2 Timothy 2:15

[Major]

You are right ,about baptism not saving anyone .I have never posted that baptism saves anyone ,so we both believe that baptism does not save anyone .
I did receive a post from a well known member who finally agreed that baptism is a command,and he is correct that it is a command .
We can only be saved by the shed blood of Jesus Christ .
Baptism is a command / required by God .
Baptism is how our sins are washed away .
Act 2:38 baptized for the remission of sins
Acts 22:16 biptized to wash away sins .
No one that has not had their sins forgiven will enter Heaven.

Incorrect gain. Our sins ARE NOT washed away by water baptism!!!!!

They are washed away by the blood of Jesus Christ.

Correct comment on.................."No one that has not had their sins forgiven will enter Heaven".

Both the verses you posted once again have been spoken to and neither one say that baptism by water washes away sin. You only post the part of the verse you want to accept and not the whole contextual verse. That is an old trick used by false teachers for thousands of years.

Please do us all a favor and do as Euphemia has asked and STUDY the Word of God. Then come and we can talk.

 

[Big Moose]

For remission of sins, see:
Matthew 26:28 For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Jesus said: Luke 24:46 Then He said to them, “Thus it is written, and thus it was necessary for the Christ to suffer and to rise from the dead the third day, 47 and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in His name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
---Nothing about baptism, but repentance yes.

Peter says this: Acts 10:43 To Him all the prophets witness that, through His name, whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins.”

Ephesians 1:7 In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace
---forgiveness of sins is the same as remission of sins))

Colossians 1:12 giving thanks to the Father who has qualified us to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in the light. 13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love, 14 in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins.
---again, through His blood, remission of sins

Just a little more from Colossians 1:
19 For it pleased the Father that in Him all the fullness should dwell, 20 and by Him to reconcile all things to Himself, by Him, whether things on earth or things in heaven, having made peace through the blood of His cross.
21 And you, who once were alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now He has reconciled 22 in the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach in His sight

This is a good start in the study of washing away sin. This is needed to start to divide the word properly.

 

[Euphemia]

Amen, it's all about the BLOOD!! Hallelujah!

 

[Complete]

What do you see as the "mystery" that Paul mentions? You included that it was not a mystery of Christ. I have heard different renderings on this and wondered how you see it. It is obvious you have done indepth study and I appreciate how thorough you are.
""Reference to the revelation given to Paul, concerning God's provision for believers following Israel's 'plucking up': is found in the revelation of the Mystery (in Eph. 3:3 & 6). In which believers, both Jew and Gentile are truly equal, as One Body, in Christ their Head. Praise God!

This Mystery (not the mystery of Christ for that had never been hidden) had been hid in God (Eph. 3:9), until it's revelation to Paul, and made known by him in (Eph. Phil. Col. 2 Tim, Titus).""
I have heard that the "mystery" is that of a different revelation of the Gospel to the Gentiles. The Gospel of the Kingdom which Jesus presented to the house of Israel, and the Gospel of Grace introduced by Jesus and presented to the Gentiles by Paul. Same Gospel, just different branches, so to speak.
Or is the "mystery" that of the love of God, or is it being saved by grace thru faith, faith being the "mystery" or at least the key to it?

Hello Big Moose,
Thank you for responding as you have. I have not given you a 'complete answer' to your previous request yet, time having run out on me. Please bear with me, Big Moose, both in my 'in-completeness' in the flesh, and in my feeble attempts to explain the following, (thank you )

The Mystery, is a secret only in as much as it had not been revealed before. It had been 'hid' - 'in God', therefore is unsearchable, (Eph. 3:8), in all the writings of the Old Testament or the new to the point of Revelation. That has to be acknowledged and kept before the mind, I believe, when considering it's implications. You will be aware of the, 'But now's', that our Lord spoke during both His earthly ministry, and through the Apostle Paul, at intervals, announcing changes of one form or another, (Acts 17:30; Romans 3:21; 6:22; 7:6; Eph. 2:13; 5:8). Here again in the prison epistles of Paul, there is is a, 'But now', which directly affects believers following the laying aside of Israel (though temporarily) at the end of the Acts period.

