VIRGIN BIRTH

CN, that's part of what the scriptures cover, in that the Lord is the One who knows. Traceability through generations that had forgotten their roots renders earthly tracing virtually impossible. What makes the difference in what I have traced is the heritage of faith through my family line going back into Ireland and Germany. That's why we are a valley of dead bones yet to be brought back to life. The scriptures he covers in those videos give no indication as to the individual tribes being able to identify, but that they are descended from Ephraim. THAT is the upheld distinction that we are able to see here, with the Lord knowing the finer details of tribal descent.

MM

However............back to the thread.....is belief in the Virgin Birth an essential to salvation.
 
However............back to the thread.....is belief in the Virgin Birth an essential to salvation.

Thank you, M.

If I may say this: One would need to assess the inflow reasoning behind such a doubt, and then the outflow of disbelieving the virgin birth. Such disbelief has cause, and it has effect with it being stuck in the middle of the stream of that assessment. Or, was it made a premise, or is it a conclusion? The one professing such a disbelief must identify not only its place in their reasoning, but also all the surrounding and supporting rationale.

I've encountered some who disbelieve it on the premise that, because it's not natural, it can't be true...as if the natural governs and renders impossible the supernatural. That's the basis for evolutionary bias, atheistic bias, and many other anti-God biases the world over. It's a violation of rule #1 in logic, and they care not one bit about the violation, which is sad, because they're looked upon as "scholars" by those who have stars in their eyes over all the extra lettering attached to the names of the acclaimed "scholars." I saw that firsthand at university. Some of those kids were so enamored that anything those "degreed scholars" said HAD to be true...they MUST know what they're talking about...right?

HMPH!

MM
 
Actually, I'm one of many descendants from the tribes of Israel. America is the largest melting pot of the ten tribes in the world. I've started a thread over in the OPEN DISCUSSIONS area called "Ten Tribes of Israel - Are You Among Their Number?" The Hebrew Roots movement is a very broad system of theologies that has no defining centrality for doctrine. It's more wild than the old time Mustangs. They hold to many of the same thoughts and beliefs of Messianicism, but they are not the same thing. They see themselves as purely Gentiles grafted in, which may be somewhat true. That's why I launched that thread as an exploratory of the actual history that proves the ten tribes were not lost at all. If that were so, then the valley of bones would not have existed that the thread OP refers to. I would not exist.

So, we do indeed believe in the virgin birth of Yahusha (Jesus).

MM
there wwere NO missing Jewish tribes that migrated to England and Usa, see Armstrongism, as all 10were assimilated into Assyrian Kingdom!
 
there wwere NO missing Jewish tribes that migrated to England and Usa, see Armstrongism, as all 10were assimilated into Assyrian Kingdom!

Armstrongism? (rolling eyes to the ceiling) Oh man, when one aberrant group latches on to any truth, it becomes poo-pooed in the thinking of many out there. Clearly a tool of the enemy.

Thanks for reminding me of that, YF.

MM
 
Thank you, M.

If I may say this: One would need to assess the inflow reasoning behind such a doubt, and then the outflow of disbelieving the virgin birth. Such disbelief has cause, and it has effect with it being stuck in the middle of the stream of that assessment. Or, was it made a premise, or is it a conclusion? The one professing such a disbelief must identify not only its place in their reasoning, but also all the surrounding and supporting rationale.

I've encountered some who disbelieve it on the premise that, because it's not natural, it can't be true...as if the natural governs and renders impossible the supernatural. That's the basis for evolutionary bias, atheistic bias, and many other anti-God biases the world over. It's a violation of rule #1 in logic, and they care not one bit about the violation, which is sad, because they're looked upon as "scholars" by those who have stars in their eyes over all the extra lettering attached to the names of the acclaimed "scholars." I saw that firsthand at university. Some of those kids were so enamored that anything those "degreed scholars" said HAD to be true...they MUST know what they're talking about...right?

HMPH!

MM
You said.........
"I've encountered some who disbelieve it on the premise that, because it's not natural, it can't be true".

YES.......it is not natural AND that is why it is imperative!

The world and many Christians say that the Virgin birth is contrary to nature and science!

That is the whole point!!!!!!!!!

ANY manifestation of God is contrary to nature and science!
 

crossnote

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You said.........
"I've encountered some who disbelieve it on the premise that, because it's not natural, it can't be true".

YES.......it is not natural AND that is why it is imperative!

The world and many Christians say that the Virgin birth is contrary to nature and science!

That is the whole point!!!!!!!!!

