Speak Your Mind

[Major]

Respectable nonsense. Sorry brother. Well it’s better than no sense at all. Did you mean you do not agree with the idea of parables teaching us as a kingdom of priest from all nations how to walk by faith, concealing the mysteries from the faithless? I would ofer the parable below.

What does it teach?

Proverbs 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.

I would think if no desire to search no conclusion to the parable .Historical is what we have the literal (no mixing of faith . I would think both are needed to find the conclussion .

Sons of God are the believers. Abel is the first son of God accredited by the fullness of Christ grace that worked in him .His blood cries out from the corrupted heart of earth, longing to be clothed with the promised new incorruptible body which as sons of God we are. Not what we will be The new bride made up of all the nations of the world .

Those who mix faith the unseen with the temporal seen they receive the rest yoked with Christ. They would refuse to make Jesus into a circus seal like the faithless outward Jews

John 4:48 Then said Jesus unto him, Except ye see signs and wonders, ye will not believe.

John 6:30 They said therefore unto him, What sign shewest thou then, that we may see, and believe thee? what dost thou work?

It would seem when looking at the parable in Revelation 20 you forgot to consider the interpretation instruction in the first verse. It I believe teaches us that not only did the Holy Spirit inspire the thoughts of God from heaven ( the whole book all the chapters ), but also signified it, the language of parables or called hidden manna in Revelation 2. The bread of unfamiliarly revealing the mysteries hid.

Thousands years is the same kind of metaphor used in other parables the first three times in the bible to represent a unknown (faith issue.) .God does not number days or people rather than us walking by faith (the unseen ) .

The word “thousand” is used many, many times throughout the Bible to represent an unknown as to whatever is in view. he owns the catle on a thosand hill repsents he own all . Many many demonstrations using thousand, ten and hundreds in mutiples for rightly dividing the parables.( mixing faith)

No signs where given to wonder after . . never coming to faith (beleif) the conclusion . Those who do seek after a sign before they will believe God or exercise the faith of Christ that works in the believer today God sends them a strong delusion so that they can continue to believe the lie and wonder, wonder and continue to wonder never coming to the end of faith the salvation of one’s soul .

You could say it makes way for the purgatory false doctrine of wondering marveling ecited the flesh .extending time after one takes there last breath with no end to it .

Revelation 1 King James Version (KJV) The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

The word thousand as to whatever is in view is used many times to represent an unknown.(faith issue)

No signs to wonder after were given. And God is no longer bringing any new revelations; the Book of Revelation is the last chapter in the book of law the Bible. It is sealed with seven seals till the end of time, the last day under the Sun. There are no laws missing by which we could know God more intimately. Our armor of God protects us informing, if any man after the last revelation was given to John says the lord said this, I saw him here or there or had a dream we are commanded to believe not. He warned us before time (the last Chapter Revelation.) .It’s how we can try the spirits to see if they are inspired from above heavenly or earthly corrupted .

Luke 11:29 And when the people were gathered thick together, he began to say, This is an evil generation: they seek a sign; and there shall no sign be given it, but the sign of Jonas the prophet.

The sign of Jonas the prophet was fulfilled at the cross by the Son of man .

A closing warning not to seek after signs as a means to wonder after in the last chapter 22 of Revelation is given to all who do seek after the literal word and not the hidden manna (signified understanding )The interpretation is given exclusively to those who do seek the understanding of parables hid from the evil generation that seek after signs .”Show us a miracle then we will believe”. No sign was given to wonder about.

I understand that the Legion fell in the beginning after creation Genesis, when God saw pride in that’s spirit of lies heart because of the glory of creation before that fall. That glory departed on day three. The full presence of God will again be the glory in the new with the new bride. But that’s not the fall I am speaking of. The one I am referring to does not mean the spirit of error has been made to no effect and there is no deception in the world . That’s the new order with our new bodies when the legion will be a thing of the past never coming to mind forever and ever.

I am referring to the parable in Revelation 20 in respect to all the nations “ the entire world” as sign to mankind we do not need men to teach and lord it over our new faith the pagan foundation.

How beautiful are the feet of those shod with the gospel sent them out two by two. The greatest time in history. A time like never before or ever again the renting of the veil. The sign of circumcision of the first born Jesus therefore revealing the mysteries hidden from time past of the bloody husband Christ because of circumcision .

