What is the "Mystery"?

Complete said:
Which mystery are you referring to, Big Moose?

In Christ Jesus
Chris


* Reference made to 'The Alphabetical Analysis' (vol.3) by Charles Welch.
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The mystery, which from the beginning of the ages has been hidden in God. The mystery of Christ and all that entails: Grace over the law, the church as the body, the Holy Spirit in us as the result of belief in the Son, His sacrifice providing redemption, and on and on.
Romans 16:25
Ephesians 3:3,4,9,
Ephesians 6:19
Colossians 1:26, 27; 2:2; 4:3
 
Big Moose said:
The mystery, which from the beginning of the ages has been hidden in God. The mystery of Christ and all that entails: Grace over the law, the church as the body, the Holy Spirit in us as the result of belief in the Son, His sacrifice providing redemption, and on and on.
Romans 16:25
Ephesians 3:3,4,9,
Ephesians 6:19
Colossians 1:26, 27; 2:2; 4:3
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Thank you, Big Moose,
You do not differentiate between the different mysteries that have been listed previously, or take into consideration such words as, '... hid in God', or, ' ... hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints', do you? :)

I think it is important to note the indications of when a revelation concerning a particular 'mystery' (or secret) takes place, so that we do not place them where they aught not to be, and thereby mix them up, destroying their meaning, and lessening their impact.

'The Mystery' of Ephesians 3, is so vital for the Church of this dispensation, and was not revealed until after the epistle to the Romans was written. So it cannot be the subject of it.

The central portion of Romans, 5:12-8:39, contains the truth of the mystery to which Romans 16 refers, which takes man back to Adam, (beyond Abraham, beyond the creation of Israel, beyond the law) and identifies him with the first man, Adam, in order to be able to also, by faith, identify Him with Christ, as the second Adam. This was a necessary action as a prelude to the introduction of the truth of the Mystery of Ephesians, which concerns those 'in Christ', following the failure of Israel to repent and acknowledge Christ Jesus as their Messiah, their Lord and Saviour.

Within the love of Christ
Our risen and glorified
Saviour, Lord and Head.

Chris


 
Complete said:
Thank you, Big Moose,
You do not differentiate between the different mysteries that have been listed previously, or take into consideration such words as, '... hid in God', or, ' ... hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints', do you? :)

I think it is important to note the indications of when a revelation concerning a particular 'mystery' (or secret) takes place, so that we do not place them where they aught not to be, and thereby mix them up, destroying their meaning, and lessening their impact.

'The Mystery' of Ephesians 3, is so vital for the Church of this dispensation, and was not revealed until after the epistle to the Romans was written. So it cannot be the subject of it.

The central portion of Romans, 5:12-8:39, contains the truth of the mystery to which Romans 16 refers, which takes man back to Adam, (beyond Abraham, beyond the creation of Israel, beyond the law) and identifies him with the first man, Adam, in order to be able to also, by faith, identify Him with Christ, as the second Adam. This was a necessary action as a prelude to the introduction of the truth of the Mystery of Ephesians, which concerns those 'in Christ', following the failure of Israel to repent and acknowledge Christ Jesus as their Messiah, their Lord and Saviour.

Within the love of Christ
Our risen and glorified
Saviour, Lord and Head.

Chris

Click to expand...
I am pretty sure that Romans deals with those same issues:"....Mystery of Ephesians, which concerns those 'in Christ', following the failure of Israel to repent and acknowledge Christ Jesus as their Messiah, their Lord and Saviour."
Those in Christ =Romans 8, part of 11, 12, 13
Failure of Israel to repent and acknowledge Christ=Romans 9,10, some of 11
Chapter 3 is about the bringing together of Jews and Gentiles into one body, just as Ephesians has the same concept.

So like I said, Romans seems to be the elucidation of the mystery which is also in Eph and Colossians.
Romans 16:25=according to the revelation of the mystery kept secret since the world began
Ephesians 3:3- He made known to me the mystery (as I have briefly written already,4 by which, when you read, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ),5 which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets:
9=and to make all see what is the 2 fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the ages has been hidden in God
Ephesians 6:19=and for me, that utterance may be given to me, z that I may open my mouth boldly to make known the mystery of the gospel,
Colossians 1:26= the 8 mystery which has been hidden from ages and from generations, f but now has been revealed to His saints.27g To them God willed to make known what are h the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles
2:2=that their hearts may be encouraged, being knit together in love, and attaining to all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the knowledge of the mystery of God, 2 both of the Father and of Christ,3b in whom are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge
4:3=meanwhile praying also for us, that God would open to us a door for the word, to speak the mystery of Christ,

The mystery which was : kept secret, not made known, hidden in God, hidden from ages and from generations, hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge. Whether it is the mystery of God, or Christ, or the Gospel, it refers to the same mystery. The mystery was hidden in God, so it is the mystery of God, God's mystery. It is also the mystery of Christ, the mystery is about Christ and the revealing of Him as Savior. And the mystery of the Gospel is the same thing, the Gospel being the encapsulation of who Christ is and His purpose for us all.
God hid this mystery about Christ and reveals it thru the Gospel.

