What Does Baptism Mean To You

[Candelario Mario Villa]

Water baptism is just the act of professing one's faith. If it were required for salvation, then Jesus lied on the cross to the thief, which we know He never did. How could the thief on the cross get baptized? Baptism means "keep them under until they bubble" in the Greek (jk)

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I like your sense of humor

 

[Abdicate]

Thanks Candelario

 

[Mitspa]

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Gal. 5:4 __ is surely a warning: first against reverting back to the Law, and saying it will save. And even a warning to me: if I would now say that I could be saved by rejecting baptism, and teaching others to do the same. But it would not be a warning to you: for you are not espousing that one should be saved "...by grace through faith...". You are saying that one is only saved by faith through faith!
Enjoy your walk.

What? It seems every time I discuss the scriptures with those who "claim" to keep the ten commandments, they cannot seem to be honest? Wonder why? The strength of sin is the law... The more legalistic these people are, the less honest they are able to be. I never suggested salvation in any way apart from His Grace (read my last post) That is bearing false witness!

 

[Mitspa]

That is exactly what I am saying...Water Baptism in itself will not save anyone. However OBEDIENCE to doing exactly what it says to do is FAITH. To sum it up, you cannot claim you have " FAITH" and leave out this or that because you don' t think it is needed or necessary when scripture says it is..

Obedience "to exactly what it says to do" is not faith, just as the law is not of faith. Obedience to what one believes in their heart, is obedience from the heart and is a living faith.

All these attempts at legalism are making void the faith of many, and it always produces sinful desires and passions in these groups that promote legalism.

 

[Mitspa]

And...No where in the Book of Acts or any other Book in your Bible will you read where anyone was Water Baptized in this manner: " I Now Baptize you In The Name of The Father, and in the Name of the Son, and in the Name of The Holy Ghost".

Unless You find this in your Bible then we can all agree...It Never was actually ever done in the NT First Century Church.

So Please unless you find any verse that shows IT ACTUALLY WAS EVER PERFORMED... Don' t even say anything contradicting this fact..

Well, baptism is not a magic show, with the correct magic words needed to be said in a certain order. God will accept a baptism when we call upon His name, whether we say Father, Son and Holy Spirit or just say Jesus. In fact the greatest Pentecost preacher of our day Smith Wigglesworth did not believe that baptizing in the name of Jesus had any thing to do with water baptism but was speaking of the Holy Spirit baptism, I believe a careful reading of the scriptures prove him correct. But I would not debate the issue, for it is of little importance, in the big picture.

 

[Mitspa]

We can come up with a thousand ways somebody " Accepts Jesus" and false teachers say they are " Saved". If that was true, then I could walk in a bar and nightclub and ask the Patrons: " Do you believe Jesus died for your sins, and you are saved by acknowledging that"?...and the inebriated patron says " (hic) yes, I believe that"...then I say " Well, Brother you are now saved"...Hog wash..

How do you know what others believe and who God can and cannot save? If you will remember the Lord Himself went to those in these sort of places and save them. But those He hated and those who could not be saved, where the self-righteous and hypocrites.
I had rather be the harlot as His feet, or the woman caught in adultery than those who "think" they have the right to judge others in who can be saved.

Mt 23:12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.
13 ¶ But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.
14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.
15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.

Mt 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.
25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.
26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness

 

[Mitspa]

One last thing ABDICATE....Being Water Baptized is a requirement along with FAITH, Repentance, and believing in Jesus and his word...It takes ALL of them to be Saved...I Timothy 4 v 16 Paul tells us to OBEY THE DOCTRINE.

What is this "sound doctrine" that the legalist love to claim they have? Lets see...

2Ti 1:9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
10 But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:
11 Whereunto I am appointed a preacher, and an apostle, and a teacher of the Gentiles.
12 For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.
13 Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me, in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.

not this:

1Ti 1:6 From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;
7 Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.