'Even the mystery
which hath been hid
from ages and from generations,
but now is made manifest to His saints:'
(Col 1:26)

What is the Mystery? (Eph. 3)

It is the formation of a new man, a joint body, in which the distinction of Jew and Gentile, ceases to have a place, the Jew with his inherited place of distinction was no longer a factor, both had to come to Christ and find not the fatness of the olive tree, but the fullness of God in Christ. Praise God!

During the Acts period, following the conversion of Cornelius and his household, Gentiles were, 'grafted in', into the Olive tree of Israel, they received of Israel's blessings, as revealed to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Gen.18:18; 26:4). These blessings were evidenced during the Acts period, they were millennial blessings, a foretaste of what was to come when Christ returned to reign. They were evidenced, they could be seen, and enjoyed by the flesh. eg., healings, miracles, spiritual gifts of many kinds. But now:-

Gentiles were no longer reliant on Israel for either their salvation, or their blessings. Their blessings were no longer those evidenced and received in and by the flesh, but were 'all spiritual' (Eph. 1:3), and though experienced now by faith, in spirit, are to be enjoyed in heavenly places, in Christ Jesus at the resurrection.

Jew and Gentile alike now came to Christ as equals, and found their fullness in Him alone. They were Baptized by the Spirit, (not by hands), into Christ, on believing (Col. 2:12). They were no longer identified, with the Olive tree, but with Christ, in His death, burial, quickening and resurrection (Rom. 5:12-8:39): and also with His ascension into glory (Eph.2:6,7) , which they now looked for: for in His appearing, they have the glorious expectation of appearing 'with Him', in glory. ( Col. 3:4, 2 Tim.4:8; Titus 2:13) .

The epistles, written prior to those written by Paul during his imprisonment, have to be rightly divided, and weighed, in the light of what had now been revealed to Paul, for it would influence the way they worshipped God, in walk and witness. For all was (and is) now all in and of the Spirit of God, and experienced in and exercised by the Spirit. Worship must be in spirit and in truth, and seen by making melody 'in the heart' to God. The flesh counts for nothing. Ceremonial, ordinances etc, are no longer for the believer 'in Christ'. All is of the spirit, and in spirit. Praise God!

Ephesians 1:17-23

I hope this makes sense to you, Big Moose.
Thank you for giving me this opportunity, and forgive my limitations.
In Christ Jesus
Chris (Complete)

 

[Major]

For remission of sins, see:
Matthew 26:28 For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Jesus said: Luke 24:46 Then He said to them, “Thus it is written, and thus it was necessary for the Christ to suffer and to rise from the dead the third day, 47 and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in His name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
---Nothing about baptism, but repentance yes.

Peter says this: Acts 10:43 To Him all the prophets witness that, through His name, whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins.”

Ephesians 1:7 In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace
---forgiveness of sins is the same as remission of sins))

Colossians 1:12 giving thanks to the Father who has qualified us to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in the light. 13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love, 14 in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins.
---again, through His blood, remission of sins

Just a little more from Colossians 1:
19 For it pleased the Father that in Him all the fullness should dwell, 20 and by Him to reconcile all things to Himself, by Him, whether things on earth or things in heaven, having made peace through the blood of His cross.
21 And you, who once were alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now He has reconciled 22 in the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach in His sight

This is a good start in the study of washing away sin. This is needed to start to divide the word properly.

Excellent ! Amen! Water can NOT replace the blood!

 

[Major]

Hello Big Moose,
Thank you for responding as you have. I have not given you a 'complete answer' to your previous request yet, time having run out on me. Please bear with me, Big Moose, both in my 'in-completeness' in the flesh, and in my feeble attempts to explain the following, (thank you )

The Mystery, is a secret only in as much as it had not been revealed before. It had been 'hid' - 'in God', therefore is unsearchable, (Eph. 3:8), in all the writings of the Old Testament or the new to the point of Revelation. That has to be acknowledged and kept before the mind, I believe, when considering it's implications. You will be aware of the, 'But now's', that our Lord spoke during both His earthly ministry, and through the Apostle Paul, at intervals, announcing changes of one form or another, (Acts 17:30; Romans 3:21; 6:22; 7:6; Eph. 2:13; 5:8). Here again in the prison epistles of Paul, there is is a, 'But now', which directly affects believers following the laying aside of Israel (though temporarily) at the end of the Acts period.