Loking at another parble there the Holy Spirt used the phrase Blody husband to represnt the Son of man Jesus Bloody husband a reference to the husband of the bride of Christ the church that the Father named Christian in the book of Acts formerly calling her Israel as in all Israel are not born again Israel . Christian a more befitting name to name the bride of Christ made up of all the nations as families of the earth . Literally meaning according to a demonym ; A word that identifies people by location and founder. Like Philippians, Galatians, Nicolaitanes etc.

Christian with no other meaning added . . . . residents of the city of Christ named after her founder and husband Christ. Prepared as His chaste virgin bride the many lively stones that make up the spirit unseen house the wife of Christ. .

It is shown in an Old Testament parable (bloody husband) which I would think can help us understand the reason for circumcision as sign of the first born. The veil in respect to our blody husband Christ will remain rent until the last day.

.It is similar to the parable of Abraham and Isaac with the ram caught in the bush . It uses Zipporah a gentile woman to represent the church as the new creatures. .as to what we will be neither male nor female, Jew nor gentile and uses her son the first born Gershom meaning an alien or I have been a stranger in a strange land. To represent new creatures in Christ.

Surely Zipporah was not calling Gersom her son her "bloody husband" She understood the mystery of faith of the suffering of Christ beforehand and and the glory the opening of the veil. . opening the graves of saints that had the Spirit of Christ in them working in respect to the suffering bloody husband before hand .( 1 Peter 1:8-10)

Exodus 2:22 And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the Lord, Israel is my son, even my firstborn: And I say unto thee, Let my son go, that he may serve me: and if thou refuse to let him go, behold, I will slay thy son, even thy firstborn.And it came to pass by the way in the inn, that the Lord met him, and sought to kill him.Then Zipporah took a sharp stone, and cut off the foreskin of her son, and cast it at his feet, and said, Surely a bloody husband art thou to meSo he let him go: then she said, A bloody husband thou art, because of the circumcision.

When the veil representing jesus foreflesh was rent from the top to the botom to show inspired from above and the nakeness holy of holies was revealed there was no Jewish King siting there as a daysman (Pope) fleshly infallible teaching master or interpreter.

I think the law of faith was established when the veil was rent . Believers look to the unseen eternal not that seen the temporal mixing the two making it one perfect law, the just and justier. The Father with the Son .

The Legion could no longer deceive all the nation of the whole world that we do need a man to teach us .That does not mean he will not continue to accuse the brethren day and night as he did in Job 1 until the last day But again he will not deceive all the nation that Jewish flesh could profit for something when we are already informed; Jesus said of his own flesh it profits zero.

They received the end of their new faith from the beging just as us .They look ahead by the power as it is written we look back to the same viel representing our bloody husband .

1 Peter1: 8 -10Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory: Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls. Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:1 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow

The glorious resurrection gate remains open till the last day under the Sun .The veil will not be stitched back together. One demonstration was promised. Some did know Christ after the flesh we know him that way no more forever. God is not a man as us.

I would think there is no need to seek after sign. Signs cannot do any more than make a person wonder or doubt according to those who seek after wonderments or marveling and not after faith the unseen things of God, as it is written . .

Of all that rambling, the only thing said which is acceptable was...........
"I would think there is no need to seek after sign. Signs cannot do any more than make a person wonder or doubt according to those who seek after wonderments or marveling and not after faith the unseen things of God, as it is written . ."!

Bible fact is that signs and wonders were limited to the age of the apostles. This doesn't mean miracles don't happen. It just means they are not the typical or normal way ministry is to be done and are not done by the hands of men. The healing ministry of Jesus and the apostles was unique. Signs and wonders were not done by Christians in general, but were the signs of the apostles, and when the apostles died out, the signs died out.

Now what I said to you then is what I am saying again to you. In reference to your comment I said clearly..............
"Not one single word is validated by any Scripture to support your post. What you just posted is completely FULL BLOWN PRETERISM!"

You originally said......"Satan fell at Pentecost"! THAT is nonsense and totally wrong.