2 Peter 1:16 For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.

Peter says here they had to make Him known. Why? Because of the Mystery.
 
More on the revealing of the mystery:
1 Peter 1:10 Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace that would come to you, 11 searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow. 12 To them it was revealed that, not to themselves, but to us they were ministering the things which now have been reported to you through those who have preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven—things which angels desire to look into.
 
Hello Big Moose,

I see that we do not consider the mysteries in the same light. I believe that each name given, each description must be taken note of, and given it's proper place. The mystery of Christ was not hidden, it was made known to all the apostles and prophets of the new testament, and manifests what was written in the prophets of the old by the finished work of Christ. That is the subject of the epistles written before the revelation of 'the Mystery' of Ephesians three. That mystery reveals the administration of the new dispensation necessitated by the failure of Israel to acknowledge their Messiah and repent, that is not made known prior to the writing of Ephesians.

If words mean anything at all, then we have to acknowledge this, that when God the Holy Spirit says that something was hidden then it was, and to superimpose what was reveled in Ephesians Philippians and Colossians onto the earlier epistles, of Romans, Corinthians etc., only buries the truth relating to the new administration under what existed under the one that had passed.

To put them all together, when the Holy Spirit separates them only hides the glory of what is being revealed.

I will leave it there.
With love to you in Christ Jesus
Chris
 
Complete said:
Hello Big Moose,

I see that we do not consider the mysteries in the same light. I believe that each name given, each description must be taken note of, and given it's proper place. The mystery of Christ was not hidden, it was made known to all the apostles and prophets of the new testament, and manifests what was written in the prophets of the old by the finished work of Christ. That is the subject of the epistles written before the revelation of 'the Mystery' of Ephesians three. That mystery reveals the administration of the new dispensation necessitated by the failure of Israel to acknowledge their Messiah and repent, that is not made known prior to the writing of Ephesians.

If words mean anything at all, then we have to acknowledge this, that when God the Holy Spirit says that something was hidden then it was, and to superimpose what was reveled in Ephesians Philippians and Colossians onto the earlier epistles, of Romans, Corinthians etc., only buries the truth relating to the new administration under what existed under the one that had passed.

To put them all together, when the Holy Spirit separates them only hides the glory of what is being revealed.

I will leave it there.
With love to you in Christ Jesus
Chris
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Chris Complete,
Thank you for such gracious posts. I always look forward to your responses, even if you are responding to disagree. The love of Christ still shines thru your words, and I appreciate that. May God shower blessings upon you in your walk.
 
Penion said:
Moose,

I think you have done an excellent job in this thread explaining the mystery hidden in God!
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Thank you so much! This was more of a journey for me. I learn so much from bouncing ideas off of other people and having their ideas bounce off of me, too! This causes me to study more, as I stumble upon knowledge on other subjects as well.
May God bless you, brother Penion
 
Big Moose said:
Chris Complete,
Thank you for such gracious posts. I always look forward to your responses, even if you are responding to disagree. The love of Christ still shines thru your words, and I appreciate that. May God shower blessings upon you in your walk.
Click to expand...

The feeling is mutual, Big Moose.
Praise God!

:)
 
The 'Mystery' was so mysterious, to be redundant, that the disciples following along with Jesus had little to no idea what was going to happen even when Jesus was explaining it directly to them. He told them "on the third day", and what were they doing on the third day? Hiding or cowering or both. You would have thought they would have been there nearby waiting to see what would happen.
Luke 9:45
Luke 18:33-34
 
