This topic has gone off course a bit. Can we please get back to the original post?
Can Christians Judge?
- Thread starter Trodaí Urnaí
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PeaceLikeaRiver
Inactive
Here's my perspective on it.
I don't judge people because it serves no purpose. I'm just a human being like everyone else. I make mistakes, and who am I to judge other people's? If I make a personal or private judgement of someone I do my best to keep it to myself. I don't see the effectiveness of telling someone something "for their own good." And in fact if you tell someone that what they're doing is a sin in the eyes of God, the more likely reaction is that they will be pushed further away from God.
When I have a self-righteous person telling me I'm doing something wrong, I instantly call them on their credentials - most of the time they have far greater problems than I do and they should be minding their own business. They aren't God, and they don't speak for God. I will answer to God alone.
I don't judge people because it serves no purpose. I'm just a human being like everyone else. I make mistakes, and who am I to judge other people's? If I make a personal or private judgement of someone I do my best to keep it to myself. I don't see the effectiveness of telling someone something "for their own good." And in fact if you tell someone that what they're doing is a sin in the eyes of God, the more likely reaction is that they will be pushed further away from God.
When I have a self-righteous person telling me I'm doing something wrong, I instantly call them on their credentials - most of the time they have far greater problems than I do and they should be minding their own business. They aren't God, and they don't speak for God. I will answer to God alone.
PeaceLikeaRiver
Inactive
Ghid, I hope you also understand that fundamentalist Christians do not represent what many of us consider to be the true church of Jesus Christ either. So feel free to state your own Christian perspectives.
Most often, when I hear people point the finger at others by expressing that the Bible says not to judge, it is often done in a very judgmental way.
We can't be hypocrites of course, but we should always judge actions as right from wrong and correct in our lives what needs to be corrected before we even address someone else's faults.
We can't be hypocrites of course, but we should always judge actions as right from wrong and correct in our lives what needs to be corrected before we even address someone else's faults.
Just a request -- can we continue with the subject of judgment and put aside the differences between Catholics and Fundamentalists? Of course there are differences, but surprisingly, there are also many commonalities.
We are not to judge with condemnation.. We are to judge for edification.. Judgement goes hand in hand with love your neighbor as you love yourself.. In many aspects..
Let's take a simple example.. Our child does something wrong.. We do things to correct her and part of it would include judging the actions.. But it only for correcting the child.. It is out of love..
Our neighbor's kid commit the same action.. We probably judge that kid also.. Not edification.. But with a condemnation.. We might even go the extend of judging the parents, telling the kid is probably going to end up so and so because of this, etc.. There is no love, but simple condemnation..
This is something the Lord has been clearly engraving in my heart.. When I see some bad news, I often pronounce judgement with condemnation.. Who can save this nation, I scream! Spirit gently reminds me, what are you doing about it..
Let's take a simple example.. Our child does something wrong.. We do things to correct her and part of it would include judging the actions.. But it only for correcting the child.. It is out of love..
Our neighbor's kid commit the same action.. We probably judge that kid also.. Not edification.. But with a condemnation.. We might even go the extend of judging the parents, telling the kid is probably going to end up so and so because of this, etc.. There is no love, but simple condemnation..
This is something the Lord has been clearly engraving in my heart.. When I see some bad news, I often pronounce judgement with condemnation.. Who can save this nation, I scream! Spirit gently reminds me, what are you doing about it..
And every time Bible speaks about judging is acceptable, the intention will be for redemption of the person.. And every time Bible says judgement is not okay, it condemns judging a person for condemnation.. I think these are 2 clear distinct things and Bible is not contradicting in any sense.. Once again, looking at Bible verses within in the context would be handy 
We do not KNOW what's inside the heart - ONLY God does..... so Only God can be the true Judge of man's soul and spirit - whether it truly is good or evil..... The true deceivers are EXTRAORDINARILY good at hiding what's truly in their hearts, where "Normal" people really are not..... We get tricked into thinking that the Real Deceiver is Genuine - and the Deceived is the problem..... In that sense, we are UNABLE to judge as God does..... This is why we are called to the utmost Caution, Humility, and leaning HARD on the Holy Spirit in discernment.....
We ARE called to "Inspect Fruit"... We are ACCOUNTABLE for being able to discern "Good fruit" from "Bad fruit".... and this is specifically in the context of Thorns vs Grapes, Thistles vs Figs.....
Instead, we tend to focus on Rotten figs vs Good figs - and want to chop down and cast out the Fig tree because of rotten figs...... Rotten figs are STILL Figs - and this means that this tree CAN be made to bear good figs..... Thistles are NOT figs... A thistle cannot be made to bear Figs no matter how much love, tending, or resources are spent on it..... Notice the contrast.....
With "Bad trees" - the more resources, the more time, the more effort, the more energy, training, leadership - the more "Bad fruit" they produce and the more "Bad seed" they create...... Unfortunately, by then - this fellow is now at the TOP of your organization and is poisoning it from the top down..... This fellow isn't the drug addict in the back row....
