Why We Are Losing

If I remember right the OP had something to do with why people tend to be driting en masse towards raging secularism.

IMNSHO the reasons are several.
1. the modern relatively affluent lifestyle leads to complacency, in the past suffering and death were very present and regular issues that needed to be dealt with emotionally - faith in a higher being fit the bill nicely
now that most Western folks have no real needs, they have no real need for a god

2. modern thinking is rather shallow and delights in the absurdly simple and easily proveable,
faith is not easy and is not suited to the intellectually lazy

3. the powers that be do not want a unified and moral populace that would oppose their rule,
so they do everything within their power to keep the masses bickering amongst themselves over trivia and
as immoral as possible, an immoral and stupid people are ever so much easier to manage
 
Another perspective: Some, and I want to stress that it's ONLY some Christians, put a very ugly and unpalatable face on the Christian faith. It can come across self-righteous, and it can seem judgemental, and non-inclusive to women, homosexuals and other minorities. It could stand to be a lot more like Jesus actually was.
 
Another perspective: Some, and I want to stress that it's ONLY some Christians, put a very ugly and unpalatable face on the Christian faith. It can come across self-righteous, and it can seem judgemental, and non-inclusive to women, homosexuals and other minorities. It could stand to be a lot more like Jesus actually was.


Jesus preached a message of fairness, justice and all inclusiveness! Great point!
 
If I remember right the OP had something to do with why people tend to be driting en masse towards raging secularism.

IMNSHO the reasons are several.
1. the modern relatively affluent lifestyle leads to complacency, in the past suffering and death were very present and regular issues that needed to be dealt with emotionally - faith in a higher being fit the bill nicely
now that most Western folks have no real needs, they have no real need for a god

2. modern thinking is rather shallow and delights in the absurdly simple and easily proveable,
faith is not easy and is not suited to the intellectually lazy

3. the powers that be do not want a unified and moral populace that would oppose their rule,
so they do everything within their power to keep the masses bickering amongst themselves over trivia and
as immoral as possible, an immoral and stupid people are ever so much easier to manage
If I remember right the OP had something to do with why people tend to be driting en masse towards raging secularism.

IMNSHO the reasons are several.
1. the modern relatively affluent lifestyle leads to complacency, in the past suffering and death were very present and regular issues that needed to be dealt with emotionally - faith in a higher being fit the bill nicely
now that most Western folks have no real needs, they have no real need for a god

2. modern thinking is rather shallow and delights in the absurdly simple and easily proveable,
faith is not easy and is not suited to the intellectually lazy

3. the powers that be do not want a unified and moral populace that would oppose their rule,
so they do everything within their power to keep the masses bickering amongst themselves over trivia and
as immoral as possible, an immoral and stupid people are ever so much easier to manage

Interesting points but,

Do you mean complacency to infanticide? (in my opinion some people may suffer from this)

God/Jesus are easily provable through faith which by your definition if something is easily proveable it is absurdly simple, which God is most certainly not!

When you say powers that be do you mean the President? Congress, which branch of government are you referring to? (assuming you live in a democratic country)
 
Another perspective: Some, and I want to stress that it's ONLY some Christians, put a very ugly and unpalatable face on the Christian faith. It can come across self-righteous, and it can seem judgemental, and non-inclusive to women, homosexuals and other minorities. It could stand to be a lot more like Jesus actually was.

Then there are Liberals who seem judgemental and non-inclusive to white males and to people with moral standards.
 
If you look at and compare statistics on the breakdown of Christians and atheists/agnostics in western country populations you will unquestionably see a rise of secularism and attitudes changing towards Christianity and it's role in society and culture. The only question that remains is why are we losing?

Hello everybody its me Mike F. You may know me from some of my comments on various posts throughout this site and one of my latest threads in which the word contentious is given a whole new meaning. In this post I shall examine some potential reason as to why we are seeing such a deviation from Christianity and an increase in secular attitudes within western countries and what we can do as Christians to fix this.

One of the biggest problems is what we try and justify and rationalize as Christians. My last post was bitter sweet as I saw so many bright and kind brothers and sisters in Christ come out and participate in civil conversation and dissent. Unfortunately the bitterness manifested itself from these same wonderful people trying to justify acts that are parallel to satanism. Genocide, mass killings of innocent men women and children and infanticide (the killing of infants) can never be justified in my opinion and would clearly never be justified by Jesus himself. Romans 12:17 KJV "Repay no one evil for evil" and Matthew 5:39 KJV "But whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also". These passages clearly show that Jesus was a pacifist and would never condone any kind of killing PERIOD. I was absolutely horrified to see how many "Christians" not only defended such execrable acts, but at the same time totally negated any quote that I mentioned from Jesus.