'Even the mystery
which hath been hid
from ages and from generations,
but now is made manifest to His saints:'
(Col 1:26)

What is the Mystery? (Eph. 3)

It is the formation of a new man, a joint body, in which the distinction of Jew and Gentile, ceases to have a place, the Jew with his inherited place of distinction was no longer a factor, both had to come to Christ and find not the fatness of the olive tree, but the fullness of God in Christ. Praise God!

During the Acts period, following the conversion of Cornelius and his household, Gentiles were, 'grafted in', into the Olive tree of Israel, they received of Israel's blessings, as revealed to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Gen.18:18; 26:4). These blessings were evidenced during the Acts period, they were millennial blessings, a foretaste of what was to come when Christ returned to reign. They were evidenced, they could be seen, and enjoyed by the flesh. eg., healings, miracles, spiritual gifts of many kinds. But now:-

Gentiles were no longer reliant on Israel for either their salvation, or their blessings. Their blessings were no longer those evidenced and received in and by the flesh, but were 'all spiritual' (Eph. 1:3), and though experienced now by faith, in spirit, are to be enjoyed in heavenly places, in Christ Jesus at the resurrection.

Jew and Gentile alike now came to Christ as equals, and found their fullness in Him alone. They were Baptized by the Spirit, (not by hands), into Christ, on believing (Col. 2:12). They were no longer identified, with the Olive tree, but with Christ, in His death, burial, quickening and resurrection (Rom. 5:12-8:39): and also with His ascension into glory (Eph.2:6,7) , which they now looked for: for in His appearing, they have the glorious expectation of appearing 'with Him', in glory. ( Col. 3:4, 2 Tim.4:8; Titus 2:13) .

The epistles, written prior to those written by Paul during his imprisonment, have to be rightly divided, and weighed, in the light of what had now been revealed to Paul, for it would influence the way they worshipped God, in walk and witness. For all was (and is) now all in and of the Spirit of God, and experienced in and exercised by the Spirit. Worship must be in spirit and in truth, and seen by making melody 'in the heart' to God. The flesh counts for nothing. Ceremonial, ordinances etc, are no longer for the believer 'in Christ'. All is of the spirit, and in spirit. Praise God!

Ephesians 1:17-23

I hope this makes sense to you, Big Moose.
Thank you for giving me this opportunity, and forgive my limitations.
In Christ Jesus
Chris (Complete)

I believe you are saying that the "mystery" is the Church. Jews and Gentiles now come to God through faith in Christ and that body of believers is called the Church which was not seen in the Old Test.

 

[Complete]

I believe you are saying that the "mystery" is the Church. Jews and Gentiles now come to God through faith in Christ and that body of believers is called the Church which was not seen in the Old Test.

Hello Major,

Yes indeed, Only Ephesians and Colossians, Philippians, 2 Timothy, Titus and Philemon were written following this revelation. Romans is foundational of course, and there is much for our learning in all of the epistles, but only those epistles contain the fellowship (administration or stewardship) applicable to the Church of the Mystery, with it's sevenfold charter in Ephesians 4,1-7 which we are to 'keep' as a trust, a 'good deposit' of vital truth.

'I therefore,
the prisoner of the Lord,
beseech you
that ye walk worthy
of the vocation wherewith ye are called,
With all lowliness and meekness,
with longsuffering,
forbearing one another in love;
Endeavouring
to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
There is
one body, and
one Spirit, even as ye are called in
one hope of your calling;
One Lord,
one faith,
one baptism,
One God and Father of all,
Who is
above all, and
through all, and
in you all.
But unto every one of us is given grace
according to the measure of the gift of Christ.'

Praise God!

Thank you, Major.
In Christ Jesus
Chris (Complete)

 

[Abdicate]

Their are many who do not want you to study Gods word by rightly dividing the scriptures .
You are the only one that is responsible for your SOUL.
A VERY IMPORTANT thing to watch for is when they put additional words .
Some of those words will be ,representative, believer's prayer, only ,always,once . These words are not found ANYWHERE in the scriptures as a pertains to your SALVATION .

