Are The New Bible Versions Today Really Sound? This Is Not A 'kjv Only' Post ...

[God is Love]

I participate in quite a few threads from others, just not many lately... Having said that, I asked just one simple request- please read the PDF before posting, that is not a lot to ask... is it? And I was asking for input on the PDF hence asking people to read it first. How else is one going to give input on it if they have not read it.

Gonefishing, I don't know you and I do not know what kind of Christian life you live, but the fact is there is something very wrong with American Christianity. While the rest of the world is suffering for the name of Christ, the one nation that calls itself 'Christian' is filled with wickedness. I am speaking of an apostate church that lives like the world because it has lost its savor. Say what you will, but if you are in the majority you are probably entering the wrong gate my friend...I find it very interesting that the country ( including the churches) has changed so much starting around the same time these 'revised text' translations became prevalent. I guess you can say its all 'coincidence', but I and many others who are sounding the alarm (and trying to wake people up) see an entirely different 'Christianity' in America than what Jesus taught...Call me a 'clanging cymbal' if you like, but it won't change the fact that something is very wrong with today's Bibles and today's 'Christianity'.


TC

You're generalizing every American Christian as wicked? Wow man.

 

[The Town Crier]

You're generalizing every American Christian as wicked? Wow man.

I don't think you read that very close...I said 'I am speaking of an apostate church that lives like the world' and 'if you are in the majority you are probably entering the wrong gate' Please don't 'generalize' my statement...I did not say 'every' (there are true Christians in America...but they are few in number).

TC

 

[TezriLi]

I'll admit it: I want to get out of the office and go home, so I'll read this thread later. But has anyone mentioned The Wicked Bible (also called The Sinners' Bible or The adulterous Bible? Now there's one that raised a few eyebrows. As for today's Bibles, I think some of them are great . . . .

Having read much of the PDF and much of this thread, I truly regret writing the above post, upon seeing how serious you are with the point you want to put across. I sincerely apologize.

Personally, I don't use the NIV. If I had time, I might, but I admit that I've never seen it as a serious Bible. (Please pardon me, if anyone does.) I see it as a readers' Bible -- one that a person can relax with and read for fun. As one with a continuous fight against both ADD and dyslexia, I don't have time for recreational reading, so Bibles like NIVs remain on my book shelves, rarely read.

I must admit, however, that reading almost through the PDF, it also has some serious errors. I will need to try to read it again a few times to name them all, but some are the misunderstandings of Isaiah. I didn't expect the PDF to be Scripture, of course, so errors are probable, but around pages 7 and 8, the errors were heartrending. Those Scriptures are misunderstood by many readers and also misunderstood by the author of the PDF who is trying to correct others.

Seriously, I do hope you can accept my apology for the above post. I was wrong. I also had not read that you wanted people to read the PDF and I jumped ahead. Again, I am sorry. I hope to come back here again in the very near future and read both this thread and the PDF in all seriousness, with respect.

 

[Huntingteckel]

No I simply compared the two most popular versions today that come from different manuscripts. They are not the same or even close in doctrines and precepts. They have different doctrines altogether concerning grace and many other false teachings. Read the PDF before saying I am wrong. I am telling you right now there is a reason why the Roman Catholic Church is thrilled with the Protestant churches using their Codex's for their translations...That ought to be a red flag but it isn't.

TC

I read most of your PDF before making my first post. All it seems to be is bashing of the NIV, which is nothing new or interesting. Regardless, you are still assuming the KJV is correct when their are differences, which is not always the case.

The Catholics are involved so that raises a red flag? Stop attacking fellow Christians, my friend.

 

[The Town Crier]

Having read much of the PDF and much of this thread, I truly regret writing the above post, upon seeing how serious you are with the point you want to put across. I sincerely apologize.

Personally, I don't use the NIV. If I had time, I might, but I admit that I've never seen it as a serious Bible. (Please pardon me, if anyone does.) I see it as a readers' Bible -- one that a person can relax with and read for fun. As one with a continuous fight against both ADD and dyslexia, I don't have time for recreational reading, so Bibles like NIVs remain on my book shelves, rarely read.