With "Good trees" - the more resources, time, effort, energy, training, and leadership - you see the "Rotten" fruit start to turn Good... They produce Good fruit and and sow Good Seed...... Unfortunately, this fellow will probably be limited within the organization because of the fear and memory of "Rotten fruit".....
Since we can't KNOW the heart - there are going to be situations where we cast out "Good trees" and situations where we accept "Bad trees"... This is where the Humility, Caution, and Accountability comes in.... WE must be held accountable to CORRECT our mistakes rather than doubling-down on our Error...... When you cast out a "Good tree" - then realize he is Good - Repent and bring him back in... When you accept a Bad tree - then realize he is Bad - Repent and cast him out!
Thanks
We ARE called to "Inspect Fruit"... We are ACCOUNTABLE for being able to discern "Good fruit" from "Bad fruit".... and this is specifically in the context of Thorns vs Grapes, Thistles vs Figs.....
Instead, we tend to focus on Rotten figs vs Good figs - and want to chop down and cast out the Fig tree because of rotten figs...... Rotten figs are STILL Figs - and this means that this tree CAN be made to bear good figs..... Thistles are NOT figs... A thistle cannot be made to bear Figs no matter how much love, tending, or resources are spent on it..... Notice the contrast.....
With "Bad trees" - the more resources, the more time, the more effort, the more energy, training, leadership - the more "Bad fruit" they produce and the more "Bad seed" they create...... Unfortunately, by then - this fellow is now at the TOP of your organization and is poisoning it from the top down..... This fellow isn't the drug addict in the back row....
With "Good trees" - the more resources, time, effort, energy, training, and leadership - you see the "Rotten" fruit start to turn Good... They produce Good fruit and and sow Good Seed...... Unfortunately, this fellow will probably be limited within the organization because of the fear and memory of "Rotten fruit".....
Since we can't KNOW the heart - there are going to be situations where we cast out "Good trees" and situations where we accept "Bad trees"... This is where the Humility, Caution, and Accountability comes in.... WE must be held accountable to CORRECT our mistakes rather than doubling-down on our Error...... When you cast out a "Good tree" - then realize he is Good - Repent and bring him back in... When you accept a Bad tree - then realize he is Bad - Repent and cast him out!
Thanks
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So the problem with judging is you? Even when the bible says we can judge and that it would benefit the other person by doing so. In a way you are negatively judging a Christian by calling them self righteous. You are practicing exactly what you are so strongly against and doing it in an unbiblical manner.
PeaceLikeaRiver
Inactive
Hm, you posted a question, and I gave you my opinion, and now you're questioning me for doing so?
I stand by my answer, and there is precisely nothing unbiblical about it. I do not use my Christianity to badger and annoy people with unsolicited judgments which serve only to annoy them.
Reminds me of something I heard from this pastor:
“People tell me judge not lest ye be judged. I always tell them, twist not scripture lest ye be like satan.”
― Paul Washer
HisManySongs
Passed on, February 28, 2022
Yes, please stay on topic. Future off topic posts are subject to deletion.
I provided biblical proof toward my argument, you haven't provided any verses to back up your statements
PeaceLikeaRiver
Inactive
All right, I think I know where this is headed, but I'll play:
Matthew 7:1-5
“Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you. Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when there is the log in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye."
Luke 6:37
“Judge not, and you will not be judged; condemn not, and you will not be condemned; forgive, and you will be forgiven."
James 4:11-12
"Do not speak evil against one another, brothers. The one who speaks against a brother or judges his brother, speaks evil against the law and judges the law. But if you judge the law, you are not a doer of the law but a judge. There is only one lawgiver and judge, he who is able to save and to destroy. But who are you to judge your neighbor?"
Romans 2:1-3
"Therefore you have no excuse, O man, every one of you who judges. For in passing judgment on another you condemn yourself, because you, the judge, practice the very same things. We know that the judgment of God rightly falls on those who practice such things. Do you suppose, O man—you who judge those who practice such things and yet do them yourself—that you will escape the judgment of God?"
Once again.. Goes back to my point.. It all talks about judging with condemnation.. Which should not be done..
PeaceLikeaRiver
Inactive
In this day and age, it seems all judging is done that way. It's a bad idea and puts Christians in a very unfavorable light.
What people do is different from what Bible tells right? in the days of Noah everyone sinned.. So God wiped out the whole earth.. What man does can never change God's standard.. Same way, irrespective of way we judge people today, clearly Bible suggests judging is fine when it is for edification of the person.. And never to judge to condemn a person..
PeaceLikeaRiver
Inactive
Suggestions I have no problem with. Constructive criticism can be good and can be helpful. But I do fail completely to see what good it does telling someone they will burn in hell forever. For one thing it's likely untrue, for another, it's playing God.
Doesn't it go with the below scripture?
5 Then you must throw this man out and hand him over to Satan so that his sinful nature will be destroyed and he himself will be saved on the day the Lord returns.
PeaceLikeaRiver
Inactive
Whoa, what's the rest of it? On its own I get no context. What are you quoting from?