Brother, is the Spirit of Christ impregnated in the scriptures, or is it coming from another place, which is why people are not getting it?
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Pastor doesn't want members praying or reading bible together
- Thread starter pavilion103
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Brother, when you posted that Jesus knocks on the door of a persons life, is that referring to Jesus Christ himself as the living Word of God, or scriptures in the Bible? Can scriptures alone bring a person to Christ? If not, then where is it coming from? Before they had the Bible in the early years of the Church what scriptures were they using to get people saved, and were did Abraham get his scriptures to have faith when there were no scriptures for him to search to see if what the living Word of God was speaking to him was true?
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If we are told to have the "faith" of Abraham which is the father of us all.
Rom 4:16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,
Can anyone on this forum tell me exactly where did Abraham get his faith from? What scriptures did he use to get his faith? There were "0" scriptures for Abraham to get his faith from. If we are to have the "faith" of Abraham how shall we go about getting it?
Rom 4:16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,
Can anyone on this forum tell me exactly where did Abraham get his faith from? What scriptures did he use to get his faith? There were "0" scriptures for Abraham to get his faith from. If we are to have the "faith" of Abraham how shall we go about getting it?
*raises hand* I can.
Abraham's whole life is marked by his spirit of trustfulness, his deep faith in creator God. Of him it is recorded that ‘he believed the Lord; and He [the Lord] reckoned it to him as righteousness’ (Gn. 15:6). This text is taken up by New Testament writers, and the fundamental truth it expresses developed more fully.
As Romans 12:3 demonstrates, "God has allotted to each a measure of faith." Humanity has the ability to exercise faith. Faith is an instrument that people may choose to exercise or not to exercise. They may place their faith in something that is true or not true, but the ability itself is God given. Humanity is endowed with it and faith is a uniquely human possibility.
But you asked where did Abraham get his faith from.
Abraham was a descendent of Shem who was a son of Noah. The knowledge of creator God, who saved his ancestors, was passed down to Abraham who exercised his faith with respect to it.
And not to get off on a tangent but people today think of Christianity as an off-shoot of Judaism; however, it's important to remember that the core beliefs of Christians that God would take on flesh, die and rise again were already evident among Abraham’s Horite people (who remembered the ancient promises of God).
The dying and rising of God in terms of the sun’s rising and setting (not to be confused with later pagan mythologies, syncretism, etc...) was present in their culture (noting that they did not worship the sun as the pagans did).
Rather the sun served as the best analogy for the ancient promise of Creator God who made and ultimately ruled over the whole world. Unlike its lesser opposite the moon, the sun makes life possible on earth. It is the great light from which the moon receives its light. In Genesis 1:16, the sun is called the "greater light" and the moon the "lesser light." The sun and the moon were never considered equal among the Horite people who retained this cultural metaphor in rememberance of their creator and His ancient promise.
Abraham's whole life is marked by his spirit of trustfulness, his deep faith in creator God. Of him it is recorded that ‘he believed the Lord; and He [the Lord] reckoned it to him as righteousness’ (Gn. 15:6). This text is taken up by New Testament writers, and the fundamental truth it expresses developed more fully.
As Romans 12:3 demonstrates, "God has allotted to each a measure of faith." Humanity has the ability to exercise faith. Faith is an instrument that people may choose to exercise or not to exercise. They may place their faith in something that is true or not true, but the ability itself is God given. Humanity is endowed with it and faith is a uniquely human possibility.
But you asked where did Abraham get his faith from.
Abraham was a descendent of Shem who was a son of Noah. The knowledge of creator God, who saved his ancestors, was passed down to Abraham who exercised his faith with respect to it.
And not to get off on a tangent but people today think of Christianity as an off-shoot of Judaism; however, it's important to remember that the core beliefs of Christians that God would take on flesh, die and rise again were already evident among Abraham’s Horite people (who remembered the ancient promises of God).
The dying and rising of God in terms of the sun’s rising and setting (not to be confused with later pagan mythologies, syncretism, etc...) was present in their culture (noting that they did not worship the sun as the pagans did).
Rather the sun served as the best analogy for the ancient promise of Creator God who made and ultimately ruled over the whole world. Unlike its lesser opposite the moon, the sun makes life possible on earth. It is the great light from which the moon receives its light. In Genesis 1:16, the sun is called the "greater light" and the moon the "lesser light." The sun and the moon were never considered equal among the Horite people who retained this cultural metaphor in rememberance of their creator and His ancient promise.
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Correct.......the Holy Spirit!
The same thing that told Able the right offering to bring.
The same thing that told Abraham when to stop walking.
The Word of God!
Again, "Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God". (Rom. 10:17)
I can see your understanding about certain knowledge being passed down to other generations, which is a good thing, but as for faith we can only go by what the scriptures tells us, which is "Faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the Word of God" (Romans 10:17) Abraham's faith could only have been received by hearing the voice of the Word of God, and not by anything written down.
In the same way "Wisdom" can not be passed down from one person to another, nor can it ever be learned by any type of human experiences. Wisdom is given by God alone in the exact same way "faith" is received. "The Lord gives Wisdom, out of his mouth comes knowledge and understanding." (Pro 2:6) Nobody can go and get faith and bring it to you. You have to receive it directly by the mouth of God. Hearing his voice is the only way faith comes.
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The same for "Enoch" who walked with God, and God took him for he pleased God. Enoch never had any scripture to get faith from, but he did hear the voice of the Word of God which gave him faith.