 

[lynn w]

What is this "sound doctrine" that the legalist love to claim they have? Lets see...

b>Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
10 But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:
11 Whereunto I am appointed a preacher, and an apostle, and a teacher of the Gentiles.
12 For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.
13 Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me, in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.

not this:

rom which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;
7 Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.

I would just appreciate some clarification. Why is being baptized considered legalistic? I believe baptism is beautiful and an act of obedience, not a work. I believe repentance is necessary along with faith in what Jesus did on the cross. Why not be baptized? Certainly not to prove we are under grace. If someone repents and had faith in the work on the cross but dies before baptism I believe they are still saved. Baptism is part of the new testament. I must've missed where the division here occurred. Just seeking to clarify.
God bless

 

[Abdicate]

I would just appreciate some clarification. Why is being baptized considered legalistic? I believe baptism is beautiful and an act of obedience, not a work. I believe repentance is necessary along with faith in what Jesus did on the cross. Why not be baptized? Certainly not to prove we are under grace. If someone repents and had faith in the work on the cross but dies before baptism I believe they are still saved. Baptism is part of the new testament. I must've missed where the division here occurred. Just seeking to clarify.
God bless

There is nothing wrong with baptism. It's part of our walk with Christ. A public show of our death, burial and resurrection with Christ. My problem is with those that state it is required in order to be saved.

 

[Ricko1]

What? It seems every time I discuss the scriptures with those who "claim" to keep the ten commandments, they cannot seem to be honest? Wonder why? The strength of sin is the law... The more legalistic these people are, the less honest they are able to be. I never suggested salvation in any way apart from His Grace (read my last post) That is bearing false witness!

Ephesians 2 v 8 Apostle Paul wrote this:

" For BY GRACE are you saved THROUGH FAITH, and that not of yourselves: It is a gift of God not of WORKS Lest any man should boast"

I believe what Paul said. I believe every single word Paul wrote.

What is Faith? means we believe in Jesus Christ. And doing this we also must believe in his Word, and the words of his Apostles like Paul.

One cannot just claim to HAVE FAITH then reject the Doctrine laid forth by.The same
Apostles. They all laid out and taught The Doctrine taught to them to write down and teach others then and now.

The Doctrine starts in what Peter said for converts to do in Acts 2 v 38.

Here is what Apostle Paul also stated:

I Timothy 4 v 16: "Take heed unto thyself, and UNTO THE DOCTRINE, continue in them: for in doing this thou SHALT SAVE THYSELF and THEM THAT HEAR THEE.

verse 13

" Till I come, give attendance to READING, TO EXHORTATION, TO DOCTRINE.

read also these: I Timothy 1 v 3
I Timothy 5 v 17

I Timothy 6 v 1

I Timothy 6 v 3

In other words all the words of the Apostles must be considered and Obeyed before someone can claim this is "their Doctrine" and leave out things they do not personally agree with..

 

[Ricko1]

There is nothing wrong with baptism. It's part of our walk with Christ. A public show of our death, burial and resurrection with Christ. My problem is with those that state it is required in order to be saved.

There is nothing wrong with baptism. It's part of our walk with Christ. A public show of our death, burial and resurrection with Christ. My problem is with those that state it is required in order to be saved.

So then I guess you have a " Problem" believing Jesus when he stated this: " Verily, Verily, I say unto thee; EXCEPT a man be born of WATER and of the SPIRIT he CANNOT SEE THE KINGDOM OF GOD"

So you claim to " BELEIVE"...yet argue with what Jesus commanded us all to do?




Mark 16 v.16: He that BELIEVES AND IS BAPTIZED SHALL BE SAVED..

The Same Jesus who told Nicodemus in John 3 v 5 " EXCEPT

 

[Abdicate]

I hope you enjoyed church. It's not improved your understanding of the scriptures. I shall not debate it with you.

 

[Ricko1]

I hope you enjoyed church. It's not improved your understanding of the scriptures. I shall not debate it with you.

Opinions are like noses...everybody has one bro. You don' t want to learn I can accept that. The world is full of Religious People claiming to be this and that and haven' t a clue what it takes to be saved..

