Best Ear Piercing Method: Gun Or Needle?

[Panda]

While my tattoos do come from a time in my life that I often refer to as a time of rebellion, as did my earrings, neither was done with a spirit of rebellion, nor is that a cultural perception anymore.

Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more matters of this life?

I'm not sure you meant to quote that verse.

Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own?

For you have been bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body.

For full context, "Shall I then take away the members of Christ and make them members of a prostitute?May it never be! Or do you not know that the one who joins himself to a prostitute is one body with her? For He says, “The two shall become one flesh.” But the one who joins himself to the Lord is one spirit with Him. Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body."

I'm failing to see a mention of Tattoos or earrings here. In fact, it's pretty clear what is being talked about here. To make this work for earrings or tattoos, you have to first make a connection between those and sin. Sure, the connection can be made, but it's almost universally a pretty legalistic one.

Now, understand, I'm not attacking your interpretation here. What I'm saying is that you are looking at a single verse out of context. Can it mean what you say it means? Perhaps. But I fail to see how that is "iron-clad" black and white. To make it more than it is would be reading too much into the text for me. While I do believe there is always some room for interpretation in Scripture, we can't just take a verse and make it mean what we want it to mean.

 

[Panda]

Leviticus chapter 19:28.............
"You shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor tattoo any marks on you: I am the LORD."

You understand how weak an argument that verse is correct? I'm fine with any Christian who holds to this verse so long as they do so in context, meaning that you must hold the ALL the rules listed in Leviticus 19, because it is a single context. If you are ignoring the rules regarding your beard, your garden, you livestock, rare meat, and your clothing, then you really can't use this verse. If you are living according to those laws as well, then we can start talking. It should be interesting to find someone living this legalistically, and still managing to have the Spirit of Christ.

1 Cor. 10:21-23:........................

“You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons; you cannot partake of the Lord's table and of the table of demons. Or do we provoke the Lord to jealousy? Are we stronger than He? All things are lawful for me, but not all things are helpful; all things are lawful for me, but not all things edify.”

Again....really out of context here. But, let me finish the quote:
"Eat anything that is sold in the meat market without asking questions for conscience’ sake; for the earth is the Lord’s, and all it contains. If one of the unbelievers invites you and you want to go, eat anything that is set before you without asking questions for conscience’ sake. But if anyone says to you, “This is meat sacrificed to idols,” do not eat it, for the sake of the one who informed you, and for conscience’ sake; I mean not your own conscience, but the other man’s; for why is my freedom judged by another’s conscience? If I partake with thankfulness, why am I slandered concerning that for which I give thanks? "

What we take from this is exactly why I choose not to get any more tattoos, but it isn't a good admonition against getting them at all. But really, it was mostly a warning against association with idolatry. Loosely we can make more connections, but to do so is tying our actions to the "traditions" of believers born from the legalistic church. Do we really want to pursue that mentality? Should we all conform to the institutional church mentality and abandon all but the oldest hymns played on organs and pianos?

 

[KingJ]

Hi Ban, I recall discussing tattoos with you a while back .

1 Cor 6:3 talks of the importance and ability we have to use professional Christian judgement. That is what I use on earrings.
What is ironclad is the fact that men must not dress like woman and that only in our Christian generation is it not taboo for men to wear earrings. I judge a guy with two earrings to be dressing like a girl. It was funny growing up, the more feminine guys used to get the right ear pierced and the ''cool'' guys the left. How many times have you made the mistake of assuming a guy with earrings is a woman?

1 Cor 6:19, 20 doesnt need much context. The fact is our body is the temple of God. Piercings and tattoos is turning it into our own temple. Just use some lateral thought and you will find that tattoos have selfishness at their root. You forcing your wife, family and brethren to put up with markings on your body that you chose. You choose only what you think is a cool looking tattoo. Why no tattoos of fat woman or hungry children? Nope, all cool looking razor wire, hot chicks, dragons, fancy calligraphy. It is nothing but pride.

 

[Panda]

Hi Ban, I recall discussing tattoos with you a while back .

1 Cor 6:3 talks of the importance and ability we have to use professional Christian judgement. That is what I use on earrings.
What is ironclad is the fact that ONLY in our Christian generation is it not taboo for men to wear earrings. I judge a guy with two earrings to be dressing like a girl. It was funny growing up, the more feminine guys used to get the right ear pierced and the ''cool'' guys the left. Have you never made the mistake of assuming a guy with earrings is a woman?

I remember that "rule". In fact, when I did get my ears pierced, I made sure that I always had one more in my left than my right, "because". Also, I'm not a fan a symmetry. It's an art thing. I would like to take a look at the history of earrings though. I can't affirm or refute that statement. I still don't like using that particular verse. It's reading a bit much into the text. Surely there is a better one out there somewhere to make your point, or at least to combine? It's a case where I'd rather help you develop your own belief here more than change your mind.