To that I replied.............
"Satan did not fall at Pentecost. What we do know is this: the angels were created before the earth (Job 38:4-7). Satan fell before he tempted Adam and Eve in the Garden (Gen, 3:1-14). Satan’s fall, therefore, must have occurred somewhere after the time the angels were created and before he tempted Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden. Whether Satan’s fall occurred hours, days, or years before he tempted Adam and Eve in the Garden, Scripture does not specifically say but he certainly did not FALL AT PENTECOST."

Now you are saying........
"Did you mean you do not agree with the idea of parables teaching us as a kingdom of priest from all nations how to walk by faith, concealing the mysteries from the faithless? I would ofer the parable below."

Gari............Listen,FOCUS-----that is called RAMBLING!!!!!

I said NOTHING about any idea of a parable or teaching of a kingdom or nations or walking by faith. YOU just changed RAMBLIED and said something to draw the attention away from your statement that "SATAN FELL AT PENTECOST".

Again, I said...........
"Satan fell before he tempted Adam and Eve in the Garden (Gen, 3:1-14). Satan’s fall, therefore, must have occurred somewhere after the time the angels were created and before he tempted Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden. Whether Satan’s fall occurred hours, days, or years before he tempted Adam and Eve in the Garden, Scripture does not specifically say but he certainly did not FALL AT PENTECOST."

As for the teachings from the Scriptures being how to walk in faith, and how to explain the mysteries............

2 Timothy 3:16
"All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness."

1 Timothy 5:20
"As for those who persist in sin, rebuke them in the presence of all, so that the rest may stand in fear."

 

[Musicmaster]

I think we need to start a thread on Preterism, and show how easy it is to debunk.

The only weakness in such discussions would be that they have no authoritative writings/literature to debunk that clearly define all the subjective spiritualizations they force upon their readings of scripture...

MM

 

[Musicmaster]

If I were to dare venture into the minefield of Preterist thinking, the only means for deriving much of the spiritualizations they come up with would have to be similar to closing the eyes, and meditating upon nothingness, and therefore opening self up to something similar to an out-of-body experience in the New Age movement. If they are not going by what someone else has told them is the spiritual imagery tied to specific, key verses in the Bible, then they are either making it up as they go, or have been in deep meditation through emptying the mind so that a "familiar spirit" can fill that void and instruct them...

(shivering) That's not an exercise I ever wish to try and repeat...

Now, some may say, "That's an offensive demonization of a theological belief system, and so that's not fair, and it's unsubstantiated...!"

Is it? Are we not engaging a topical belief system that not only contradicts, and even outright rejects any form of literalism where it's convenient to do so, but also introduces logical conclusions that are anti-God, anti-Christ, anti-Holy Spirit, anti-reason along the lines of accepted hermeneutics and the many other well-established methods for interpretational analysis?

They outright reject the full body armor of spiritual-tangibles whereby we gird up our minds, souls, and spirits, thus firmly rooted in the established beliefs handed down to us from the apostles. There is no solid grounding in their belief system. Each of them I have ever encountered had vastly differing interpretations of key areas of scripture. They have no creed nailed down for a solid footing whereby they may have common ground upon which they can say they are all standing in unison. Collectively, they all stand together, aiming their weapons in so many other directions that they hit almost nothing at all of which they oppose.

Paul of Tarsus gave to us who believe the Lord's revelations for common targets at which we may all point our weaponry, and thus being a far more effective and targeting force against the darkness of this world. The enemy has nothing to fear from a disjointed and non-unified army of Preterists. They have everything to fear from a unified force under the Headship of the One Lord who is the Creator of all.

How's that for valid spiritualization? I know nothing apart from what the Lord has given to us to COLLECTIVELY understand through His appointed apostles, and by His unifying and eternally powerful Anointing.

Amen?

MM

 

[Garee]

Some of the things you have said and the theology of your agenda teaches are..........

1. The whole world saw the son come in the clouds.

I am not a Preterist but rather Amil . . no literal thousand years. remember without parbles the poetic tongue of God Christ spoke not . I have a hope of abiding in the interpretation instructions in verse of of Revelation 1 teaching us not only inspired but signified it as the word of God . The langauage of parables I believe in mixing the two. . the thing seen the temporal shadow with the unseen glory of God

Yes, they saw by eye of the heart . the coming of the Son of man by faith or empowered by the father not seen Revelation 20:5 all the nations could no longer be deceived. Not indiviual people. When the veil was rent the Holy of Holies was revealed there was no man as an infallible teacher(daysman or Pope) siting. A gospel sign to the whole world .Confirming we walk by faith the unseen eternal .It was then that the spirit of lies could no longer deceive the whole world that we need a man to teach us.

