Abraham Saw An Angel, And Stopped.
- Thread starter tjon
- Start date
NO!
He can hardly abide by the ten commandments if he doesn't believe in God, can he? Look at the first ones.
Anyway, my point earlier was that one's behavior (works) is a direct reflection of their faith. Abraham obeyed God because he loved and trusted God. If we go to Hebrews, we see a repetition: "By faith." By faith Abel, by faith Noah, by faith Abraham, by faith Sarah, and so on. In each case, it was manifested in an action. A sacrifice, an ark, a conception, an offering, etc. Faith and works go hand in hand.
Salvation is from God. Neither our faith nor our works died on the cross and shed their blood for our sins. Jesus did that. We enter into that salvation by faith, and our behavior follows according to faith. A person who is weak in the faith will be weak in their works.
Works without faith, to directly address your question, do not save. They are as ineffective for salvation as was all the blood sacrificed to the Baals of pagan religions. Works with faith do not save, either, but works are the pulse of faith.
I don't know if I'm making my point clearer or more confusing. I'm trying to articulate it as simply and concisely as I can
I understand what you are saying and agree with you.
Genesis 19:29
"And it came to pass when God destroyed the cities of the plain, that God remembered ABraham and sent Lot out of the midst of the overthrow when he overthrew the cities in which Lot dwelt".
I didn't say that. I answerd your question in comment #74...................
"Or that he was solely saved for Abraham's sake?"
Genesis 19:29 is the answer.
Well then........
The Scriptures say that Lot was a man who was righteous by faith. (2nd Peter 2:6-8).
By New Testament theology we would say that Lot was justified, though he was not sanctified. If he was in today’s setting, then we would say that Lot was a Christian but he wasn't living a faithful life.
So then the question must be, why in the world was he living in such a wicked city as Sodom?
Yet that is where we find Lot, faithfully sitting in the gate. Commentators have given all kinds of thought as to why he was there and everyone of there excuses may be true, but there he is.
I just like you have been asked, by different people................
"Isn't it better not to go to church, than to go and carry out a mere form of worship, sing the songs absently, and put on a hypocritical show?"
The answer to that is, no, it is not. It is best to go for the right reasons, but it is better to go for the wrong reasons, than not to go at all.
Even to the Pharisees, who felt the sting of Jesus' words more than any other group for their hypocrisy, He said concerning their empty carrying out of the God given duties while neglecting the matters of the heart:
"These things ought ye to have done, but not to have left the other undone."
Two stories that speak to this..................
One is about the man who said to a minister, "I don't go to Church because there are so many hypocrites there," to which the minister replied, "I know, I know, but I'd rather spend a while in the Church with some of them than to spend forever in hell with all of them."
The other story was told by Dr. Harry Ironsides, one of the great old warriors of the faith. One day a young man come up to him and asked, "Dr. Ironsides, can't you be a good Christian without going to Church?" "Yes you can," Dr. Ironsides answered, "but you won't."
(courtesy of......."Why is Lot a Righteous Man"/Dr. D. Earl Cripe).
L
little flower
Guest
Dear Major,
I truly like your whole comment above.
But there is something I don't understand.
You wrote: "The other story was told by Dr. Harry Ironsides, one of the great old warriors of the faith. One day a young man come up to him and asked, "Dr. Ironsides, can't you be a good Christian without going to Church?" "Yes you can," Dr. Ironsides answered, "but you won't." "
May I humbly ask you: Why?
Can't we be good Christians without going to church, only because of Heb. 10:24,25 ?
I truly like your whole comment above.
But there is something I don't understand.
You wrote: "The other story was told by Dr. Harry Ironsides, one of the great old warriors of the faith. One day a young man come up to him and asked, "Dr. Ironsides, can't you be a good Christian without going to Church?" "Yes you can," Dr. Ironsides answered, "but you won't." "
May I humbly ask you: Why?
Can't we be good Christians without going to church, only because of Heb. 10:24,25 ?
I liked Major's comment too. By not fellowshipping regularly and more specifically not receiving spiritual food by those called to feed His sheep, a Christian will not grow as he/she ought. Remaining in spiritual infancy and malnutrition, we can not give of our best. So while not impossible, being a Christian and not attending Church will severely impede 'being a 'good' Christian' Most likely one would just be a luke warm one.
L
little flower
Guest
Dear Calvin,
thank you for your explanation.
Nevertheless I wonder why it is not possible to get "spiritual food" by reading books, viewing biblical educational videos, etc.? Why do we have to be physically present in a church building for being educated by men who are called "to feed His sheep"?
Regarding fellowship, I enjoy the fellowship from all of you here on this very forum. It makes me happy to read and get answers and seeing new perspectives. Really, for the short time that I have been here, I felt like all of you forum members are my church.
Does that mean now that I can't reach out to my neighbors, to people I know who need help and need to hear the gospel, because I am not physically visiting a church? (I would understand it in the catholic view, as they believe Christ to be present in the Holy Eucharist in the tabernacle in church, thus being there means to them being in the presence of The Lord.)
Can't I be not (!) lukewarm without going to church?
Little Flower..........I appreciate your attitude and loving way of speaking. You exhibit Christ in your respect toward others and I am glad you are here and I hope that you will stay with us for awhile. It seems some come and then go away to quickly.
I believe it is all about fellowship! Sharing love and life with friends you make at your church.
Books are for learning and growth in knowledge but love and fellowship is a personal thing that has to be experienced rather than having it explained to you.
Being close to others, sharing others griefs, cares, pain and then also their joy and blessings.
I can tell you for a fact that there is nothing better than a good old fashioned prayer meeting where someone stands and tells everyone that there grandchild just got saved. Then there is when someone has been cured of cancer or a baby that was told was not going to live LIVES!!!
People shout, praise God and clap hands and even shed tears of joy with that person. You just can not do that at home, or reading a book, or watching TV.