I fear that going by some of the comments on here ,the mystery of Ephesians that God will make the Jew and the Gentile one new man is still a mystery .
The gentiles or indeed the church cannot boast over the Jews for as Paul laid out in Romans their unbelief led to the salvation of the gentile. if the salvation of the gentile was so glorious what then the salvation of the Jews ?but a raising of the dead!
But if we beign the wild branch was grafted into the true through our belief and the 'natural' branch was cut off through unbelief .Then how is it noty considered that the wild, branch will not be cut off through thier unbelief?
For now the gentiles are rejecting God the father, the Son and the Holy Spirit even as the vast majority of the Jews did .
The church then is to do what? So manifest the love and mercy of God they are to extend to the Jews what they have received and to teach them what they themselves have ben taught and to "provoke them to jealousy" By our lives and ministrations of the truth.
if then by we received the gospel by their unbelief will not God by the gentiles unbelief not give it to the Jews who will then finally receive it.
Any Jew or gentile who is saved now are then made one . In Spirit ,faith and finally in understanding.
There is then no scripture then that i can see; no messianic Jew . For IN Christ there is no Jew or gentile.
What then are we ? if not Jew or gentile? But a new creation .

in Christ
gerald
 
Major said:
Mee too! Moose is THE man!
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Thank you so much for that! I really had no intention of doing that when I started the thread. I can only praise Jesus for laying this on my mind and giving me direction. All I did was read and punch the keys on the keyboard.
I can only pray that He would let inspiration flow thru me more and more. Incredible feeling, really.
All honor and glory to our Father and the Son! Amen
 
Interestingly enough; our guest Pastor tonight talked about the 'mystery' in

Ephesians 3:
1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,
2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:
3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.
8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;
9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,
11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
12 In whom we have boldness and access with confidence by the faith of him.

The 'mystery' is simply a revelation to the Church that was not known or understood before Christ's appearance. But is now revealed in the Church through the teachings of the completed Word of God. Possibly the completion of the Gospel prophecy started in Genesis 3:15 , the first prophecy of Christ (Even Adam & Eve got the prophecy!).
 
Brother_Mike_V said:
Interestingly enough; our guest Pastor tonight talked about the 'mystery' in

Ephesians 3:
1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,
2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:
3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.
8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;
9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,
11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
12 In whom we have boldness and access with confidence by the faith of him.

The 'mystery' is simply a revelation to the Church that was not known or understood before Christ's appearance. But is now revealed in the Church through the teachings of the completed Word of God. Possibly the completion of the Gospel prophecy started in Genesis 3:15 , the first prophecy of Christ (Even Adam & Eve got the prophecy!).
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It is simply the Spirit of God speaking to the church. And any church with its ears open will hear the same message.

In Christian
Gerald
 
@geralduk, @Fish Catcher Jim, @Brother Mike V,
@Big Moose, @Major, @Penion, @Euphemia
@Noblemen, @Fish of Faith, @Brother Paul
@Abdicate, @Ravindran, @JohnC, @Roads, @KingJ

Hello again,

I was writing to a friend, concerning the content of Acts 3, especially verse 21 concerning 'the restitution of all things', 'the times of refreshing' (Acts 3:19), and the restoration of the kingdom to Israel (Acts 1:4-6) , which were all the subject of O.T. prophecy: and of the healing (or, 'salvation) of Israel as a nation, which the healing of the lame man, heading up chapter 3, typifies; concluding with the fact that the whole period of the Acts of the Apostles (approx. 40yrs), was a period in which Israel was given opportunity to repent. Warning was given in Acts 13:40,41 (see. Hab.1:5); but in the final chapter of the book of the Acts of the Apostles, the judgment fell, with *the repetition of Isaiah 6:9,10, in Acts 28:25-28. ...

* I was reminded of the subject of this thread, and thought you may appreciate my thoughts here.

... Nothing had been revealed prior to this *crises point for Israel in Acts 28: Either in gospels, the epistles written during that time, nor in the O.T. concerning what would happen should Israel fail to repent. This was the subject of **the mystery revealed to Paul alone (Eph.3), and made known in the epistles written following Israel's failure (Eph. Col. Phil. 1&2 Timothy, Titus and Philemon).

Israel (the Olive Tree), the new covenant blessings and the millennial hope is all now still in abeyance, until Israel see Him Whom they pierced, and repent. Only then will they take up their divinely appointed place as 'Priests unto God', and minister to the nations.

The Church which is His Body, 'The One New Man' of Ephesians, is God's answer to Israel's failure. It's blessings are ALL spiritual blessings, and not the blessings of Abraham. It is brought together as one Body, independent of Israel, and, in Christ, has a hope and sphere of blessing (in heavenly places) which is distinctly different from all that has gone before. It is not under the new covenant, that being in abeyance still, awaiting Israel's repentance.

