27. According to Daniel, this is the time when Israel's Messiah would appear. Daniel also predicted that after the 483 years pass and the Messiah arrives, He will be killed "appearing to have accomplished nothing.”

So did this happen?

Yes. Jesus was killed, and His ministry appeared to have fallen short of its goals.
 
ALL of them!

However, if you are talking about the "specific words............."church will be removed", then there are NO words that say that.
Also, the specific word Rapture is not in the Bible. However, the argument of SPECIFIC words to support a doctrine or not support it is a NONE starter.

The question is NOT and has never been "Will the church be removed". It is and has been WHEN will the church be removed.

If you have not read the transaction it can be found in 1 Thess. 4:13-18 and also in 1 Corth. 15:50-54.

Mark 13:32...........
"“But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father."

Rev. 3:10............
"Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come on the whole world to test the inhabitants of the earth."

Philippians 3:20-21........
"But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ,
who, by the power that enables him to bring everything under his control, will transform our lowly bodies so that they will be like his glorious body."
Could it be that the "Third Temple" is in each one of us ...
Could it be that our Temples have been tampered with, altered ... our DNA?
 
Could it be that the "Third Temple" is in each one of us ...
Could it be that our Temples have been tampered with, altered ... our DNA?
NO.!!!!!!

The 3rd Temple is a JEWISH Temple and has nothing to do with Christians and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in believers.
It will be built in Jerusalem right where the Scriptures say it will be built.

Now.....How can the A/C SIT in the Temple and declare himself to be God, if the 3rd Temple is in each one of us?????

2 Thess. 2:4.......
"“Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God SITTETH in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.”

What is your explanation of that Scripture IF the 3rd Temple is in each one of us instead of a re-built physical building?

Now..........."Could it be that our Temples have been tampered with, altered ... our DNA?"

NO. !!!!!!

If you are trying to suggest that somehow, fallen angels, Demons are in focus in Genesis 6, and they somehow had sexual relations and produced altered humans with demon DNA..........NO---NO----NO! That is both Scripturally impossible as well as physical!

Demons are spirts and have NO physical DNA. As spiritual beings they do not reproduce. God created a SET, established number of angels and they do not reproduce.

Matthew 22:30.......When asked whether men and women in heaven with resurrected spiritual bodies would have sex in heaven........
"For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels of God in heaven."

In plain English......Angels, both fallen and none fallen do not have sexual relations.
 
Scofield Bible ...
Is that because YOU do not accept his explaination of the Rapture that was intruduced by the Apostle Paul in Corth. and Thess. 2000 years ago?

The Schofield Bible is one of the most widely used and studied Bbibls in the history of the Church. What part do you object to".

About the only people I know of that reject the Schofield Bible is the Replacement Theologists and Covenant Theologians which are in fact the same thing with a different name.

Which one do you identify with?
 
Could it be that the "Third Temple" is in each one of us ...
Could it be that our Temples have been tampered with, altered ... our DNA?
that dont compute.. we can defile the temple in us the biggest problem i see is we have ten thousand instructors. but not many fathers in the Lord.... next we have doctrines of man paul wrote it wind of doctrine by the sleight of men and their cunning and craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;. were so focused on being right we forget the only thing we have to be right about is our relationship with christ
 
that dont compute.. we can defile the temple in us the biggest problem i see is we have ten thousand instructors. but not many fathers in the Lord.... next we have doctrines of man paul wrote it wind of doctrine by the sleight of men and their cunning and craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;. were so focused on being right we forget the only thing we have to be right about is our relationship with christ
We don't need "fathers in the Lord" because we all have only ONE father, and that is God who has sent the Holy Spirit to guide us. What someone else believes is not our individual concern. Our only concern is what the Holy Spirit teaches us as individuals. If someone believes differently, that's between that person and God; it's none of our business. Each of us must focus upon our own individual walk with God and our own spiritual maturity.
 
We don't need "fathers in the Lord"
we dont ?

1 Corinthians 4:15

15;For though ye have ten thousand instructers in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.


looks like i need to scratch that scripture out of my Bible a father in the Lord would be a seasoned leader ..sorry but i disagree with with you on not needing fathers in the Lord.. it appears i bumped the golden cow of religion over.. let me clarify while i am getting rebuked a Father in the Lord is a veteran who has been in the trenches .. that is willing to help guide the up coming recruits called into the ministry .. i do not claim that title as i have been in the ministry some 25 years.. while i know more than i did say 10 years ago.. i still have more to go... for as that goes so does the rest of us you never stop learning.. see my degree comes from the Holyghost school of hard knocks the apstole paul wrote
4 ;Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:

5 ;Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;

6 Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.

7 ;But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.

8 ;Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,

9 ;And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

10 ;That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;

11 by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

13 ;Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,

14 ;I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.



paul was a father in the Lord ..he never tooted his own horn
 
i realize somewhere i went against the grain.. this is what a father in the Lord does
"Father in the Lord" can refer to a spiritual mentor or leader, someone who provides guidance and support in one's faith journey. This person acts as a spiritual parent, offering wisdom, correction, and encouragement, much like a father figure would in a family. It signifies a deep, trusting relationship built on shared faith and spiritual growth.

so contrary to popular belief we do need fathers in the Lord
 
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