Pastor doesn't want members praying or reading bible together

CCW95A said:
Brother, Faith only comes from one place, and one place only, hearing the voice of the living Word of God!!! There is no other way, unless you want to change what scripture has already told us. Again, the purpose for ALL scripture is to "testify, (point to that Jesus Christ is the Son of God), for correction, for doctrine, for reproof, and for instruction in righteousness:" (2 Tim 3:16) (John 5:39) ALL scripture points to the fact that Jesus is the Son of God. This is what Jesus Christ himself, and the Apostle John has told us!!! Let me explain to you how this works.

When a person hears the "scriptures", what does this do? It is "instructing a person in righteousness", by testifying that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
Now what? Once a person finds this out by the scriptures, which testify, and points to the fact that Jesus Christ is Son of God (the living active Word of God) The scriptures "instructs" that person again on how to get this person (the living Word of God) to be their savior.

Rom 10:9.. That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10.. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

While all this is going on who do suppose is knocking on the door of that persons heart drawing them to come to him? Whose voice are they hearing that is speaking directly to them? Who did Abraham, and Enoch hear? Where did their faith come from? We are told to have the faith of Abraham. How did Abraham receive his faith? There is only one way to get faith, and that is by hearing the voice of the living Word of God. We receive faith in exactly the same way they did, except they did not have scripture that pointed to Jesus Christ, but God told Abraham that in him and the nations shall be blessed, and His seed (Jesus Christ) would inherit all the land as a everlasting inheritance.
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Do you honestly believe what you are saying????? Do you have a concept of the error you are proposing????

We can only be saved by faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. We agree on that ( think).

You have just said..........
" Faith only comes from one place, and one place only, hearing the voice of the living Word of God!!!"

If what you are proposing has any validity to it at all, then how in the world do you explain how DEAF people get saved?????

They can not hear anything that is said so how has so many people who can not hear come to be saved?????
They have never heard a sermon, a song or the voice of the living Word of God. How did they get saved if we believe what you are proposing????
 
CCW95A said:
Does anybody have "pure" doctrine? Nobody has sense we are all learning new things daily. There are things that I believe that are in line with other denominations, but I am not a part of any of them.
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I am sure that you belive that.

As for pure doctrine......

Titus 1:9 ...................
"He must hold firm to the trustworthy word as taught, so that he may be able to give instruction in sound doctrine and also to rebuke those who contradict it. "

Titus 2:1
"But as for you, teach what accords with sound doctrine. "

2 Timothy 4:2-4 ...........
"Preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, and exhort, with complete patience and teaching. For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths."
 
CCW95A said:
This is correct as there were no scriptures at the time of Abraham to look to. All he had was the voice of the living Word of God, which is all we need to understand and interpret the Holy scriptures to us as the living Word of God who speaks directly to us. :)
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And just how do YOU know that it is the voice of God who is speaking to you Curtis????

John 8:44
"You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies. "

2 Corinthians 11:14
"No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. "
 
Major said:
And just how do YOU know that it is the voice of God who is speaking to you Curtis????

John 8:44
"You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies. "

2 Corinthians 11:14
"No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. "
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Brother, Wisdom is always "justified" by all of her children. You can not have the "Wisdom" that comes down "from above" without having all her children who testifies to the one who has it. If you do not know who these children are, then let me show you.

Jas 3:17.. But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.

Did you notice where this Wisdom comes from? "From above"!!! The very "first" thing that this Wisdom is that is above all of its other qualities is that it is first "pure", meaning it will NEVER "compromise" the truth even if it is to it;s own hurt.
 
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Major said:
I am sure that you belive that.

As for pure doctrine......

Titus 1:9 ...................
"He must hold firm to the trustworthy word as taught, so that he may be able to give instruction in sound doctrine and also to rebuke those who contradict it. "

Titus 2:1
"But as for you, teach what accords with sound doctrine. "

2 Timothy 4:2-4 ...........
"Preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, and exhort, with complete patience and teaching. For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths."
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Where do you think God speaks to us from? Where is his location?

Heb 12:25.. See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:
 
CCW95A said:
Brother, Wisdom is always "justified" by all of her children. You can not have the "Wisdom" that comes down "from above" without having all her children who testifies to the one who has it. If you do not know who these children are, then let me show you.

Jas 3:17.. But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.