I must admit, however, that reading almost through the PDF, it also has some serious errors. I will need to try to read it again a few times to name them all, but some are the misunderstandings of Isaiah. I didn't expect the PDF to be Scripture, of course, so errors are probable, but around pages 7 and 8, the errors were heartrending. Those Scriptures are misunderstood by many readers and also misunderstood by the author of the PDF who is trying to correct others.

Seriously, I do hope you can accept my apology for the above post. I was wrong. I also had not read that you wanted people to read the PDF and I jumped ahead. Again, I am sorry. I hope to come back here again in the very near future and read both this thread and the PDF in all seriousness, with respect.

Hey lets chat about these 'serious errors'. You cannot just throw out an accusation like that without expecting to defend them. I certainly hope people don't just 'assume' you know what you are talking about... so lets go over what you call 'errors' and expound on them. If I am wrong cool, I will have learned something and perhaps you may too.

TC

 

[The Town Crier]

I read most of your PDF before making my first post. All it seems to be is bashing of the NIV, which is nothing new or interesting. Regardless, you are still assuming the KJV is correct when their are differences, which is not always the case.

The Catholics are involved so that raises a red flag? Stop attacking fellow Christians, my friend.

Do you realize that the legitimacy of all the new versions comes down to relying on the belief that one man ( Constantin von Tischendorf )actually found a Greek text in the possession of Monks (that 'happens' to match the Catholic Vaticanus')? The reality of things is this...If his 'discovery' ends up being fake (or a forgery as many have determined) then the entire 'revised text' and subsequent translations become null and void. You are relying on one man's supposed discovery to support the claims of the Vatican...Really? Have you actually done the research on Codex Sinaiticus? I am betting you havent...

TC

 

[Huntingteckel]

Do you realize that the legitimacy of the new versions all comes down to relying on the belief that one man ( Constantin von Tischendorf )actually found a Codex in the possession of Monks that 'happens' to match the Catholic Vaticanus'? The reality of things is this...If his 'discovery' ends up being fake (or a forgery as many have determined) then the entire 'revised text' and subsequent translations become null and void. You are relying on one man's supposed discovery to support the claims of the Vatican...Really? Have you actually done the research on Codex Sinaiticus? I am betting you havent...

TC

I believe that God would not allow complete abominations to pass. If God can save one family and a ton of animals on an ark from a flood then I trust Him to protect His chosen books. The Holy Spirit guides me, and I'm pretty sure I would be getting a kick in the gut if I was reading a twisted version. You say this is not a KJV only debate, so what translation do you say we need to use?

 

[The Town Crier]

I believe that God would not allow complete abominations to pass. If God can save one family and a ton of animals on an ark from a flood then I trust Him to protect His chosen books. The Holy Spirit guides me, and I'm pretty sure I would be getting a kick in the gut if I was reading a twisted version. You say this is not a KJV only debate, so what translation do you say we need to use?

I guess you did not read the warnings that God put in His book for us to look out for false doctrine then...Go do your own research on the Codex Sinaiticus and a couple guys named
Brooke Foss Westcott (1825-1901) and John Anthony Hort (1828-1892)

Then ask yourself how legitimate their Greek translation work really is...I will not try to convince you- just check it out for yourself...

TC

 

[Huntingteckel]

I guess you did not read the warnings that God put in His book for us to look out for false doctrine then...Go do your own research on the Codex Sinaiticus and a couple guys named
Brooke Foss Westcott (1825-1901) and John Anthony Hort (1828-1892)

Then ask yourself how legitimate their Greek translation work really is...I will not try to convince you- just check it out for yourself...

TC

You didn't answer my question, and instead decided to jab a little insult at me. What translation would you say is best to use?

 

[TezriLi]

. . . I must admit, however, that reading almost through the PDF, it also has some serious errors. I will need to try to read it again a few times to name them all, but some are the misunderstandings of Isaiah. I didn't expect the PDF to be Scripture, of course, so errors are probable, but around pages 7 and 8, the errors were heartrending. Those Scriptures are misunderstood by many readers and also misunderstood by the author of the PDF who is trying to correct others. . . . I hope to come back here again in the very near future and read both this thread and the PDF in all seriousness, with respect.