2. Zech. 12 fulfills Mt.24:30.

The sign of the Son of man sign as a shadow and not the literal Son of man.(corrupted flesh and blood ) Corrupted flesh and blood cannot enter the new order.

Jesus said in John 6 of his own corrupted dying flesh and blood it profits for nothing zero. . as the temporal things seen. What did profit was the power coming from the unseen father it was revealed when the Son of man cried out for strength to finish the work of the two suffering unto death to bring the peace of God

Not as I will but you father.

3. Nero was the “beast” and “The man of sin” (2 Thess. 2:4) has come.

Satan the antichrist the serpent or father of lies is the opposing spirit "the antichrist (singular) .The man of sin seeing he has no form, mankind is his choice .Saying you will surely not die his motive . . He works in the antichrists many (Humans) many where there during the time of reformation .

The singular the spirt behin the work must be seperated from the many antischrists. mankind

A demonstariton of the spirit of antichrist working pride in the heart of Peter used as an antichist. Peter under pridefull illusion that he was the key that the gates of hell could never prevail against and not the unseen gospel .peter move by the spirt of the anchist the spirt of lies forbid Jeus the Son of man from performing the outward propmised demonstrarion of the work of the lamb of God slain from Genesis the foundation of the gospel .

The father gave the Son of man the prophet Jesus words to rebuke the antichrist saying to the antichrist not directed towads Peter. get behind Him not seen not the Son of man seen before the fall It show its ofensive to God to atribute his work to makind seen (the man or men of sin sinners.

Mathew 16: 21-23 From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day. Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee. But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

In the garden of Eden the spirit of erro the antichrist savoured the things of serpent .God removed the posibillity of walking by faith cut the legs off .Lying spirit are not subject to alvation

In that way Peter a beliver was forgeven of blasphemy against the son of man Jesus who had no power to rebuke by his own will . When the Son of man left that window of opportunty ended. No forgivenes today of those who claim to be a daysman or Pope , a infallible interpreter set between eternal God not seen and man temporal seen with seeking the apporoval of both again the unseen and that seen mankind

Matthew 12:31-32 [Full Chapter]Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

4. Jesus is the “prince that did come” spoken of in Dan.9.

I would sugest God reckons all believers a kingdom of priest, as princes He is our King not seen

1 Corinthians 4:8 Now ye are full, now ye are rich, ye have reigned as kings without us: and I would to God ye did reign, that we also might reign with you.

5. The “end” of the world (age) refers to the end of the Jewish world in 70 AD when the temple was destroyed and Israel was scattered.

When Jesus walked out of the temple made with human hands (the abomination of desolation he declared it void .The mark of His word it will not return void of the porose fro which he sents it in our hearts Not stones that fell in 70 AD no sign was give Not will be made desolate but is left unto you desolate

Mathew 23 38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

6. It was the last days of the old system.

yes, The time of refomantion one like never before or ever again

7. The fall of “Babylon” of Revelation 17 refers to the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans.

Earthly jerualenm signifies heavley Jeruaslem of Zionas a shadow earthly will disappear returning to the dust.

8. God replaced Old Testament Israel with the Church, all the promises to Israel now belong to the church.
God changed the name of His bride for Iasreal to Christian the name he named according to the propmise in the book of Acts One bride made up of all the the nations and families of the world A more befiiting name to represent all the nations .the time of refroma rewstoring the government of peace a labor of the father and Son love working together as one Also called a work of faith one mutual faith of Christ not seen

9. Satan is already bound in the abyss unable to hinder the spread of the Gospel.

Satan the accuser of the bretern acusa them day and nitgh and wil until the last day under the sun he never stoped hindering it from the first words .You shall surely not die the liar from the begiining

The kind decieving is exclusive the one time event of deciving all the nation the whole world . When the veil was rent there was no Jeiwsh infalible teacher sitting there . Sort of like the fiction Wizzard of Oz Big voice of many waters open the veil litle wizzard with no voice to be headrd on high .

10The spirit being poured out on all flesh already took place.