We are better than this fellow sheep! When we try and justify these types of acts we are acting like a wild pack of muslims or satanic devil worshipers! Ignoring child abuse is something the dang pope would do!

Think about it like this; Imagine you are a Godless soul in search of new life. In one corner we have muslims and Christians justifying the killing of innocent people but then saying that they are religions of peace. In the other corner we have secularists telling us that they want peace and harmony and condemning the killing of innocent people, and rightfully so! Now tell me, in this hypothetical situation who would you throw in with? The hypocrites or the ones who stand up for what is right!

So many times I hear my fellow Christians complain about how America is going down hill and losing its christian morals and values. I can't help but think, maybe if we were more loving and consistent with our beliefs we wouldn't have to shoot ourselves in the foot and chase people away! Luckily for us there is a way out. And his name is JESUS. Lets put away the barbaric acts of one race and turn to a man who shaped his whole career on peace and love and maybe things will start to turn in the right direction again.

My last thread had a pole attached to it. 77% of the people who participated said that killing infants is wrong and can never be justified. Maybe what our religion needs is less talk from the know it all pharisees and more talk from those who stand up for whats right, but are intimidated into silence, lets start hearing those voices now.

God bless you all -
Mike Flanaganmenstein


I think you will find that the majority of people from most backgrounds do accept war. Motives (eg. offensive or defensive) and tactics (some might say war crimes) are more commonly questioned.

My own take on your "why we are loosing" I think comes to 2 things:

1. Science. I'm not getting into where it might be right or wrong or whether one can be both scientist and Christian here. I'm just making the observation that I think a growing number of people believe science holds every answer to everything and that to those people, God becomes a superstition and or an irrelevance. Short of being able to work miracles, I'm not sure what we do.

2. Ourselves. People do observe a disparity between many of us and the biblical Jesus. To use your theme of war, can you reconcile the US use of Agent Orange in Vietnam with caring about babies? I can't myself but have known American Fundamentalists who seem to view the US as moral compass of the world, with babies reduced to "collateral damage" while getting hysterical over abortion (not that abortion in most cases - I do have doubts where the mother's welfare is concerned - is something I agree with).

To continue with the USA, what are her greatest exports? Some may argue they have done more to spread the gospel than anyone else but I'd suggest that the products of Hollywood and multinational brands like Coca-Cola and McDonalds are far more recognisable than Christ is. If you were God would you really be happy with "having made America great?"

(Don't get me wrong on one thing BTW. I don't exactly see our own British Empire days as being pretty. It's just we become more of an irrelevance rather than a power).

Too many of us are good at being whitened sepulchres. We know how to paint a white outside (and believe me, I'm not all whiteness inside). We may be able to single out certain things and take substitution actions such as only listening to Christian (® ™) music and how to get offended on behalf of God when a couple (2?) subjects are raised to re-enforce our own holiness but how many of us (including me) fail on loving thy neighbour and avoiding hypocrisy?
 
I think you will find that the majority of people from most backgrounds do accept war. Motives (eg. offensive or defensive) and tactics (some might say war crimes) are more commonly questioned.

My own take on your "why we are loosing" I think comes to 2 things:

1. Science. I'm not getting into where it might be right or wrong or whether one can be both scientist and Christian here. I'm just making the observation that I think a growing number of people believe science holds every answer to everything and that to those people, God becomes a superstition and or an irrelevance. Short of being able to work miracles, I'm not sure what we do.

2. Ourselves. People do observe a disparity between many of us and the biblical Jesus. To use your theme of war, can you reconcile the US use of Agent Orange in Vietnam with caring about babies? I can't myself but have known American Fundamentalists who seem to view the US as moral compass of the world, with babies reduced to "collateral damage" while getting hysterical over abortion (not that abortion in most cases - I do have doubts where the mother's welfare is concerned - is something I agree with).

To continue with the USA, what are her greatest exports? Some may argue they have done more to spread the gospel than anyone else but I'd suggest that the products of Hollywood and multinational brands like Coca-Cola and McDonalds are far more recognisable than Christ is. If you were God would you really be happy with "having made America great?"

(Don't get me wrong on one thing BTW. I don't exactly see our own British Empire days as being pretty. It's just we become more of an irrelevance rather than a power).

Too many of us are good at being whitened sepulchres. We know how to paint a white outside (and believe me, I'm not all whiteness inside). We may be able to single out certain things and take substitution actions such as only listening to Christian (® ™) music and how to get offended on behalf of God when a couple (2?) subjects are raised to re-enforce our own holiness but how many of us (including me) fail on loving thy neighbour and avoiding hypocrisy?


Great points! But be careful when you make them. People on this site will threaten you and say that you have a fake account in order to try and discredit you like they did to me! Be careful friend! Thanks for sharing, God bless
 
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