POLITICS HAS REPLACED THE CHURCH!

Major said:
Bob...........My whole point is that way too many people now follow what their Political party states more than they do what God has stated in His word.
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Hello Major;

I understand your point, brother, but we cannot dismiss that narrow gate, our brothers and sisters who consciously exercise more on what God states in His Word, first.

Look, politics has been with us through the ages and again, we cannot tackle politics if we aren't tackling our faith in Christ, first in everything.

Love in Christ.
Bob
 
bobinfaith said:
Look, politics has been with us through the ages and again, we cannot tackle politics if we aren't tackling our faith in Christ, first in everything.
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politics has a broad meaning.. no politics as in republicans' or democrats are not part of the church. but politics is in the local assembly so often the upper hand has a say.

let me give a example a church the wife and i use to attend. is run by a board the majority of that board is mostly one family. the other 2 on the board will go along with the family.. dont get me wrong there all great people . but they have lots say in the Church.

another example we attended a singing ,the Church hosted a full time Gospel group . the deacon of the Church was a major car dealer . so often money influences. people who hold positions in the Church. that is politics .. mind you a rich man can be a deacon even though it of my personal belief . a deacon should be a calling like a preacher
 
crossnote said:
Do you think Jesus earned the respect you speak of as they were crucifying Him?
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Jesus earned respect long before that, which is part of why they crucified him. In other words, the apostles, disciples and people already respected him. Being jealous, the Jewish leadership conspired to murder him. If the people had no respect then the leadership would have barely noticed him.
 
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forgiven61 said:
politics has a broad meaning.. no politics as in republicans' or democrats are not part of the church. but politics is in the local assembly so often the upper hand has a say. let me give a example a church the wife and i use to attend. is run by a board the majority of that board is mostly one family. the other 2 on the board will go along with the family.. dont get me wrong there all great people . but they have lots say in the Church. another example we attended a singing ,the Church hosted a full time Gospel group . the deacon of the Church was a major car dealer . so often money influences. people who hold positions in the Church. that is politics .. mind you a rich man can be a deacon even though it of my personal belief . a deacon should be a calling like a preacher
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Hello forgiven;

As you shared, politics has it's broad meaning and after reading two of your examples there were similar instances in our Church but in different scenarios.

Our Board of Directors were the closest to politics in our Church. I attended the meetings of our Board since our inception. We (spiritual leaders) encouraged the directors to approach their role as a ministry, not the White House. We were not to copy what the other Church on the hill was doing. God had His appointed task for our Church as we served the community.

The Board and town hall (all members meeting) had it's heated moments with the upper hand the loudest regarding everything except Bible Studies, Sunday School and Prayer Meetings. Politics and governance does have it's broad meaning in the Church but the leaders - Deacons, Elders and Pastors have to step up and maintain an overall spiritual order in the Gathering of God.

Over the years these latter areas of Bible / Sunday School and Prayer Meetings remained constant (not perfect) and helped us remain focused on our priority to God, first, and His Church.

Love in Christ.
Bob
 
bobinfaith said:
similar instances in our Church but in different scenarios.
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every thing is always different i will be honest i am not a fan of a board ran Church. it just not my cup of tea. your deacons and trustees are type overseers . but then again i have seen deacons over step and hand pick the preacher they want many times what they present everyone goes with , but one thing you are correct any position in the CHURCH should be treated as a ministry. imo also it should be a calling one should be led to that position. not just appointed/hand picked .

its like a former pastor once said if your looking for a perfect Church and find it. it wont be very long because we are there. but i do agree with what your saying.

i have a homecoming to preach in the morning sad to say the one leading it. is most likely lost they only want about ten minuets preaching . Good Lord willing i will be preaching on the subject i had a birth i cant remember and one i cant forget. john 3
 
crossnote said:
Jesus didn't live up to their Messianic expectation, so on Palm Sunday they were chanting 'Hosanna!' but by Thursday they were chanting 'Crucify Him!'. Just not my idea of the word 'respect'.
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I always envisioned these as two separate groups. The Sunday "Hosana" people were the working class, not connected to politics, not very "religious", despised the Romans, and those who followed Jesus around for the healings and teachings. The other "Crucify Him" group were the politically connected, so religious for everyone to see, buddy-buddy with the Pharisees, and those who thought they were better than the working grunts and liked the Romans.
 