 

[Ricko1]

Opinions are like noses...everybody has one bro. You don' t want to learn I can accept that. The world is full of Religious People claiming to be this and that and haven' t a clue what it takes to be saved..

There is nothing to debate or argue about of what I am saying. You either believe ALL of The Word or you don' t believe ALL of what the Bible says on the subject we are discussing. I have never found any errors or loopholes in the Gospel or Doctrine taught..ZERO.

 

[Abdicate]

Dissembler! You say I'm not following the scriptures when you cut off the very end of the real meaning of Mark 16! Here's the entire verse for those who wish to know the truth:

Mark 16:16 (KJV) He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

 

[Ricko1]

Dissembler! You say I'm not following the scriptures when you cut off the very end of the real meaning of Mark 16! Here's the entire verse for those who wish to know the truth:

Mark 16:16 (KJV) He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

IN Other words if You Don' t BELIEVE and ARE Not Baptized they shall be DAMNED..In other Un Believers rejecting God' s Word. What is so hard understanding that? You really need to refrain from the name calling it is Un Christian like and Not true about me either.

 

[Ricko1]

If some do not want to accept what is clearly written, and I am just showing it, so be it. I will not throw a fit, and start name calling. I have doing what I do for over 26 years. I have heard every excuse and people trying to show what I say is not true...But the Scriptures prove otherwise. The only way to do what I have shown by scripture, is JUST DO IT and don' t resort to ungodly name calling or labeling the messenger a fraud, or other choice of words it is not Godly or Christian like...just bow out simple...Thanks Everyone!

 

[Ricko1]

Someone want to change the subject? I am good with that..talk on something else?

 

[Mitspa]

I would just appreciate some clarification. Why is being baptized considered legalistic? I believe baptism is beautiful and an act of obedience, not a work. I believe repentance is necessary along with faith in what Jesus did on the cross. Why not be baptized? Certainly not to prove we are under grace. If someone repents and had faith in the work on the cross but dies before baptism I believe they are still saved. Baptism is part of the new testament. I must've missed where the division here occurred. Just seeking to clarify.
God bless

It should not be.. but it has been made that by certain groups who "demand" baptism as a work according to the law of works. Baptism is a "work of faith" according to the law of faith. When a group brings it out of faith and suggest that it is a part of system of works, needed for salvation, they have missed the type and picture of baptism. For we had to die with Christ because we could not, through any religious process earn salvation.... completely and without hope is man and his efforts to "earn" salvation.

 

[Mitspa]

Ephesians 2 v 8 Apostle Paul wrote this:

" For BY GRACE are you saved THROUGH FAITH, and that not of yourselves: It is a gift of God not of WORKS Lest any man should boast"

I believe what Paul said. I believe every single word Paul wrote.

What is Faith? means we believe in Jesus Christ. And doing this we also must believe in his Word, and the words of his Apostles like Paul.

One cannot just claim to HAVE FAITH then reject the Doctrine laid forth by.The same
Apostles. They all laid out and taught The Doctrine taught to them to write down and teach others then and now.

The Doctrine starts in what Peter said for converts to do in Acts 2 v 38.

Here is what Apostle Paul also stated:

I Timothy 4 v 16: "Take heed unto thyself, and UNTO THE DOCTRINE, continue in them: for in doing this thou SHALT SAVE THYSELF and THEM THAT HEAR THEE.

verse 13

" Till I come, give attendance to READING, TO EXHORTATION, TO DOCTRINE.

read also these: I Timothy 1 v 3
I Timothy 5 v 17

I Timothy 6 v 1

I Timothy 6 v 3

In other words all the words of the Apostles must be considered and Obeyed before someone can claim this is "their Doctrine" and leave out things they do not personally agree with..

No one has suggested that baptism is not obedience, but it is obedience to faith. It is the answer of (from a good conscience) Just as Paul said God did not call him to baptize, but to preach the gospel...it is the gospel that saves and baptism serves the truth of the gospel.