Hey lets chat about these 'serious errors'. You cannot just throw out an accusation like that without expecting to defend them. I certainly hope people don't just 'assume' you know what you are talking about... so lets go over what you call 'errors' and expound on them. If I am wrong cool, I will have learned something and perhaps you may too.

TC

Sure. When I can. I have missed way too many services at my shul because of "weekend illnesses," and I don't want to miss another in the morning.

Did you write the PDF, Town? I thought someone else had written it.

As you may have noted, I had written in my second post here, "I will need to try to read it again a few times to name them all, . . ." I intended to return here to point them out, not "just throw out an accusation like that without expecting to defend them." Perhaps I should have been clearer.

 

[God is Love]

I don't think you read that very close...I said 'I am speaking of an apostate church that lives like the world' and 'if you are in the majority you are probably entering the wrong gate' Please don't 'generalize' my statement...I did not say 'every' (there are true Christians in America...but they are few in number).

TC

"Gonefishing, I don't know you and I do not know what kind of Christian life you live, but the fact is there is something very wrong with American Christianity. While the rest of the world is suffering for the name of Christ, the one nation that calls itself 'Christian' is filled with wickedness."

I'm sorry for generalizing. But seriously how am I suppose to read this and think you aren't prejudice against American Christians?

After this i'm done, but really I'll be honest, whatever your trying to do is complete crash and burn if it was meant to be positive. I really don't get why you are so hard-headed about the "NIV being satanic" or whatever it is you're trying to prove. A lot of REAL Christians read it, myself included, and completely disagree with you.

 

[The Town Crier]

You didn't answer my question, and instead decided to jab a little insult at me. What translation would you say is best to use?

I read the Masoretic, Majority/ received text Bibles...of them-yes I do believe the KJV to be most consistent. It was the Bible for pretty much the whole United States for over 300 years...and seemed to work just fine. The Bishops Bible, Reina Valera(1602 Edition) Geneva Bible..Even the German Luther translation ( used by the Mennonites and Amish) is pretty consistent from what little I have studied it with them...But there is a huge difference between them and the ;critical text translations of today my friend...

TC

 

[The Town Crier]

Sure. When I can. I have missed way too many services at my shul because of "weekend illnesses," and I don't want to miss another in the morning.

Did you write the PDF, Town? I thought someone else had written it.

As you may have noted, I had written in my second post here, "I will need to try to read it again a few times to name them all, . . ." I intended to return here to point them out, not "just throw out an accusation like that without expecting to defend them." Perhaps I should have been clearer.

no worries tezrli..You are the first person to at least engage me in serious conversation about the PDF rather than just dismissing it without reading it. I wrote it and I look forward to going over all the 'errors' one at a time and addressing them in detail with you. Please let me know when you post something so I don't miss it. Take care and I hope you feel better soon. How about listing your first 'error' for me so I can explain how I got to that conclusion?

TC

 

[The Town Crier]

"Gonefishing, I don't know you and I do not know what kind of Christian life you live, but the fact is there is something very wrong with American Christianity. While the rest of the world is suffering for the name of Christ, the one nation that calls itself 'Christian' is filled with wickedness."

I'm sorry for generalizing. But seriously how am I suppose to read this and think you aren't prejudice against American Christians?

After this i'm done, but really I'll be honest, whatever your trying to do is complete crash and burn if it was meant to be positive. I really don't get why you are so hard-headed about the "NIV being satanic" or whatever it is you're trying to prove. A lot of REAL Christians read it, myself included, and completely disagree with you.

It wasn't meant to be 'positive'...or ear tickling. It was meant to wake people up to what is going on with these 'alternative texts'. The whole lot of them hinges on one man who is very suspect in his account. The Sinaiticus has a very sketchy discovery and has been considered by many to be a forgery or even made in the 1800's by many. There are no real eyewitness accounts that can attest to the legitimacy of that text. If it is a fake, then history takes a big turn in a different direction. Do some research and you may just get a shock like I did...