Did you notice where this Wisdom comes from? "From above"!!! The very "first" thing that this Wisdom is that is above all of its other qualities is that it is first "pure", meaning it will NEVER "compromise" the truth even if it is to it;s own hurt.
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Wisdom is thinking like God thinks - wisdom is doing things as God does - Wisdom is understanding what He has written in His word.
 
CCW95A said:
Where do you think God speaks to us from? Where is his location?

Heb 12:25.. See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:
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In a true sense, it has always been God who is the spokesman at all times through all the holy men who have written down the words in our Bible. He spoke to Moses and Moses spoke to the people. He spoke to Paul through the Holy Spirit and Paul wrote down the words given to him.

"See that ye refuse not Him that speaketh"............Him of course is the Lord and it is Him who is the subject matter that introduces the Hebrew epistle that tells us that the Written Word of God is just as valid as is the spoken Word of God.

Hebrews 1:1.......
"God, who at different times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets."

Therefore give heed to what He has said and see that you do not refuse Him.

Romans 1;16-18..........
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness".

Apart from God’s Holy Written Word, we would be up a creek without a paddle.

1 Peter 1:23.........
“Being born again, not of corruptible SEED, but of incorruptible, BY THE WORD OF GOD, which liveth and abideth for ever”.

What is that SEED Curtis??????

The Bible is the “seed” in our heart that can sprout into new spiritual life. This can only happen by the power of God’s Holy Spirit. Whether or not the seed dies or lives is dependent upon you and me.

The Word of God is NOT merely a book, the Written Word of God is alive! Notice the words, “...which liveth and abideth forever.”It is alive because Christ is alive.
 
Major said:
In a true sense, it has always been God who is the spokesman at all times through all the holy men who have written down the words in our Bible. He spoke to Moses and Moses spoke to the people. He spoke to Paul through the Holy Spirit and Paul wrote down the words given to him.

"See that ye refuse not Him that speaketh"............Him of course is the Lord and it is Him who is the subject matter that introduces the Hebrew epistle that tells us that the Written Word of God is just as valid as is the spoken Word of God.

Hebrews 1:1.......
"God, who at different times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets."

Therefore give heed to what He has said and see that you do not refuse Him.

Romans 1;16-18..........
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness".

Apart from God’s Holy Written Word, we would be up a creek without a paddle.

1 Peter 1:23.........
“Being born again, not of corruptible SEED, but of incorruptible, BY THE WORD OF GOD, which liveth and abideth for ever”.

What is that SEED Curtis??????

The Bible is the “seed” in our heart that can sprout into new spiritual life. This can only happen by the power of God’s Holy Spirit. Whether or not the seed dies or lives is dependent upon you and me.

The Word of God is NOT merely a book, the Written Word of God is alive! Notice the words, “...which liveth and abideth forever.”It is alive because Christ is alive.
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Brother Major, what would happen if all the Bibles in the world were burned to ashes, do we loose God? If we did not have the Bible would that mean no one could ever be saved? There is no way God can be "condensed" down into a single book. Even the world could no contain every thing Jesus did while living on planet earth.

Joh 21:25.. And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

If anyone wants to know God in his fullness then the only one who could show you is God himself, who speaks from Heaven.
 
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CCW95A said:
Brother, Wisdom is always "justified" by all of her children. You can not have the "Wisdom" that comes down "from above" without having all her children who testifies to the one who has it. If you do not know who these children are, then let me show you.

Jas 3:17.. But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.

Did you notice where this Wisdom comes from? "From above"!!! The very "first" thing that this Wisdom is that is above all of its other qualities is that it is first "pure", meaning it will NEVER "compromise" the truth even if it is to it;s own hurt.
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That reasoning does not answer the question posed to you. How do you know the voice you heard is from God and not from Satan???

It is not about wisdom my brother, it is about deception and discernment. The "context" of the verse from James that you quoted is aabout true and false wisdom.

The key to this conversation is really about one fact. If a man will NOT accept the Written Word, neither will he accept the Living Word.

It is from the written Word of God that we learn that the Bible is more than just a book, it is a person.

John 1:1............
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and THE WORD WAS GOD”.

John 1:14..........
“And THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth”.

Jesus Christ is the LIVING WORD, the Bible is the WRITTEN WORD. Jesus is the Word of God.

Rev. 19:13.............
“And he(Christ) was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called THE WORD OF GOD”.