Remember too, and this is something I never knew for 30 years, but both Greek and Hebrew scriptures only have paragraph markings, no commas, semicolons, or periods! Who knew. Also, they're all written in CAPITAL LETTERS. So the sentences are divided by the translator. Also chapters didn't exist so sometimes the first part of a chapter can only be understood correctly by reading the previous verses. Finally, English has one of the largest vocabularies with something like 700,000+ official words and over 300,000 idioms (A speech form or an expression of a given language that is peculiar to itself grammatically or cannot be understood from the individual meanings of its elements, as in keep tabs on.) Both Greek and Hebrew have idioms, so you also have to be careful with original dictionary meanings. For example, if you do a chronology study as I have, I struggled for two years on Genesis 11 & 12 with Acts 7:4. The mathematics of the word of God didn't support Acts' account - that is, until "father" also means grandfather, great-grandfather, or distant ancestor. So, in Greek, I could say that Adam was my father.

Remember also that you're reading a translation, and things do get lost in translation. A great example is the "Do you love me" dialog Jesus had with Peter in John 16. Jesus says, "Do you agapao me?" Meaning to love dearly. Peter replies "Yes, I phileo you." meaning "I love you like a brother." So Jesus tries again "Do you agapao me?" and Peter repeats "Yes, I phileo you." So this time, Jesus asks a third time, but lowers the verb to phileo, "Do you phileo me?" and Peter was grieved both because Jesus asked 3 times, but also because Jesus used phileo instead of agapao lowering the intensity of love to Peter's level. Salt in the proverbial wound - or so it seems. Still Peter replied "Yes, I phileo you." But Jesus was trying to raise Peter up from the doldrums of self-pity, to show him that he wasn't in such a bad shape as he surely felt for betraying Jesus. Jesus was trying to get Peter to say agapao so he would actually agapao Jesus. Speak in faith so that which isn't shall be, Heb 11:1. What you speak is more important than what you think. Peter was low about what happened. Jesus wanted him to rise up to the agapao level of love by declaring it. This is why God asks questions, to point out our state and change - like the woman at the well.

Just some thoughts of mine.

 

[Truth]

Baptism is NOT how our sins are washed away. A christian who has not been baptized yet has had his sins washed away by his faith in Jesus Christ. At the very moment of faith in Jesus Christ as our Saviour, asking Him to forgive us and come and live in and through us, our sins are GONE! Baptism is merely a symbol of our identification with Jesus Christ and His death, burial and resurrection.

You need to avail yourself of more than just a fraction of two bible verses. Those partial verses do not a doctrine make! Study the word, and study all it says about baptism...then come and talk.

There is only one scripture that points out that Saul is also called Paul .
Most religious groups gather / assemble on the first day of the week , and there are only 2 scriptures that say they were essemble on the first day of the week .
There is also only 2 scriptures that tell us why we should be baptized.
There is no command to assemble on the first day of the week .
Why do most ,assemble on Sunday .
Because that is the day that God Chose ,to break bread ,partake of the fruit of the vine and to sing songs of praise .
We should praise God every day !!!
The point is that most peoples only use the verses that they want to believe and reject the verses that does not agree with their doctrine .
Acts 2:38 baptized for the remission of sins
Acts 22:16 baptized to wash away sins
You an take remission and wash away all that you want to but it will still be in the word of God

 

[Euphemia]

There is only one scripture that points out that Saul is also called Paul .
Most religious groups gather / assemble on the first day of the week , and there are only 2 scriptures that say they were essemble on the first day of the week .
There is also only 2 scriptures that tell us why we should be baptized.
There is no command to assemble on the first day of the week .
Why do most ,assemble on Sunday .
Because that is the day that God Chose ,to break bread ,partake of the fruit of the vine and to sing songs of praise .
We should praise God every day !!!
The point is that most peoples only use the verses that they want to believe and reject the verses that does not agree with their doctrine .
Acts 2:38 baptized for the remission of sins
Acts 22:16 baptized to wash away sins
You an take remission and wash away all that you want to but it will still be in the word of God

It is obvious that you are not familiar with the word of God concerning baptism.

Do one thing for me and the rest of this forum and present all the scriptures on the subject of water baptism in their entirety and let's dialogue. Until you can prove that you have read them all, and can offer a truly cogent thought on the sum of them, instead of rambling on using only a fraction of only TWO verses repetitively, we have nothing to discuss. You are doing exactly what you accuse others of doing---which is to "only use the verses that they want to believe and reject the verses that does not agree with their doctrine ."