1 Cor 6:19, 20 doesnt need much context. The fact is our body is the temple of God. Piercings and tattoos is turning it into our own temple. Just use some lateral thought and you will find that tattoos have selfishness at their root. You forcing your wife, family and brethren to put up with markings on your body that you chose. You choose only what you think is a cool looking tattoo. Why no tattoos of fat woman or hungry children? Nope, all cool looking razor wire, hot chicks, dragons, fancy calligraphy. It cracks me up. It is nothing but pride.

I understand what you are saying, but this is also why we won't be able to agree on this. Context is always important in communication. If we are allowed to take a verse here and a verse there while ignoring the reason the argument was made and whom the verse was directed, then I'm pretty sure that I can make the Bible say anything I want. In fact, we have a guy out there preaching about how much God hates the world undoubtedly using that exact logic.

The pride issue is interesting though. I have the word pray on my left wrist and a cross on my right. Those were not chosen because of pride, but because of failure. When I was suicidal, I looked at my wrists a LOT. That's why they are there. More often than not, they are conversation starters. I've never converted anyone using them, nor do I particularly think I ever will, but I have certainly opened up some great conversations with believers that I never would have known if it wasn't for that ice-breaker.

That being said, would you then approve of tattoos if Christians were getting hungry children and fat women?

 

[KingJ]

That being said, would you then approve of tattoos if Christians were getting hungry children and fat women?

Certainly more approval then ones for vanity.

I would like to take a look at the history of earrings though. I can't affirm or refute that statemen

I am sure many men have worn earrings in the past. It is Christian specific that I am concerned with. Those old fashioned churches of our forefathers. I don't see them giving any approval.

 

[Panda]

Certainly more approval then ones for vanity.

The funny thing is, THAT would be a real conversation starter. How interesting would the story attached to that be (the hungry children, not so much the fat women)?

 

[farouk]

I am not against woman getting their ears pierced moderately (two or three), but men...I will discipline my son hard if he even thinks it .

KingJ: Yes, it's been the custom for many years for women to double- or triple- pierce their ears, and in the scheme of things it's pretty benign, really. And often it's mothers and daughters that do it together or in imitation of one another; it's a longstanding thing. For example, a mom and her daughter who double- or triple- pierced their ears in around 1979 at the ages of, say, 47 and 21 respectively would now be aged 80 and 55, and the 55-year old could also be grandmother herself, with both a daughter and even a teen granddaughter themselves with 2 or 3 pairs of ear piercings.

Similarly, there are plenty of young men whose dads may have obtained ear piercings at somes stage. And so when a young men get ear piercings 'just like dad's', I would suggest it's hardly attributable to rebellion against their parents.

It's a custom - like it; dislike it - but it's widespread, and I would really hesitate to make inward and spiritual assumptions about the mere fact that men or women do it.

(So, to return to the original question of the thread: gun or needle? )

Blessings.

 

[Stan]

On earrings for men I use 1 Cor 6:3. Excessive earrings and any tattoos 1 Cor 6:19-20.

It bothers me that if I got my ears pierced I would trade earrings with my wife, sister, mother and grandmother. My brothers, father and all my grandfathers never wore them. I would be the first in my lineage. What about you Stan, are you the first in your lineage?

I'm sorry but that is eisegetical use of scripture. The context of 1 Cor 6 does not apply to these scriptures. Paul is dealing with legal disputes and sexual immorality in these scriptures.
However if you feel for yourself that God speaks to you through these verses about these two issues, that is between you and God. I don't agree that they are properly divided as reproof correction or instruction in righteousness.

Even women normally do NOT share their earrings normally, although little girls do dress up with mommy's jewelry. Men's styles are also different as are men's pants and shirts and hats and shoes and underwear!

I don't know if I was the first in my lineage or generation. Not something I kept track of. I do know some cousins had pierced ears when I was in my late teens early twenties.

BTW, ear piercing in the OT was a sign of permanent commitment to God or a master.

 

[Panda]

(So, to return to the original question of the thread: gun or needle? )

Correct. This topic is not about the legality of the practice for Christians, but about the preference of guns vs. needles for the actual practice and should remain as such.

 

[KingJ]

KingJ: Yes, it's been the custom for many years for women to double- or triple- pierce their ears, and in the scheme of things it's pretty benign, really. And often it's mothers and daughters that do it together or in imitation of one another; it's a longstanding thing. For example, a mom and her daughter who double- or triple- pierced their ears in around 1979 at the ages of, say, 47 and 21 respectively would now be aged 80 and 55, and the 55-year old could also be grandmother herself, with both a daughter and even a teen granddaughter themselves with 2 or 3 pairs of ear piercings.

