Who REALLY Crucified Jesus?

LearningToLetGo said:
Think back to the Prodigal Son. The son who stays and is obedient to the father is well loved and inherits all that the father has, but the son that flees and then returns is celebrated. I see this as a metaphor for salvation itself. Our fall and subsequent redemption has value, indeed has supreme value.
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The prodigal, Rashly or wastefully extravagant, son was always and forever his father's son.

Just because he wanted to sew his wild oats and left his dad and family didn't mean he was no longer his father's son.
 
Siloam said:
i was just reading this afternoon and came across:
​
Note that in Isaiah 45:7, God says that he creates “evil” (KJV). This word is translated “disaster” in the New International Version, and “calamity” in the English Standard Version, but the Hebrew word is the exact same word as “evil” elsewhere in the Old Testament. The translators of modern versions of the Bible (unlike the King James Version translators) avoid the word “evil” here because many theologians have argued that the “evil” which God claims to create here is “natural evil,” i.e., things in nature that cause death and suffering, not human sin. Yet the creation of “natural evil” is just as problematic as the creation of evil people for young-earth creationists. They would argue that God could not create natural evil until after Adam and Eve sinned. This passage, however, flips that on its head and asserts God’s right to create whatever he wants when he wants, including natural evil, independent of us.​
-- David Snoke A Biblical Case for an Old Earth​
​
Isaiah 45:7 (KJV)
7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.


Context and point of view is essential to understanding meaning. Stillreading and meditating oon this.
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Great verses.

All of scripture has to comport with context in the narrative itself.

God is sovereign creator of all and has dominion over all God has created.

No thing that exists can be other than from God.
Sin, death, and evil can be no exception. The created and its converse.
 
ButterflyJones said:
Except knowing good from evil, being like God in that knowledge as God said they were, is what allows someone to make an informed choice when given an ultimatum.

Adam and Eve didn't know right from wrong, good from evil prior to eating the fruit that then bestowed that awareness.
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The exception to that, however, it was the father of lies is the one who made the claim that knowing good from evil would make them like God.

In reality, that knowledge separated them from God.

MM
 
Musicmaster said:
The exception to that, however, it was the father of lies is the one who made the claim that knowing good from evil would make them like God.

In reality, that knowledge separated them from God.

MM
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That is not actually true.
After learning they are of the tree it was God who said they had become like one of us, knowing good from evil. Genesis 3:22.
Which is why God expelled them from the garden so they would not reach out and eat of the tree of life.
 
Musicmaster said:
The exception to that, however, it was the father of lies is the one who made the claim that knowing good from evil would make them like God.

In reality, that knowledge separated them from God.

MM
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Would you agree that this normally would excuse their actions it does not in this case because God placed a prohibition upon the tree of knowledge. Adam and Eve were to place their faith in God's knowledge of good and evil.
 
ButterflyJones said:
That is not actually true.
After learning they are of the tree it was God who said they had become like one of us, knowing good from evil. Genesis 3:22.
Which is why God expelled them from the garden so they would not reach out and eat of the tree of life.
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You said.........
"After learning they are of the tree"
What does that mean.............."They are of the tree"?

It seems to me, that apparently, the fruit of the Tree of Life would provide physical immortality to Adam and Eve. For their own good and the good of all, God would not allow this. You see, they DISOBEYED GOD and they at that point were spiritually dead while remaining physically alive forever could only bring endless suffering. It's interesting to note that, depending on how one translated the original Hebrew, God doesn't appear to even finish His sentence before removing Adam and Eve from the garden in the next verse.
 
ButterflyJones said:
That is not actually true.
After learning they are of the tree it was God who said they had become like one of us, knowing good from evil. Genesis 3:22.
Which is why God expelled them from the garden so they would not reach out and eat of the tree of life.
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So, I have a question:

Looking at the verse in question -

Genesis 3:22 Then the LORD God said, "Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever"--

Like unto which One of the Three in the Godhead had man become? If man was like unto only One, then what is that likeness? God is God because of His triune nature, so individually, what are They? Is the One of the Three God, or only a part of God? I don't see that the Godhead is divisible.

This is something I had never delved into nor even notice, but the words betray something deeper that I have yet to explore as to if it's something we can grasp at all in our current state of existence.

Thanks for the heads up on this. 👍

MM
 
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ButterflyJones said:
That is not actually true.
After learning they are of the tree it was God who said they had become like one of us, knowing good from evil. Genesis 3:22.
Which is why God expelled them from the garden so they would not reach out and eat of the tree of life.
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I also stand corrected....Satan told her that they would "...be as gods," not like UNTO God. I misstated the actual.

Satan had already found out that nobody can become AS God (in totality), because his attempt failed....miserably.

My misnake.