 

[Truth]

Remember too, and this is something I never knew for 30 years, but both Greek and Hebrew scriptures only have paragraph markings, no commas, semicolons, or periods! Who knew. Also, they're all written in CAPITAL LETTERS. So the sentences are divided by the translator. Also chapters didn't exist so sometimes the first part of a chapter can only be understood correctly by reading the previous verses. Finally, English has one of the largest vocabularies with something like 700,000+ official words and over 300,000 idioms (A speech form or an expression of a given language that is peculiar to itself grammatically or cannot be understood from the individual meanings of its elements, as in keep tabs on.) Both Greek and Hebrew have idioms, so you also have to be careful with original dictionary meanings. For example, if you do a chronology study as I have, I struggled for two years on Genesis 11 & 12 with Acts 7:4. The mathematics of the word of God didn't support Acts' account - that is, until "father" also means grandfather, great-grandfather, or distant ancestor. So, in Greek, I could say that Adam was my father.

Remember also that you're reading a translation, and things do get lost in translation. A great example is the "Do you love me" dialog Jesus had with Peter in John 16. Jesus says, "Do you agapao me?" Meaning to love dearly. Peter replies "Yes, I phileo you." meaning "I love you like a brother." So Jesus tries again "Do you agapao me?" and Peter repeats "Yes, I phileo you." So this time, Jesus asks a third time, but lowers the verb to phileo, "Do you phileo me?" and Peter was grieved both because Jesus asked 3 times, but also because Jesus used phileo instead of agapao lowering the intensity of love to Peter's level. Salt in the proverbial wound - or so it seems. Still Peter replied "Yes, I phileo you." But Jesus was trying to raise Peter up from the doldrums of self-pity, to show him that he wasn't in such a bad shape as he surely felt for betraying Jesus. Jesus was trying to get Peter to say agapao so he would actually agapao Jesus. Speak in faith so that which isn't shall be, Heb 11:1. What you speak is more important than what you think. Peter was low about what happened. Jesus wanted him to rise up to the agapao level of love by declaring it. This is why God asks questions, to point out our state and change - like the woman at the well.

Just some thoughts of mine.

Yes We all are reading a translation.
I must be the only one that believes that God has kept His Word true .
I also must be the only one who believes that The Holy Spirit inspired the writing of Acts ,and when He says baptized for remission of sins ,I believe that He meant for remission of sins .
When the Holy Spirit said to be baptized to wash away your sins ,I must be the only one that believes that He meant to wash away sins .
If that is not what He meant then The Holy Spirit made a mistake ,and I can't trust any of the scriptures.

 

[Euphemia]

Yes We all are reading a translation.
I must be the only one that believes that God has kept His Word true .
I also must be the only one who believes that The Holy Spirit inspired the writing of Acts ,and when He says baptized for remission of sins ,I believe that He meant for remission of sins .
When the Holy Spirit said to be baptized to wash away your sins ,I must be the only one that believes that He meant to wash away sins .
If that is not what He meant then The Holy Spirit made a mistake ,and I can't trust any of the scriptures.

No, you are not the only one to conveniently misappropriate the word of God.

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Remember too, and this is something I never knew for 30 years, but both Greek and Hebrew scriptures only have paragraph markings, no commas, semicolons, or periods! Who knew. Also, they're all written in CAPITAL LETTERS. So the sentences are divided by the translator. Also chapters didn't exist so sometimes the first part of a chapter can only be understood correctly by reading the previous verses. Finally, English has one of the largest vocabularies with something like 700,000+ official words and over 300,000 idioms (A speech form or an expression of a given language that is peculiar to itself grammatically or cannot be understood from the individual meanings of its elements, as in keep tabs on.) Both Greek and Hebrew have idioms, so you also have to be careful with original dictionary meanings. For example, if you do a chronology study as I have, I struggled for two years on Genesis 11 & 12 with Acts 7:4. The mathematics of the word of God didn't support Acts' account - that is, until "father" also means grandfather, great-grandfather, or distant ancestor. So, in Greek, I could say that Adam was my father.

