Church Worship Music

[Grant Melville]

Thank you, @Penion, @Fish Catcher Jim, and @Euphemia, for your responses. I think it's time for me to withdraw from the discussion, because it seems to be going round in circles.
In addition, over the course of the discussion, I've made reference to a good many scriptures which bear out the truth in question. These scriptures have not been taken up, discussed or addressed by the brethren who're telling me that I'm wrong, and no scriptures have been referenced which would support the variety of opposing ideas which have been advanced here. No discussion of this kind can be of much use unless the word of God is really taken up as the anchor and the mainstay of it. I'm not saying these things in the spirit of criticism, more of concern. If we can't trace our doctrine to the Source, God's word, then we have to question where it is coming from.

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Thank you, @Penion, @Fish Catcher Jim, and @Euphemia, for your responses. I think it's time for me to withdraw from the discussion, because it seems to be going round in circles.
In addition, over the course of the discussion, I've made reference to a good many scriptures which bear out the truth in question. These scriptures have not been taken up, discussed or addressed by the brethren who're telling me that I'm wrong, and no scriptures have been referenced which would support the variety of ideas which have been advanced here. No discussion of this kind can be of much use unless the word of God is really taken up as the anchor and the mainstay of it. I'm not saying these things in the spirit of criticism, more of concern. If we can't trace our doctrine to the Source, God's word, then we have to question where it is coming from.

Grant,
I love you my brother and I am not out to prove you wrong or me correct. I think it is simply a culture indifference and a difference in understandings. If you wish to discuss this further then I would be happy to continue, as long as it is not causing strife or problems in your life or any ones.
Have a blessed day
Jim

 

[Grant Melville]

Grant,
I love you my brother and I am not out to prove you wrong or me correct. I think it is simply a culture indifference and a difference in understandings. If you wish to discuss this further then I would be happy to continue, as long as it is not causing strife or problems in your life or any ones.
Have a blessed day
Jim

Thank you Jim - my feelings are likewise. We have to hold the truth in love, and we can't have one without the other. Of course, this isn't a debate or a competition.

I think we've exhausted the subject, and, personally, I feel as though I'm repeating myself a lot. I would be happy to continue the discussion because - as I said above - I believe that important truth regarding the Person of the Lord Jesus underlies it. However, as you've pointed out here, there is the danger of negatively affecting others. Perhaps it's time that I bowed out.

 

[Euphemia]

I agree that you can worship God and still play an instrument. What I'm saying is that playing an instrument is not worship in itself.

Playing an instrument for the Lord, for His glory and to bless Him is worship.

 

[Euphemia]

Thank you, @Penion, @Fish Catcher Jim, and @Euphemia, for your responses. I think it's time for me to withdraw from the discussion, because it seems to be going round in circles.
In addition, over the course of the discussion, I've made reference to a good many scriptures which bear out the truth in question. These scriptures have not been taken up, discussed or addressed by the brethren who're telling me that I'm wrong, and no scriptures have been referenced which would support the variety of opposing ideas which have been advanced here. No discussion of this kind can be of much use unless the word of God is really taken up as the anchor and the mainstay of it. I'm not saying these things in the spirit of criticism, more of concern. If we can't trace our doctrine to the Source, God's word, then we have to question where it is coming from.

The fact is, Grant, that there ARE NO scriptures to support your view.

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Thank you Jim - my feelings are likewise. We have to hold the truth in love, and we can't have one without the other. Of course, this isn't a debate or a competition.

I think we've exhausted the subject, and, personally, I feel as though I'm repeating myself a lot. I would be happy to continue the discussion because - as I said above - I believe that important truth regarding the Person of the Lord Jesus underlies it. However, as you've pointed out here, there is the danger of negatively affecting others. Perhaps it's time that I bowed out.

The more I think about this Grant and pray and listen - well the more I feel you are correct and Euphemia is correct and in some manner we are all correct and at times all miss it.

I mean for example.........we worship God and sing and pray and seek Him and adore Him and we can say it was a very spiritual time. We can say our words were spirit filled unto the Lord. Now on the flip side we get to work and the boss is all over us for something he did but blames you. You get all worked up and begin to tell him like it is and what he can do with his blame.

SAME VOICE both in the worship and in the lashing out. So in retro speck it all DEPENDS ON THE HEART of the one doing the worship. The tongue and hands and voice and feet (dancing) music instument all can be a spiritual time when THE HEART is right but all by them selves they are just objects.

Maybe this makes some sense.
God Bless Grant,
Jim

 

[Grant Melville]

So in retro speck it all DEPENDS ON THE HEART of the one doing the worship.

I think that's it in a nutshell, brother. Worship comes from the heart, and it is in spirit, I think we can all agree on that. Whether or not anything else is required of man or valued of God except that 'heart-response' is the question which we've been discussing - whether anything else could add to that or enhance it. I believe the scripture is absolutely clear regarding that. No natural talent, skill or ability of man is ever connected with worship throughout the New Testament - I think that's something that we can agree on. The contrast between Jewish worship and Christian worship is like night and day, and all that is because of what the Lord Jesus has done. The next question is really how we respond to that change. Are we fully in the light of it?

 

[Euphemia]

I think that's it in a nutshell, brother. Worship comes from the heart, and it is in spirit, I think we can all agree on that. Whether or not anything else is required of man or valued of God except that 'heart-response' is the question which we've been discussing - whether anything else could add to that or enhance it. I believe the scripture is absolutely clear regarding that. No natural talent, skill or ability of man is ever connected with worship throughout the New Testament - I think that's something that we can agree on. The contrast between Jewish worship and Christian worship is like night and day, and all that is because of what the Lord Jesus has done. The next question is really how we respond to that change. Are we fully in the light of it?

God uses our natural abilities and His God-given talents to bring glory to Himself. We ought to be available for His use, and that includes in worship as well. To consider our special abilities as fleshly and to reject the use of them in the worship of our God in any way is error, and is destructive to the intimacy we can share with God.

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

I think that's it in a nutshell, brother. Worship comes from the heart, and it is in spirit, I think we can all agree on that. Whether or not anything else is required of man or valued of God except that 'heart-response' is the question which we've been discussing - whether anything else could add to that or enhance it. I believe the scripture is absolutely clear regarding that. No natural talent, skill or ability of man is ever connected with worship throughout the New Testament - I think that's something that we can agree on. The contrast between Jewish worship and Christian worship is like night and day, and all that is because of what the Lord Jesus has done. The next question is really how we respond to that change. Are we fully in the light of it?

Exactly Brother,
I see this is the big gap in this thread.
You Grant were going from the side it is NOT REQUIRED as in - these things mean nothing.
On the other hand myself and others were going with the sight of- these things are all received by God. They can and are a part of worship but they are not required for what is required is a WILLING AND LOVING HEART.

I know myself took it as if you were insisting that these things are NOT ACCEPTABLE UNTO GOD or as you were saying that God wont honer or receive these things in worship and as part of our worship - For He DOES and will - they simply are not required to enter into worship.

Have a blessed day
Jim

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

God uses our natural abilities and His God-given talents to bring glory to Himself. We ought to be available for His use, and that includes in worship as well. To consider our special abilities as fleshly and to reject the use of them in the worship of our God in any way is error, and is destructive to the intimacy we can share with God.

Exactly Euphemia,
God uses these things - He receives them as part of our worship. They in them selves are meaningless without a Pure Loving Heart for God. It is not that these things are not acceptable unto God for they are when they are accompanied with or by a Loving heart to GOD.
God Bless
Jim