The Spirt of Christ was poured out on Abel in who he had favor or grace.B No grace was poured out on Cain who killed his brother bring the good news. The first recorded martyr and apostle . sent by the wil of God who worked in Abel to both will and empoer to pleasr God not seen .The first recored murder by the father of lies a murderer from that beginning.

11Rev.7:9

is the end of the age harvest that already took place


Rev.7:9 makes use of the metphoer thousand yeas as a unknow (no man could number) it the golden mesure of faith represents all the beliver from all the nation .The chaste virgin bride of Christ pictured in Revelation 12

Revelation7: 9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

12the fullness of the Gentiles have come in.

Gentiles dded to the fullnes of born again Jews .God is not respecter of corrtped flesh and blood . As soon of God we are not what we will be .just like that of Abel

13Revelation 20 has already been fulfilled.

Yes it is looking back from the last day under the sun. Revaltion 12 reveals time has ened the sun and moon the temporal coruptiion time keeps under the fet of the caste vigin bride the churchthe temporal time kepers are longer needed the glory of God will be the light, there will be no night (darkness )

 

[crossnote]

Martin was a hoot. He wore all that gaudy jewelry, but he was a hard hitter for apologetics and cult influences.

Yes, like about a huge 8" cross around his neck. I loved his N.Y. politically incorrect style. lol

 

[Musicmaster]

Yes, they saw by eye of the heart . the coming of the Son of man by faith or empowered by the father not seen Revelation 20:5 all the nations could no longer be deceived. Not indiviual people. When the veil was rent the Holy of Holies was revealed there was no man as an infallible teacher(daysman or Pope) siting. A gospel sign to the whole world .Confirming we walk by faith the unseen eternal .It was then that the spirit of lies could no longer deceive the whole world that we need a man to teach us.

Garee, I must reject this Charles Taze Russel (of the Jehovah's Witnesses) style of adding to the scriptures what isn't there. I have no reason to believe that you are empowered by the Lord to add to His written word things that clearly are not in the Greek nor the Hebrew. I don't know how you sleep at night adding to the word of God what isn't there! You must not fear the Lord's wrath for adding to His word, but you are treading on dangerous ground before the eyes of the Lord.

I am exhorting you to confess before the Lord this sin, and repent. I say this before our brothers and sisters here in this forum so that this matter may be before this group who confess Christ Jesus as Lord. I say this as a servant of the Lord and in the fear of His Might and His Holiness.

Please reconsider your words, for they water down the word of God to such a subjective level of interpretation that even as an Amillennialist, your steps in life are indeed those of a man in danger of the cursings of the Lord:

Revelation 22:18-19

18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: 19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and [from] the things which are written in this book.

It's one thing to claim that you believe the prophesies were fulfilled in the past, but when you tamper with the word of the Lord by adding "eye of the heart," and other such nonsense that is not in the Greek texts, which is nothing but a corruption of the word of God, that is where I draw the line with you and your antics in toying with the word of God with such irreverent disregard for the infallibility of His word to us. Yes, you can questions the English translations all you want. No problem. However, you have crossed the line when adding what is not in the Greek texts from which our Bibles were translated.

I'm calling you out on this, Garee! Be very careful how you tread, because trampling the word of God in this manner puts you squarely in His hands for whatever He would choose to do with you.

Hebrews 10:26-31

26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. 28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: 29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance [belongeth] unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people. 31 [It is] a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

That verse 31, although couched within a context, is a stand-alone truth that is not at all constrained by that context. It has universal application!

Except that you confess and repent, your words are anathema and cursings, and therefore of no regard whatsoever to me. Apart from your offering of repentance, I knock the dust off my feet at your door step.

MM

 

[crossnote]

I am not a Preterist but rather Amil . . no literal thousand years. remember without parbles the poetic tongue of God Christ spoke not .

hmm, I find it quite interesting that the Old Testament prophecies concerning Christ's first Coming were literally fulfilled which gives me no reason to believe otherwise concerning Christ's second coming.

 

[crossnote]

Re: Preterism- that clearly define all the subjective spiritualizations

Oxymoron Alert

 

[Lanolin]

I keep thinking how God said a thousand years is as one day to Him. So there's some sort of timewarp thing going on there.....

I suppose if you are the centre or outside the Universe time isn't the same thing as it is to an earthling.

 

[ModeratorTeam]

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