Remember also that you're reading a translation, and things do get lost in translation. A great example is the "Do you love me" dialog Jesus had with Peter in John 16. Jesus says, "Do you agapao me?" Meaning to love dearly. Peter replies "Yes, I phileo you." meaning "I love you like a brother." So Jesus tries again "Do you agapao me?" and Peter repeats "Yes, I phileo you." So this time, Jesus asks a third time, but lowers the verb to phileo, "Do you phileo me?" and Peter was grieved both because Jesus asked 3 times, but also because Jesus used phileo instead of agapao lowering the intensity of love to Peter's level. Salt in the proverbial wound - or so it seems. Still Peter replied "Yes, I phileo you." But Jesus was trying to raise Peter up from the doldrums of self-pity, to show him that he wasn't in such a bad shape as he surely felt for betraying Jesus. Jesus was trying to get Peter to say agapao so he would actually agapao Jesus. Speak in faith so that which isn't shall be, Heb 11:1. What you speak is more important than what you think. Peter was low about what happened. Jesus wanted him to rise up to the agapao level of love by declaring it. This is why God asks questions, to point out our state and change - like the woman at the well.

Just some thoughts of mine.

Abdicate Hello,
Look at Matthew 10:33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

Now lets look at this word - Hebrew word dabar means "word" or "talk" Is sometimes used in reference to the "Divine Word" or even "Word Event".

Now Jesus Loved Peter very much and Jesus knew He would have to keep His word but He was not about to allow this to happen to Peter. So imagine Jesus saying I am going to show you how to fix this. He asked Peter three different times do you love me ? Once for each time Perter denied Jesus.

When ever we say something dumb - we simply need to speak dabar over it or another words speak the written word of God over it and cancle out what was said out of faith or what have you.

Look at James 3:6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.

Now in the cross reference it replaces course with wheel and reads like this......
setteth on fire the "wheel of nature"
Point here is simply this - our words set things into motion or being. If some one sets the wheel of nature moving and it is set on the fire of hell then THEY are the only person who can stop this wheel of nature from being.........speaking the word oif dabar ....

Example ......all through life a boy has been told the men die young in this family. After many years it becomes a part of his thinking and then he begins to speak this all the time with NO thought what so ever.......word things - word events - (( check this out - genealogical cures )
This is what they really are and how they get handed down generation after generation.
Words spoken over the years keep giving these things permission to be and we know who is behind that.

Now this man or generation is going to have to speak dabar over this wheel of nature set on fire of hell with the Written Word Of God. Take the written word of God make your stand - it stops here.

I apologise to you Truth for going off course with this reply but I really wanted to share this since Brother Abdicate brought up a few key things here. There is so much more that fits into this and our prayers and so forth. Scripture truly ties things together.
Just sharing with you.
God Bless
Jim

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Remember too, and this is something I never knew for 30 years, but both Greek and Hebrew scriptures only have paragraph markings, no commas, semicolons, or periods! Who knew. Also, they're all written in CAPITAL LETTERS. So the sentences are divided by the translator. Also chapters didn't exist so sometimes the first part of a chapter can only be understood correctly by reading the previous verses. Finally, English has one of the largest vocabularies with something like 700,000+ official words and over 300,000 idioms (A speech form or an expression of a given language that is peculiar to itself grammatically or cannot be understood from the individual meanings of its elements, as in keep tabs on.) Both Greek and Hebrew have idioms, so you also have to be careful with original dictionary meanings. For example, if you do a chronology study as I have, I struggled for two years on Genesis 11 & 12 with Acts 7:4. The mathematics of the word of God didn't support Acts' account - that is, until "father" also means grandfather, great-grandfather, or distant ancestor. So, in Greek, I could say that Adam was my father.

Remember also that you're reading a translation, and things do get lost in translation. A great example is the "Do you love me" dialog Jesus had with Peter in John 16. Jesus says, "Do you agapao me?" Meaning to love dearly. Peter replies "Yes, I phileo you." meaning "I love you like a brother." So Jesus tries again "Do you agapao me?" and Peter repeats "Yes, I phileo you." So this time, Jesus asks a third time, but lowers the verb to phileo, "Do you phileo me?" and Peter was grieved both because Jesus asked 3 times, but also because Jesus used phileo instead of agapao lowering the intensity of love to Peter's level. Salt in the proverbial wound - or so it seems. Still Peter replied "Yes, I phileo you." But Jesus was trying to raise Peter up from the doldrums of self-pity, to show him that he wasn't in such a bad shape as he surely felt for betraying Jesus. Jesus was trying to get Peter to say agapao so he would actually agapao Jesus. Speak in faith so that which isn't shall be, Heb 11:1. What you speak is more important than what you think. Peter was low about what happened. Jesus wanted him to rise up to the agapao level of love by declaring it. This is why God asks questions, to point out our state and change - like the woman at the well.