When we read scriptures we are hearing from Gods mouth. Just because it was written does not take away from the fact that it is Gods word.
Curtis you speak of out of Gods mouth and this is so - however once it is written down it is still out of Gods mouth. Your entire posting of this would have been spot on if you would have left out all the stuff claiming scripture was not the word of God. It casn Not stop being Gods word nor does it stop being alive and full of power.
We can gain much from reading His word -
God Bless
Jim
Along that line they had no bible and daniel had no book of daniel BUT we do !! Thanks be to God
Blessings
Brother, the first person to ever write "scripture" was God himself when he wrote the ten commandments on tablets of stone. The Lord God knew that the law with all of its demands would someday pass away. The living Word of God will never pass away no matter what happens. Scripture with all of its prophecy will also pass away once it fulfills it's task, but the living Word of God will never pass away. Scripture was designed by God through the mouth of men who were being inspired to testify, and to point to his Son Jesus Christ as the eternal Word of God that will never pass away. There are not two ways of receiving faith but only one, and it is only found by the living active eternal Word of God who speaks directly to men's heart. Even Jesus Christ himself told us that all scripture is that which testifies of him, which is exactly what scripture does (John 5:39). Does anyone ask "scripture" to come into ones heart? The Apostle John said in the last part of his Gospel, that every thing he wrote was for the sole purpose of revealing that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. This is what scripture does, it points to and testifies that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
Joh 20:31.. but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.
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So, are you saying God has now changed in how faith is given? It is either through scripture or the actual mouth of the living Word of God. It is either one way or the other, but not both.
I have already posted this before in this thread. Jesus Christ after his resurrection met two disciples on the road to Emmaus. What did Jesus do for these two men?
He, Jesus Christ "The living Word of God" interpreted all the scriptures" from Moses through all the prophets the things concerning himself. Jesus revealed to these two guys every thing that pointed to, and testified he was the Christ in the scriptures!!! Who interpreted the "scriptures"? The Living Word of God!!! What do all the scriptures do? They testify, and point to that Jesus Christ is the living Word of God!!
Luke 24:26.. Was it not necessary that the Christ should suffer these things and enter into his glory?"
Luke 24:27.. And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he interpreted to them in all the Scriptures the things concerning himself.
He, Jesus Christ "The living Word of God" interpreted all the scriptures" from Moses through all the prophets the things concerning himself. Jesus revealed to these two guys every thing that pointed to, and testified he was the Christ in the scriptures!!! Who interpreted the "scriptures"? The Living Word of God!!! What do all the scriptures do? They testify, and point to that Jesus Christ is the living Word of God!!
Luke 24:26.. Was it not necessary that the Christ should suffer these things and enter into his glory?"
Luke 24:27.. And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he interpreted to them in all the Scriptures the things concerning himself.
When students in high school or even the university are taught in class by their professor, they are not forbidden from studying together in groups for the examination. This also applies to the Church, the Pastor should preach and believe that the sheep will be able to effectively study and pray in groups. Moreover, most Churches have small group meetings outside of Church, and Sunday school meetings. I believe that corporate study of the Word and Prayer are very powerful. Besides, there are some introverts who will not be able to ask questions and express themselves during large Church meetings, and will be able to ask questions and grow Spiritually from out of Church group study and Prayer.
I agree with what you have said here brother. I go to a very small Church. Less that 100 people, yet every one there loves the Lord, and the pastor is anointed. Going to large Church has its downfalls as you can slip in there, and never be noticed by anyone. I have always been the kind of Christian where I asked "lots" of questions, especially when I was a young Christian, because I did not know anything, except "Jesus loves me, yes I know for the Bible tells me so"
Every body needs a place to ask questions and get their questions answered. Not to many pastors now a days have the time, or energy to answer every ones questions. The Church was designed by God to minister to itself in love as each one does it's part. Now that I have been saved almost 40 years, when I ask God for answers about something, I better have a pen and paper ready.
You are confusing law and scripture. Scripture is not the laws that pass away.
Curtis I am tired of this silly argument of yours. If you wish to believe that scripture is nhot the word of God then so be. Enjoy it. Embrace it. It however wont change that what is written is the word of God.........
God Bless
Huh ? No sir you said they could not read but had to hear. I said they had no bible to read. Daniel had to take his man of Gods word for it - he did not have the book of daniel to read or any other book such as we have.........stick to the point of what is replied to please...... lol
Which is exactly what I have been talking about in this whole thread. Faith comes by "hearing the Word of God." Does faith come by reading scripture? It does not!!!
You have to make up your mind, you either receive faith by reading scripture, or by hearing the Word of God. Which one do you think is right?
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Was the law given through scripture? Is it not through scripture we know the law? Brother, I am not trying to change anything. I simply read scripture, and believe what it says.
Brother what is it exactly that you are setting out to do ? Because honestly you are stretching things so far it has become strange. Now here is why I say this.
Now explain to me how it is yoou feel or think or come up with this question ?
1..You have to make up your mind, you either receive faith by reading scripture, or by hearing the Word of God. Which one do you think is right?
So in a sense this question here is a good answer for your question.....
How do you hear if you do not read. How do you compare what you heard if you do not read?
What is the new testament Brother ? Is this simply words or task or empty filler for a nice book called the bible ? Come on Curtis - enough of this already - rofl how can you honestly sit there and say that what is written in the bible is not Gods word ?
I have a question for you - Do you still feel you can not build up your faith or faith doers not grow ?
God Bless
Jim