Let me say, to spend time with God’s Word is to spend time with God. If we obey the Bible, we are obeying God. If we don’t believe the Bible, we are spitting on God.
 
CCW95A said:
Brother Major, what would happen if all the Bibles in the world are burned, do we loose God? If we did not have the Bible would that mean no one could ever be saved? There is no way God can be "condensed" down into a single book. Even the world could no contain every thing Jesus did while living on planet earth.

Joh 21:25.. And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

If anyone wants to know God in his fullness then the only one who could show you is God himself, who speaks from Heaven.
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Again......you have not answered the questions asked to you. You have said that we must hear the voice of God in order to be saved.

1). Since deaf people cannot hear the voice of God, how do they get saved???

2). How do you know it is the voice of God speaking to you?
 
Major said:
That reasoning does not answer the question posed to you. How do you know the voice you heard is from God and not from Satan???
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Obviously, you do not know what Wisdom is. Do you not know his name? If you have not figured it out I will tell you. Jesus Christ is the Wisdom of God. If you have Wisdom then you for sure know God!!!

1Co 1:24.. But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
 
CCW95A said:
Brother Major, what would happen if all the Bibles in the world were burned to ashes, do we loose God? If we did not have the Bible would that mean no one could ever be saved? There is no way God can be "condensed" down into a single book. Even the world could no contain every thing Jesus did while living on planet earth.

Joh 21:25.. And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

If anyone wants to know God in his fullness then the only one who could show you is God himself, who speaks from Heaven.
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I love you dearly brother, but are you really thinking through your q1uestions????

Were there Bibles in the days of Abraham? Did God still exist? Did we lose God before the law was given to Moses?

Did men get saved before the Bible was written? Was Adam and Eve saved. Was Seth saved?

I have posted this several times and it does not seem that you either understand it or you do not believe it. Hebrews 1:1-2...............
"God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets has in these last days spoken unto us by His Son whom He has appointed heir of all things by whom also he made the worlds".

God has revealed Himself through His spoken Word, by visions, dreams, poetry, sermons, inner thoughts, miracles, tablets of stone, history, angels, and the person of the Lord Jesus Christ.

His means of self revelation today is the written word of God, the Bible.
 
CCW95A said:
Obviously, you do not know what Wisdom is. Do you not know his name? If you have not figured it out I will tell you. Jesus Christ is the Wisdom of God. If you have Wisdom then you for sure know God!!!

1Co 1:24.. But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
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Yes Curtis I in fact do know what wisdom is.

In the written Word of God in Proverbs 9:10......
“the fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom, and knowledge of the Holy One is understanding”.

Now that we have answered your question, could you answer the ones I asked you?

How does a deaf person get saved when he can not hear the voice of God?
How do you know that the voice heard is from God?
 
CCW95A said:
Is not God a Spirit? Spirit speaks to spirit, not Spirit to flesh.
Come on Major, this is all basic Christianity, you should have known this years ago.
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I was thinking the same thing Curtis but did not want to sound like an "elitest".

The question asked, "If faith in Jesus is the only way to have eternal life with God, what about all of the people who have never heard of Jesus?"

You have said that we must HEAR the Voice of God in order to be saved.

The actual answer is in Hebrews 11:1-2.........
"Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen, and men of old gained approval. "
 
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Major said:
How does a deaf person get saved when he can not hear the voice of God?
How do you know that the voice heard is from God?
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You mean you still don't get it after I already told you. The human "ear" has absolutely NOTHING to do with hearing God's voice. It is man's heart (spirit) who hears the Word of God. How is it you don't know this?

1Co 2:9.. But as the Scriptures say, "No one has ever seen, no one has ever heard, no one has ever imagined what God has prepared for those who love him."
1Co 2:10.. But God has shown us these things through the Spirit. The Spirit knows all things. The Spirit even knows the deep secrets of God. (ERV)
 
CCW95A said:
It is man's heart (spirit) who hears the Word of God. How is it you don't know this?
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Not true. 1 John 4:6 But we belong to God. Anyone who knows God listens to us. Anyone who does not belong to God does not listen to us. This is how we know if a spirit is true or not true.

Are you proposing we listen to voices in our head (spirit / heart) over what is said in scripture?

You quote 1 Cor 2:10 1 Co 2:10. But God has shown us these things through the Spirit. The Spirit knows all things. The Spirit even knows the deep secrets of God. (ERV).

But this verse says nothing about God speaking to man's heart (spirit).
 
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