As for being 'prejudiced' no...I am just pro Christ and what is going on in American Christianity is a joke...It is sick to see what today's 'Christian' churches have turned into. 'Hypocrites' is the word I hear most, when I ask non believers what they think about Christian churches. American Christianity is what is making the gospel so hard to preach because it isn't being lived out!
TC

TC

 

[Euphemia]

It wasn't meant to be 'positive'...or ear tickling. It was meant to wake people up to what is going on with these 'alternative texts'. The whole lot of them hinges on one man who is very suspect in his account. The Sinaiticus has a very sketchy discovery and has been considered by many to be a forgery or even made in the 1800's by many. There are no real eyewitness accounts that can attest to the legitimacy of that text. If it is a fake, then history takes a big turn in a different direction. Do some research and you may just get a shock like I did...

TC

I don't believe that. My trust is not in men, but in God who is MORE THAN ABLE to conserve, preserve and protect His perfect word. It must be a terrible thing for people who cannot trust Holy Spirit to surmount any obstacle to make sure that the message of truth is received by the human spirit---unadulterated.

 

[Huntingteckel]

I read the Masoretic, Majority/ received text Bibles...of them-yes I do believe the KJV to be most consistent. It was the Bible for pretty much the whole United States for over 300 years...and seemed to work just fine. The Bishops Bible, Reina Valera(1602 Edition) Geneva Bible..Even the German Luther translation ( used by the Mennonites and Amish) is pretty consistent from what little I have studied it with them...But there is a huge difference between them and the ;critical text translations of today my friend...

TC

So all the old ones? I prefer the NASB over just about any translation I've read. There are translation errors in the KJV I just can't deal with, so I don't read it much.

no worries tezrli..You are the first person to at least engage me in serious conversation about the PDF rather than just dismissing it without reading it. I wrote it and I look forward to going over all the 'errors' one at a time and addressing them in detail with you. Please let me know when you post something so I don't miss it. Take care and I hope you feel better soon. How about listing your first 'error' for me so I can explain how I got to that conclusion?

TC

I'm pretty sure I said I read the PDF. No need to get all aggressive over it a few errors being found. It's a 15 page document, so it's possible that you missed something unless you have a proofreader.

 

[The Town Crier]

I don't believe that. My trust is not in men, but in God who is MORE THAN ABLE to conserve, preserve and protect His perfect word. It must be a terrible thing for people who cannot trust Holy Spirit to surmount any obstacle to make sure that the message of truth is received by the human spirit---unadulterated.

Euph- the Holy Spirit is the one who led me away from those counterfeit Bibles and out of the apostate 'American church system'. I am inclined to think the 'spirit' you listen to is different than the one I hear for that very reason...

TC

 

[Euphemia]

Euph- the Holy Spirit is the one who led me away from those counterfeit Bibles and out of the apostate 'American church system'. I am inclined to think the 'spirit' you listen to is different than the one I hear for that very reason...

TC

Well, then, your inclination would be wrong---again. I don't believe that Holy Spirit has done as you are saying. There are wonderful, Spirit-led churches all over. God will lead you to one if you would follow His lead.

The Spirit I hear and heed is Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Christ in the world.

 

[The Town Crier]

Well, then, your inclination would be wrong---again. There are wonderful, Spirit-led churches all over. God will lead you to one if you would follow His lead.

nah...I know what Spirit I have been taught by and it is easy to see that American churches are fallen. I have more good quality fellowship going to a small home group and working in the ministry every day than I ever did at 'institutionalized churches'. They are all just going through the motions...most are too busy watching NFL Football, shopping for idols, and taking the kids to soccer practice to do the will of God! Sad situation but true...

TC

 

[TezriLi]

no worries tezrli..You are the first person to at least engage me in serious conversation about the PDF rather than just dismissing it without reading it. I wrote it and I look forward to going over all the 'errors' one at a time and addressing them in detail with you. Please let me know when you post something so I don't miss it. Take care and I hope you feel better soon. How about listing your first 'error' for me so I can explain how I got to that conclusion?

TC

Yeah, I'm still up. Shouldn't be, but I am. Isaiah 28. I tried to figure out how to make a better transliteration of the words, but I give up. Let's just try this: "tzav l'tzav, tzav l'tzav, qav l'qav, qav l'qav." That is extremely close to the words in this Scripture.

Thanks!

G'night!!