Big Moose said:
I always envisioned these as two separate groups. The Sunday "Hosana" people were the working class, not connected to politics, not very "religious", despised the Romans, and those who followed Jesus around for the healings and teachings. The other "Crucify Him" group were the politically connected, so religious for everyone to see, buddy-buddy with the Pharisees, and those who thought they were better than the working grunts and liked the Romans.
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That's a remote possibility, but remember, the same crowd that chanted 'crucify Him!' wanted Barrabas, an insurrectionist, released. Mt 27:15-22.
 
crossnote said:
That's a remote possibility, but remember, the same crowd that chanted 'crucify Him!' wanted Barrabas, an insurrectionist, released. Mt 27:15-22.
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It seems we have three distinct groups:

1) The Jewish leaders who hated Jesus for his perceived blasphemy.
2) The would-be revolutionaries who wanted a warrior-messiah and hated Jesus for what they perceived as him co-opting the Messiah.
3) The Jews and gentiles alike who actually knew Jesus and loved him. These would become the early Church.

I suppose we should add a fourth category, those who did not know Jesus or have any opinion of him one way or another.
 
LearningToLetGo said:
It seems we have three distinct groups:

1) The Jewish leaders who hated Jesus for his perceived blasphemy.
2) The would-be revolutionaries who wanted a warrior-messiah and hated Jesus for what they perceived as him co-opting the Messiah.
3) The Jews and gentiles alike who actually knew Jesus and loved him. These would become the early Church.

I suppose we should add a fourth category, those who did not know Jesus or have any opinion of him one way or another.
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It's all conjecture, so who knows. We do know that man is fickle and can change like the weather..

John 2:24-25
But Jesus did not entrust Himself to them, for He knew them all. He did not need any testimony about man, for He knew what was in a man.
 
LearningToLetGo said:
It seems we have three distinct groups:

1) The Jewish leaders who hated Jesus for his perceived blasphemy.
2) The would-be revolutionaries who wanted a warrior-messiah and hated Jesus for what they perceived as him co-opting the Messiah.
3) The Jews and gentiles alike who actually knew Jesus and loved him. These would become the early Church.

I suppose we should add a fourth category, those who did not know Jesus or have any opinion of him one way or another.
Click to expand...

Hello Jason;

Yes, you are correct regarding the three groups of people during Jesus mission. Each one had it's mix of politics;

1) The Jewish leaders who hated Jesus for his perceived blasphemy.

In Matthew 21:25-26 when Jesus asked, 25 The baptism of John, from where did it come? From heaven or from man?” And they discussed it among themselves, saying, “If we say, ‘From heaven,’ he will say to us, ‘Why then did you not believe him?’ 26 But if we say, ‘From man,’ we are afraid of the crowd, for they all hold that John was a prophet.”

2) The would-be revolutionaries who wanted a warrior-messiah and hated Jesus for what they perceived as him co-opting the Messiah.

Jesus was rejected by many of His own people because Israel’s Messiah from the Old Testament had Jewish expectations of their promised Messiah in Roman times. He let them down.

3) The Jews and gentiles alike who actually knew Jesus and loved him. These would become the early Church.

At the cross stood the few who loved and followed Him, the three Marys, John and later the apostles. Many others scattered from Him for fear of the Jewish leaders and Romans.

The fourth category would be many, many others who may or may not have known Jesus, did or did not care and didn't make a mark in the Bible.

Love in Christ.
Bob
 
The government carries the sword to PUNISH (not counsel) evil doers;
The Church carries the Gospel to save the (so-called 'good') and the evil..

Romans 1:16
For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.
 
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bobinfaith said:
Hello forgiven;

As you shared, politics has it's broad meaning and after reading two of your examples there were similar instances in our Church but in different scenarios.

Our Board of Directors were the closest to politics in our Church. I attended the meetings of our Board since our inception. We (spiritual leaders) encouraged the directors to approach their role as a ministry, not the White House. We were not to copy what the other Church on the hill was doing. God had His appointed task for our Church as we served the community.