Similarly, there are plenty of young men whose dads may have obtained ear piercings at somes stage. And so when a young men get ear piercings 'just like dad's', I would suggest it's hardly attributable to rebellion against their parents.

It's a custom - like it; dislike it - but it's widespread, and I would really hesitate to make inward and spiritual assumptions about the mere fact that men or women do it.

Blessings.

The bottom line is that amongst Christians it is only in our generation that you will find men doing it. Does that not disturb you? I hate conforming to a generation norm that the bible parallels with Sodom and Gomorrah.

(So, to return to the original question of the thread: gun or needle? )

Neither. Press-stick earrings and stick on tattoos. Unless God is using you to witness to heavy metal bikers that is...

 

[KingJ]

I'm sorry but that is eisegetical use of scripture. The context of 1 Cor 6 does not apply to these scriptures. Paul is dealing with legal disputes and sexual immorality in these scriptures.

Stan, When Paul says ''Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life!'' He means ''Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life!''.

BTW, ear piercing in the OT was a sign of permanent commitment to God or a master.

Is that why you got your earring? I am guessing its not.

 

[KingJ]

Correct. This topic is not about the legality of the practice for Christians, but about the preference of guns vs. needles for the actual practice and should remain as such.

How is that possible on a Christian site if the action of piercing is questionable?

 

[Jake]

Oh k common guys! Lets grow up here. We're starting to sound like 12 year olds. This is the reason why many people end up leaving the site.
Please lets work together like mature adults...

Peace!!

 

[Panda]

How is that possible on a Christian site if the action of piercing is questionable?

Easy. We aren't a denominational site.

But take a close look at the topic. Nowhere has it been addressed to men. It simply asked the best method for piercing, needles or guns. As it happens, a few men have some experience with this and have chimed in (myself included). Beyond that, there is absolutely no reason or grounds for this topic to become a discussion regarding the right or wrongness of Christian men getting their ears pierced because someone might view it as cross dressing. The same argument was used to get my grandfather fired from a church 60+ years ago because his daughter was seen wearing women's jeans, late at night, in her own home, on a farm.

 

[Stan]

Stan, When Paul says ''Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life!'' He means ''Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life!''.

The CONTEXT is believers taking one another to SECULAR court to arbitrate legal matters within the body. I suggest you read the entire section, verses 1-8 of this section of scripture, to gain the context here. This is NOT saying as individual believers, we have the right to judge condemn personal practices of others.

Is that why you got your earring? I am guessing its not.

As a matter of fact I got it done to show commitment to my girlfriend, but that is NOT the point.
It doesn't matter does it? IF piercing was not acceptable to God, He wouldn't want it done to ANYBODY. The FACT is many associate it with being worldly, when it is in fact only personal, just like hairstyles, lipstick and any OTHER type of piercing.
I personally would NOT get my nose pierced but on some women it looks good. Piercing have never been relegated ONLY to women.

 

[Stan]

Easy. We aren't a denominational site.

But take a close look at the topic. Nowhere has it been addressed to men. It simply asked the best method for piercing, needles or guns. As it happens, a few men have some experience with this and have chimed in (myself included). Beyond that, there is absolutely no reason or grounds for this topic to become a discussion regarding the right or wrongness of Christian men getting their ears pierced because someone might view it as cross dressing. The same argument was used to get my grandfather fired from a church 60+ years ago because his daughter was seen wearing women's jeans, late at night, in her own home, on a farm.

Sorry...I'll unwatch this thread now.

 

[farouk]

Re. needles, the sterile/hygienic aspect is very important; and if say an adolescent young man obviously wants to pierce his ears and his parents think there's a likelihood he will pierce them using an unsterile needle, then, in these days of diseases, it's probably a sensible idea for them to take him to have them done properly pierced through with a sterile needle in clean conditions.

(Two cents'.)

Blessings.

 

[KingJ]

The same argument was used to get my grandfather fired from a church 60+ years ago because his daughter was seen wearing women's jeans, late at night, in her own home, on a farm.

Geesh that was harsh. Many years of service < one incident of ''daughter '' in jeans.

This is NOT saying as individual believers, we have the right to judge condemn personal practices of others.

Judge, not condemn.

As a matter of fact I got it done to show commitment to my girlfriend

that was so sweet of you.

It doesn't matter does it? IF piercing was not acceptable to God, He wouldn't want it done to ANYBODY.

Happy to discuss further if you want on another thread.

 

[farouk]

BTW, ear piercing in the OT was a sign of permanent commitment to God or a master.

Stan: Well, exactly, and it was long before the days of piercing guns, too...

 

[Panda]

Now, now. The rules apply to everyone, unless you have now decided that you want this topic to be a discussion about the appropriateness of piercing. As the topic creator, that is up to you, but I don't think that is what you want. I cannot and will not enforce the topic discussion if the OP doesn't. It isn't fair to hold one side of the debate back just so the other side can throw pot shots.