ANY manifestation of God is contrary to nature and science!
It’s often been said that if a person can believe Genesis 1:1, they should have no problem believing the rest of God’s Word (including the Virgin Birth)…

Genesis 1:1 KJV
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
 
It’s often been said that if a person can believe Genesis 1:1, they should have no problem believing the rest of God’s Word (including the Virgin Birth)…

Genesis 1:1 KJV
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

Agreed.
 
You said.........
"I've encountered some who disbelieve it on the premise that, because it's not natural, it can't be true".

YES.......it is not natural AND that is why it is imperative!

The world and many Christians say that the Virgin birth is contrary to nature and science!

That is the whole point!!!!!!!!!

ANY manifestation of God is contrary to nature and science!

Yes, they do love thinking that they are on the side of science, when in fact it's pseudo science that they follow after.

Good point, but one that needs to be stated.

MM
 
Armstrongism? (rolling eyes to the ceiling) Oh man, when one aberrant group latches on to any truth, it becomes poo-pooed in the thinking of many out there. Clearly a tool of the enemy.

Thanks for reminding me of that, YF.

MM
That group outdid even the Mormons, as while Mormons hold to good Mormons can become a god and have celestial wives and children in eternity, the Armstrongs held that all of us would become part of the Family of God, so God not a Trinity, but all of us in the Godhead as God!
 
That group outdid even the Mormons, as while Mormons hold to good Mormons can become a god and have celestial wives and children in eternity, the Armstrongs held that all of us would become part of the Family of God, so God not a Trinity, but all of us in the Godhead as God!

YF, I must admit my inability to grasp how that even was close enough to anything I said, or even hinted at, for it to have come to your remembrance at all.

Were you just reading something about that, or did you think there is something in my words that skirts even the outer boundaries of that belief?

My mind is spinning in an attempt to garner even a contrived sense of understanding how that at all closely relates to what I have shared.

MM
 
YF, I must admit my inability to grasp how that even was close enough to anything I said, or even hinted at, for it to have come to your remembrance at all.

Were you just reading something about that, or did you think there is something in my words that skirts even the outer boundaries of that belief?

My mind is spinning in an attempt to garner even a contrived sense of understanding how that at all closely relates to what I have shared.

MM
I was not saying anything about your posting, just commenting on how way out there the Armstrong cult was!
 
Still is as there are many followrs still active.
What is interesting is that the mian group did reform themselves, and now follow it seems the real God and Gospel, as no longer under law, Sabbath, God is trinity, saved by grace alone etc, only time aCult reformed to become christian in its doctrines!
 
I don't know... how can I tell?

Well, to be saved one has to believe, accept and say with the mouth that Jesus is the Christ and that He died and rose from the grave.

Now once that is done.......then comes the question.....Was He born of the Virgin Mary and do I need to belive that in order to be saved?

IMO.....YES you do!

WHY?????

Because, Without the virgin birth, there would be no salvation for sinners. Jesus Christ would be a sinful human being. If the virgin birth did not occur, then the Bible is not true and cannot be trusted. In short, it is an essential part of salvation and of Scripture.
 
Well, to be saved one has to believe, accept and say with the mouth that Jesus is the Christ and that He died and rose from the grave.

Now once that is done.......then comes the question.....Was He born of the Virgin Mary and do I need to belive that in order to be saved?

IMO.....YES you do!

WHY?????

Because, Without the virgin birth, there would be no salvation for sinners. Jesus Christ would be a sinful human being. If the virgin birth did not occur, then the Bible is not true and cannot be trusted. In short, it is an essential part of salvation and of Scripture.
he had to be Virgin Born to bypass the effects of the fall of Adam
 

Via dolarossa

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Well, to be saved one has to believe, accept and say with the mouth that Jesus is the Christ and that He died and rose from the grave.

Now once that is done.......then comes the question.....Was He born of the Virgin Mary and do I need to belive that in order to be saved?

IMO.....YES you do!

WHY?????

Because, Without the virgin birth, there would be no salvation for sinners. Jesus Christ would be a sinful human being. If the virgin birth did not occur, then the Bible is not true and cannot be trusted. In short, it is an essential part of salvation and of Scripture.
I just don't know what to say...
except...I believe!!!!😊😊😊😊😊

so it must be a virgin birth really...
 

crossnote

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Now once that is done.......then comes the question.....Was He born of the Virgin Mary and do I need to belive that in order to be saved?

IMO.....YES you do!

WHY?????
It would be a different Jesus. The Jesus that saved us was born of a virgin...

Mt 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
Lu 1:27
To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary.
Matthew 1:18 (KJV)
Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.
Matthew 1:21 (KJV)
And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.
 
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