Just some thoughts of mine.

Abdicate one other thing I wanted to say but forgot to add.
Look at the hebrew meaning of word. word = things and things=word ( word things )
I believe you will see where I am going with this.
God Bless
Jim

 

[Big Moose]

Acts 2:38 baptized for the remission of sins
Acts 22:16 baptized to wash away sins

Taking out punctuation as in the original:
Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
--The verse has two things attached to remission of sin and both are conditioned on "in the name of Jesus Christ" =>Repent every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins AND be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins

Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou arise and be baptized and wash away thy sins calling on the name of the Lord.
--This verse we see "be baptized" and "wash away thy sins calling on the name of the Lord". You could also read it "be baptized calling on the name of the Lord" and "wash away thy sins calling on the name of the Lord".
I did not add any words or take any away, just logically broke down the verses in context. It would be a mistake to quote Acts 22:16 as "baptized to wash away sins" as you have, when it really says "be baptized and wash away thy sins". Strongs doesn't render it as "to". Strongs lists it as: and, also, even, indeed, but
Changing little words like that in your mind can mess with the meanings.
Taking all of this into consideration plus verses from post #22 should give you pause to reconsider. James 4:10

 

[Truth]

I have asked very simple questions ,in different ways . No one has never answered them .
# 1 If baptism is not required / commanded for us to be a part of our salvation ,why was it even mentioned to the jail and his family , the Eunuch , Paul who had not eaten in 3 days ,etc .
# 2 Why did The Holy Spirit write ,Acts 2 :38 be baptized for the remission of your sins and Acts 22:16 be baptized to wash away your sins .Do you believe that The Holy Spirit meant to say something else .

Calling on the name of The Lord or in the name of The Lord or in the name of Jesus Christ is also a requirement / command , but this is also not mentioned in every single conversion and it does not make it any less important . Repentance is not mentioned in every conversion and it does not make it any less important .
There are other things also required / commanded .

 

[Euphemia]

I have asked very simple questions ,in different ways . No one has never answered them .
# 1 If baptism is not required / commanded for us to be a part of our salvation ,why was it even mentioned to the jail and his family , the Eunuch , Paul who had not eaten in 3 days ,etc .
# 2 Why did The Holy Spirit write ,Acts 2 :38 be baptized for the remission of your sins and Acts 22:16 be baptized to wash away your sins .Do you believe that The Holy Spirit meant to say something else .

Calling on the name of The Lord or in the name of The Lord or in the name of Jesus Christ is also a requirement / command , but this is also not mentioned in every single conversion and it does not make it any less important . Repentance is not mentioned in every conversion and it does not make it any less important .
There are other things also required / commanded .

1. Who has said that baptism is not required of believers? It is a command for believers, which means that those who have already received salvation are given the command. The only command given for unbelievers is to repent and to receive Christ. That is why all new believers, including the jailer and Paul and the Ethiopian submitted willingly to water baptism---THEY WERE SAVED!

2. Those two verses in Acts are to emphasize the importance of obeying the call to be baptized, to show the world who we identify with, and to reveal to them what we believe---that we have had our sins removed by the blood of Jesus, and we now live our lives according to Him and His ways.

Baptism effects nothing toward our salvation. It is a public testimonial of our salvation, testifying that we have been bought by the blood of the Lamb, Jesus Christ the Son, and all our sins have been washed away by that precious, powerful blood---GONE!

 

[Complete]

I have asked very simple questions ,in different ways . No one has never answered them .
# 1 If baptism is not required / commanded for us to be a part of our salvation ,why was it even mentioned to the jail and his family , the Eunuch , Paul who had not eaten in 3 days ,etc .
# 2 Why did The Holy Spirit write ,Acts 2 :38 be baptized for the remission of your sins and Acts 22:16 be baptized to wash away your sins .Do you believe that The Holy Spirit meant to say something else .