It has no need of ordinances, all is in spirit and of the Spirit, in Christ. We are sealed upon believing, by the Holy Spirit, and identified with Christ in His death, burial, quickening, resurrection and ascension to God's right hand, and now await His appearing, when we too shall 'appear' with Him in glory, our resurrection life being hid in Christ, in God.

No water baptism or any other symbolic rite is required of the members of the Church of the One Body, all is of the Spirit, the flesh counts for nothing.

Praise God!

* If you have persevered and read this through I thank you.
In Christ Jesus
Chris

* Isaiah 6:9,10: was quoted three times in all, the number of divine completion and perfection.
Twice it was quoted by the Lord Jesus Christ, at times of crisis, (Matt.13:14,15; John 12:40), marking Acts 28:25-28 also, a time of crisis.
** Not the mystery of Christ, for that was the subject of OT prophecy, not hidden in God (Col. 3:3) as the revelation of the fellowship (or dispensation) of the mystery, was.
 
Last edited:
Complete said:
@geralduk, @Fish Catcher Jim, @Brother Mike V,
@Big Moose, @Major, @Penion, @Euphemia
@Noblemen, @Fish of Faith, @Brother Paul
@Abdicate, @Ravindran, @JohnC, @Roads, @KingJ

Hello again,

I was writing to a friend, concerning the content of Acts 3, especially verse 21 concerning 'the restitution of all things', 'the times of refreshing' (Acts 3:19), and the restoration of the kingdom to Israel (Acts 1:4-6) , which were all the subject of O.T. prophecy: and of the healing (or, 'salvation) of Israel as a nation, which the healing of the lame man, heading up chapter 3, typifies; concluding with the fact that the whole period of the Acts of the Apostles (approx. 40yrs), was a period in which Israel was given opportunity to repent. Warning was given in Acts 13:40,41 (see. Hab.1:5); but in the final chapter of the book of the Acts of the Apostles, the judgment fell, with *the repetition of Isaiah 6:9,10, in Acts 28:25-28. ...

* I was reminded of the subject of this thread, and thought you may appreciate my thoughts here.

... Nothing had been revealed prior to this *crises point for Israel in Acts 28: Either in gospels, the epistles written during that time, nor in the O.T. concerning what would happen should Israel fail to repent. This was the subject of **the mystery revealed to Paul alone (Eph.3), and made known in the epistles written following Israel's failure (Eph. Col. Phil. 1&2 Timothy, Titus and Philemon).

Israel (the Olive Tree), the new covenant blessings and the millennial hope is all now still in abeyance, until Israel see Him Whom they pierced, and repent. Only then will they take up their divinely appointed place as 'Priests unto God', and minister to the nations.

The Church which is His Body, 'The One New Man' of Ephesians, is God's answer to Israel's failure. It's blessings are ALL spiritual blessings, and not the blessings of Abraham. It is brought together as one Body, independent of Israel, and, in Christ, has a hope and sphere of blessing (in heavenly places) which is distinctly different from all that has gone before. It is not under the new covenant, that being in abeyance still, awaiting Israel's repentance.

It has no need of ordinances, all is in spirit and of the Spirit, in Christ. We are sealed upon believing, by the Holy Spirit, and identified with Christ in His death, burial, quickening, resurrection and ascension to God's right hand, and now await His appearing, when we too shall 'appear' with Him in glory, our resurrection life being hid in Christ, in God.

No water baptism or any other symbolic rite is required of the members of the Church of the One Body, all is of the Spirit, the flesh counts for nothing.

Praise God!

* If you have persevered and read this through I thank you.
In Christ Jesus
Chris

* Isaiah 6:9,10: was quoted three times in all, the number of divine completion and perfection.
Twice it was quoted by the Lord Jesus Christ, at times of crisis, (Matt.13:14,15; John 12:40), marking Acts 28:25-28 also, a time of crisis.
** Not the mystery of Christ, for that was the subject of OT prophecy, not hidden in God (Col. 3:3) as the revelation of the fellowship (or dispensation) of the mystery, was.
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Excellent exhortation Chris. You are confirming that Israel is Israel and the Church is the church. I agree and have been teaching that for a long, long time.

Some people also use Acts 3:21 to support their wishing that eventually everything and every one will be saved.
The phrase they use is ........"The restitution of all things".

In Philippians 3:8 we see that Paul said............
"..........I count all things but loss.....".

Did he mean ALL things in God's universe??? Obviously not. So here in Acts the "all things" are limited by what follows.
"The times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all His holy prophets since the world began".

The prophets had spoken of the restoration of Israel!
 
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