Would Jesus Break The Law?

:) You claim to know Torah enough to claim that working on the Sabbath is not against Torah. Prove it. No Christian alive makes such a claim as that. It is basic Judaism.

Brother Paul said:
No YOU made the assertion that these were against the law (which for the Jews would have been the Torah) so YOU show that it was (this is what I asked as a response to YOUR assertion)...Jesus was not saying people should not wash their hands He was saying these teachers were taking their tradition, and making it a law that is not in the Torah (and it is not)....As for the second Sabbath, following the first (Sabbath) in Luke 6, we are talking of one of the High Sabbaths not the weekly 7th day Sabbath (perhaps Unleavened Bread or else the second Sabbath in the counting of the Omer)...

If you carefully examine all the passages of Torah on "Sabbath" you will find that in most all references the word "servile" precedes the word "work"...gleaning a few husks of wheat as you pass by does not equal "servile work". Servile work implies labor or service (as in a job or duty)...in fact almost EVERY reference to Shabbat in Leviticus and Numbers has the word servile preceding the word work (this is how Torah understood the "rest")...The Pharisees had made all sorts of additions (those of Shammai made them a yoke of burden)...

In His love

Paul
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Scripture Bird said:
:) You claim to know Torah enough to claim that working on the Sabbath is not against Torah. Prove it. No Christian alive makes such a claim as that. It is basic Judaism.
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I never made that claim...I defined what it says regarding work. that's different....as Jesus implies (and He is right) do you think God would approve you leaving your mom or even your donkey in a pit with a broken leg until the next day? Really...the Law is a whole...to violate one principle in keeping another is not the correct understanding of the principles expounded there...the truth lays in the Spirit of the Law not the Letter of the Law....does one dishonor their parent to keep the Sabbath? Or is it a violation of Sabbath to DO good? One does not work on the Sabbath but does not every Jewish mother, after the Sabbath arrives ignite a flame (aganst the letter of Torah) to light the Shabbat candles (a non-Torah tradition)...and this is not understood to violate the Spirit of the Sabbath...(and it does not, but it is a tradition not a mitzvot)
 
Jesus never broke the law of Moses nor did he break the Roman law of the land. Jesus kept all valid law.

But, Jesus had it easy... Roman law wasn't half as corrupt as American law.
 
Abdicate said:
Maybe you should ask God for forgiveness for calling His word "silly".

Proverbs 16:18 (KJV)
Pride [goeth] before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall.
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Ah, deflection of responsibility.

Perhaps you should seek forgiveness for false witness. I called your ignorant proclamation regarding the Torah, ignorant in that you know nothing of Torah, silly.

If you won't admit you were wrong, you really shouldn't be in a debate about Christian scripture.
 
Scripture Bird said:
Ah, deflection of responsibility.

Perhaps you should seek forgiveness for false witness. I called your ignorant proclamation regarding the Torah, ignorant in that you know nothing of Torah, silly.

If you won't admit you were wrong, you really shouldn't be in a debate about Christian scripture.
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You have me confused with someone else. Your hostility is very becoming. I forgive you.
 
Wow. I suggest everyone needs to restudy Torah. Myself included. To be sure that what we think we know is truly what it says!
 
Brother Paul said:
And He did...in fact He created it and the rules for properly observing it...He is LORD of the Sabbath!
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He is Lord of the Sabbath because he is GOD who made it for man.

Another way Jesus proclaimed he was God and few listened.

The King never broke the laws of Man nor God.
 
Scripture Bird said:
Yes, but the point was in that scripture he broke the Sabbath.
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Sabbath was made for man, hence he did not break it.

He is also God and proclaimed the Law, he who proclaims it understands it best.

Doing work to feed yourself, help people, rescue animals needed for your benefit that God gave you lordship over are all for Man's benefit, which is what Sabbath was for.
 
Scripture Bird said:
Yes, but the point was in that scripture he broke the Sabbath.
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I do not see this which you claim? I see Him breaking what the Pharisees imposed into Torah instruction (as a tradition) but I do not see Him breaking anything the Torah says is against Torah. I do not see gleaning a some handfuls of wheat on the way through the field as "breaking the Sabbath"...I explained to you the actual Torah references to what constitutes "work"....find a Torah passage that would imply this would be "work" in the sense the Torah defines it (servile)...they merely scooped off a handful...

Paul
 
Well, I thought this would be over by now.

There was no work involved when our Messiah and the disciples ate corn when they were hungry. They did what was lawful according to Torah. Our L-rd never broke Torah, or He was a liar. Matthew 5:17-19.

The teaching in Torah about the difference between gleaning (work) and taking what is needed when hungry is clear. Deuteronomy 23:24-25.
 
tezriLi said:
Well, I thought this would be over by now.

There was no work involved when our Messiah and the disciples ate corn when they were hungry. They did what was lawful according to Torah. Our L-rd never broke Torah, or He was a liar. Matthew 5:17-19.

The teaching in Torah about the difference between gleaning (work) and taking what is needed when hungry is clear. Deuteronomy 23:24-25.
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Of course doing what is good on the Sabbath is allowed. I cannot see why any would say otherwise.
 
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