Calling on the name of The Lord or in the name of The Lord or in the name of Jesus Christ is also a requirement / command , but this is also not mentioned in every single conversion and it does not make it any less important . Repentance is not mentioned in every conversion and it does not make it any less important .
There are other things also required / commanded .

Hello Truth,
Repentance, which is essentially sorrow for sin, and a turning away from it, is the fruit borne by the believer, through the operation of the Holy Spirit, it comes as night follows day. It is the Holy Spirit Who convicts of sin and of righteousness, by the administering of God's Word to us. Just as we hear the Word of God and believe it to the saving of our souls, in Christ, so it is the washing of the water of the Word of God, which works out the sanctification of God in us, who believe. We have all, I am sure, known the smarting of tears behind the eye, as we have read the Word of God, as the Holy Spirit convicts us and brings us to repentance from dead works, and sinful practices, in the light of the Lord's presence.

It cannot be stressed enough, that we are God's workmanship, the emphasis should not therefore be on our repentance or anything else that we can do, in the flesh, for it is something which God Himself, will do, in and through us, to the glory of His Name.

We can stress about the lack of emphasis upon certain truths such as repentance, baptism etc., but it is not necessary, for both are a work of the Holy Spirit, the flesh counts for nothing, it cannot please God.

Rejoice in the finished work of Christ, and de-stress.
'For whose offereth praise glorifieth me'.

Praise His Holy Name.
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Cturtle]

I have asked very simple questions ,in different ways . No one has never answered them .
# 1 If baptism is not required / commanded for us to be a part of our salvation ,why was it even mentioned to the jail and his family , the Eunuch , Paul who had not eaten in 3 days ,etc .
# 2 Why did The Holy Spirit write ,Acts 2 :38 be baptized for the remission of your sins and Acts 22:16 be baptized to wash away your sins .Do you believe that The Holy Spirit meant to say something else .

Calling on the name of The Lord or in the name of The Lord or in the name of Jesus Christ is also a requirement / command , but this is also not mentioned in every single conversion and it does not make it any less important . Repentance is not mentioned in every conversion and it does not make it any less important .
There are other things also required / commanded .

Baptism is an act of obedience to God. Its a command but it does not save us. A symbol of our being burried with Christ and resurrected to new life in Christ just like Jesus was. It is a public profession of our committment to Jesus, I read Romans 6:3-11

In my opinion the two verses in acts are telling us that being baptized is symbolic of being washed and covered in the Blood of Jesus and as we come up all of our sins are washed away. We are clean in the sight of God. Once we confess Jesus as Lord and repent of our sins...then we are in right standing with God. He only sees us as covered in the Blood of Jesus.

Repentance simply means to change one's thinking, or to turn from that, changing ones direction. It also breaks the hold of sin on our lives. So we use it to break the power of the sin that we are in...then we change the way that we are thinking and then the sin can only return if we give it another thought (which according to mat 6:31 is by saying) and response. Or if we act upon the thoughts that we are thinking. Jesus broke the power of sin and death when He died and rose again. So again the only power it has over us, is the power we give it.

Romans 10:9-10 says 9)that if we confess with our mouth the Lord Jesus, and shall believe in thine heart that God hath raised Him from the dead, thou shall be saved. 10) For with the heart man believes unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. Which goes along with the verse (matthew 10:32-33) that says that "whosoever therefore shall confess Me before men, him I will confess also before My Father which is in Heaven" "whosoever shall deny Me before men, him I will also deny before My Father in Heaven."

Blessings!

 

[Truth]

I see no answer to why The Holy Spirit used the words remission or to wash away .
If God commands something ,God requires it .
If God commands baptism ,then God requires baptism.
Please explain how a command is not a requirement .
I am going to say it again .
I have never said that baptism saves, but it is required to wash away our sins .
We are only saved by the shed blood of Christ .
If you think that the words ( remission and to wash away ) are wrong ,just say so .I believe that The Holy Spirit used those words for a reason . If you think that The Holy Spirit should have used other words don't be afraid ,just spell out the words that The Holy Spirit should have used ,it is just that simple .