MM
 
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Major said:
Would you agree that this normally would excuse their actions it does not in this case because God placed a prohibition upon the tree of knowledge. Adam and Eve were to place their faith in God's knowledge of good and evil.
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Did the Lord reveal to Adam the nature of good and evil apart from the tree? Would it have even been possible for Adam to grasp the distinction without being filled with evil through disobedience?

MM
 
Major said:
You said.........
"After learning they are of the tree"
What does that mean.............."They are of the tree"?

It seems to me, that apparently, the fruit of the Tree of Life would provide physical immortality to Adam and Eve. For their own good and the good of all, God would not allow this. You see, they DISOBEYED GOD and they at that point were spiritually dead while remaining physically alive forever could only bring endless suffering. It's interesting to note that, depending on how one translated the original Hebrew, God doesn't appear to even finish His sentence before removing Adam and Eve from the garden in the next verse.
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It was to read, they ate of the tree
 
ButterflyJones said:
That is not actually true.
After learning they are of the tree it was God who said they had become like one of us, knowing good from evil. Genesis 3:22.
Which is why God expelled them from the garden so they would not reach out and eat of the tree of life.
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Musicmaster said:
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That is not actually true.
After learning they ate of the tree it was God who said they had become like one of us, knowing good from evil. Genesis 3:22.
Which is why God expelled them from the garden so they would not reach out and eat of the tree of life.

There. I fixed the single letter typo in my earlier post. If someone knows Genesis 3 an r should not have confused them in the typical "are" as opposed to the word, "ate".
 
ButterflyJones said:
No.Unlike you, I don't play games with scripture. .
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Please explain yourself. I am not looking to argue with you. I do not like to argue with anyone but neither do I like to be accused of anything that I know nothing about.

What do you mean by ......."Unlike you, I don't play games with scripture. .". !
That my friend is a very dangerous claim is NOT in Christian ethics and in fact it breaks several of the forum rules.
----To make that kind of claim, you need to specify it with proof. ----- What specifically are you saying I played games with???

Now the real question remains..........
All I asked you was what you meant by saying..........."It was to read, they ate of the tree". That is your exact words.

Then in post #53 you said........."My post addressed Majors confusion with my other post."
I was NOT confused. I just did not understand your post of.......... "It was to read, they ate of the tree".
Then in post #55 you said.........
"After learning they ate of the tree it was God who said they had become like one of us, knowing good from evil. Genesis 3:22.
Which is why God expelled them from the garden so they would not reach out and eat of the tree of life.

There. I fixed the single letter typo in my earlier post. If someone knows Genesis 3 an r should not have confused them in the typical "are" as opposed to the word, "ate".

OK. I understand you spelled a word wrong. That is not the question. I was only asking what you meant by .....
"It was to read, they ate of the tree". That is your exact words.

If you do not want to answer the question, OK with me. I was just curious as I personally have never heard anything about your comment.
 
Staff Note: Once again we are taking an opportunity to advise participants to be civil and to SPELL CHECK your posts entirely before pressing the Post Reply button. There was a misunderstanding in this thread and that has led to terse words between posters.

Please get back on track or this thread will be locked as well.




`
 
Major said:
Please explain yourself. I am not looking to argue with you. I do not like to argue with anyone but neither do I like to be accused of anything that I know nothing about.

What do you mean by ......."Unlike you, I don't play games with scripture. .". !
That my friend is a very dangerous claim is NOT in Christian ethics and in fact it breaks several of the forum rules.
----To make that kind of claim, you need to specify it with proof. ----- What specifically are you saying I played games with???

Now the real question remains..........
All I asked you was what you meant by saying..........."It was to read, they ate of the tree". That is your exact words.

Then in post #53 you said........."My post addressed Majors confusion with my other post."
I was NOT confused. I just did not understand your post of.......... "It was to read, they ate of the tree".
Then in post #55 you said.........
"After learning they ate of the tree it was God who said they had become like one of us, knowing good from evil. Genesis 3:22.
Which is why God expelled them from the garden so they would not reach out and eat of the tree of life.

There. I fixed the single letter typo in my earlier post. If someone knows Genesis 3 an r should not have confused them in the typical "are" as opposed to the word, "ate".

OK. I understand you spelled a word wrong. That is not the question. I was only asking what you meant by .....
"It was to read, they ate of the tree". That is your exact words.

If you do not want to answer the question, OK with me. I was just curious as I personally have never heard anything about your comment.
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I'll state this and that is enough. If you knew the text of Genesis 3:22 a misprint of a single letter, r, rather than t , would not have confused you.
 
Major said:
Most of those TV guys do that for effect to convict us. You know............"YOU , your sin put Jesus on the cross, so YOU need to confess him right now so you can be save, and as soon as you do that, call us at 800 -666-3333 and tell us about your actions!!!"
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I just call:

1-800-CRY-BABY

;)

MM
 
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