The Board and town hall (all members meeting) had it's heated moments with the upper hand the loudest regarding everything except Bible Studies, Sunday School and Prayer Meetings. Politics and governance does have it's broad meaning in the Church but the leaders - Deacons, Elders and Pastors have to step up and maintain an overall spiritual order in the Gathering of God.

Over the years these latter areas of Bible / Sunday School and Prayer Meetings remained constant (not perfect) and helped us remain focused on our priority to God, first, and His Church.

Love in Christ.
Bob
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I never had a "Board of Directors".

I did have a board of Deacons. I never made big changes and I always ran decisions by them as it is always best to have friends than enemies. Because I made them team players I never had one single problem with my Deacons in running the church! Not One!
 
LearningToLetGo said:
Jesus earned respect long before that, which is part of why they crucified him. In other words, the apostles, disciples and people already respected him. Being jealous, the Jewish leadership conspired to murder him. If the people had no respect then the leadership would have barely noticed him.
Click to expand...
Are you sure about that.

They respected Him so they had to kill Him???

Preachers frequently explain Jesus’s death in exclusively theological terms: He died a sacrificial death by the will of God. Yes, he did, and the theological purposes behind his death were clearly of the utmost importance.

Personally, I would say that the Pharisees regarded Jesus as a challenge to their authority in the synagogue and realized that their way of making money would end.

As the old Baptist preacher Vance Havner used to say, ..........“Jesus was not crucified for saying ‘Behold the lilies of the field, how they toil not, neither do they spin,’ but for saying, ‘Behold the Pharisees, how they steal.’

Then the Herodians, who hoped to regain the Emperor’s approval and return to power.

Instead of "Respect", I for one will say that The hatred that put Jesus on a cross was no match for the love the laid him in a manger – and raised him from a grave.
 
Major said:
Are you sure about that.

They respected Him so they had to kill Him???
Click to expand...
Please see my earlier response for clarification.

POLITICS HAS REPLACED THE CHURCH!

Bob...........My whole point is that way too many people now follow what their Political party states more than they do what God has stated in His word. Hello Major; I understand your point, brother, but we cannot dismiss that narrow gate, our brothers and sisters who consciously exercise...
christianforumsite.com
 
Major said:
I never had a "Board of Directors".

I did have a board of Deacons. I never made big changes and I always ran decisions by them as it is always best to have friends than enemies. Because I made them team players I never had one single problem with my Deacons in running the church! Not One!
Click to expand...

Hello Major;

That’s good and no doubt the consistency with your board of deacons helped. Many Churches don’t have organized, formed committees that are Biblical and necessary to help accomplish visions of ministry.

In my assessment, disorganization in the Church governance festers small forms of short cut politics.

We had a Board of Directors. It functioned and was structured. Because of my career background I could not accept disorganization in the governance of our Church. They also took care of the bylaws and business side e.g., the statement of information, insurance, depreciation of church fixed assets, etc…

Our pastoral staff included the deacons in our meetings but they had their separate duties in the church. Overall, this was the autonomy of our church and the CSBC met with us and gave their constructive advice each year and ways we could improve with the ongoing challenges in ministry.
 
bobinfaith said:
Hello Major;

That’s good and no doubt the consistency with your board of deacons helped. Many Churches don’t have organized, formed committees that are Biblical and necessary to help accomplish visions of ministry.

In my assessment, disorganization in the Church governance festers small forms of short cut politics.

We had a Board of Directors. It functioned and was structured. Because of my career background I could not accept disorganization in the governance of our Church. They also took care of the bylaws and business side e.g., the statement of information, insurance, depreciation of church fixed assets, etc…

Our pastoral staff included the deacons in our meetings but they had their separate duties in the church. Overall, this was the autonomy of our church and the CSBC met with us and gave their constructive advice each year and ways we could improve with the ongoing challenges in ministry.
Click to expand...
I was very blessed Robert. I had an active bank president and a retired bank president and a CPA as members. They made up the finance committee and took care of all the financial needs of the church.

We uselly had a deacons meeting once a month and each committee would make a report to them on any pending business. We would then take those recommendations to the church in a business meeting and allow the church body to decide on anything requested.

The deacons were 7 Godly men who wanted nothing more than to see the church succeed and Christ lifted up.
 
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