What Isn't a Doctrine of Man?

Major said:
That would be a little difficult to do.

The doctrine of progressive revelation is wrong because it gives Church leaders an opportunity to change things in the Scriptures that are unfavorable(prohibition on eating pork/shellfish, keeping Torah, punishment for wrongdoing, etc ) and gives new meanings to them, and then cite that God gave us “progression revelation”......or, "God told ME"!

Then, many pastors will try to explain “you heard it said but I say..” and other passages and teachings of Jesus Christ by saying “Oh, he didn’t really mean it that way, he really meant this instead”.

An example would be........."Oral Roberts’ preposterous death-threat prophecy. In 1987 Roberts told his nationwide audience that God SPOKE TO HIM and had threatened to “kill him" if he couldn’t raise eight million dollars by his creditors’ deadline. Whether and how that threat might have been carried out, the world will never know; Roberts received a last-minute reprieve in the form of a large check from a Florida dog-track owner.

If we READ the Scriptures and understand them then we can realize that God gave 12 men, the Apostles the ability to write the New Test. He have prophets in the Old Test. His words to write His laws and history.

There are NO Apostles or prophets today so anytime you hear........"God told ME" or "Jesus really meant to say"......they are to be considered charlatans and liars!

Scripture is a closed system of truth, complete, sufficient, and not to be added to (Revelation 22:18–19). It contains all the spiritual truth God intended to reveal.
Click to expand...
This is perfect... THANK YOU....
 
Major said:
You said.........
"there is a promise of salvation IF one follows the traditions. "

Now that needs an explination.
Click to expand...
The Catholic church for example promises salvation if one partakes in the SACRAMENTS.
It also declares HELL if one walks away from the church or DIES in a state of mortal sin ( which is judged by NOT having experienced the sacraments )... and NONE of that has ANYTHING to do with the BIBLE.... It's all man man STUFF in order to inflict FEAR... GUILT and CONTROL.
 
In Awe of Him said:
Is this called Cessationist?
Click to expand...
NO.

Cessationism is the view that the “miracle gifts” of tongues and healing and prophecy have ceased—that the end of the apostolic age brought about a cessation of the miracles associated with that age. Most cessationists believe that, while God can and still does perform miracles today, the Holy Spirit no longer uses individuals to perform miraculous signs.

That is based on 1 Corth. 13:8-9......
"Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away. 9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. 10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away."

The "Perfect one" in verse 10 is a Greek term meaning .....Thing. Cessationist's believe that to be the Bible.
 
In Awe of Him said:
The Catholic church for example promises salvation if one partakes in the SACRAMENTS.
It also declares HELL if one walks away from the church or DIES in a state of mortal sin ( which is judged by NOT having experienced the sacraments )... and NONE of that has ANYTHING to do with the BIBLE.... It's all man man STUFF in order to inflict FEAR... GUILT and CONTROL.
Click to expand...
Correct which is why some have called it a "cult". It is certainly NOT Biblical Christianity.
 
crossnote said:
Especially not, as long as there is what's called 'progressive interpretations'.
Click to expand...
In Awe of Him said:
@Major ... Can you point me in the right direction as to where I would find what is implied by "progressive interpretations"?
I don't expect anyone to do the studying for me.... HA. I am curious as to what this phrase is referring to in the form of examples.
Click to expand...
Major said:
That would be a little difficult to do.
Click to expand...
Since I am guilty of coining the term, let me give it a whirl.
What I meant by it was interpretations of God's Word which are devoid of God's Spirit.

1 Corinthians 2:10,12-14 ESV
these things God has revealed to us through the Spirit. For the Spirit searches everything, even the depths of God. [12] Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might understand the things freely given us by God. [13] And we impart this in words not taught by human wisdom but taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual truths to those who are spiritual. [14] The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned.
 
crossnote said:
1 Corinthians 2:10,12-14 ESV
these things God has revealed to us through the Spirit. For the Spirit searches everything, even the depths of God. [12] Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might understand the things freely given us by God. [13] And we impart this in words not taught by human wisdom but taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual truths to those who are spiritual. [14] The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned.
Click to expand...
That is pretty scary scripture BECAUSE everyone and their dog can claim to be filled with the Spirit and taught by the spirit.
 
crossnote said:
Since I am guilty of coining the term, let me give it a whirl.
What I meant by it was interpretations of God's Word which are devoid of God's Spirit.

1 Corinthians 2:10,12-14 ESV
these things God has revealed to us through the Spirit. For the Spirit searches everything, even the depths of God. [12] Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might understand the things freely given us by God. [13] And we impart this in words not taught by human wisdom but taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual truths to those who are spiritual. [14] The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned.
Click to expand...
Yep. I agree 100%! But then I uselly do!
 
In Awe of Him said:
That is pretty scary scripture BECAUSE everyone and their dog can claim to be filled with the Spirit and taught by the spirit.
Click to expand...
And right there is "the" problem we have in Christianity today!

Matthew 7:21-23 .......
“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’
 
Major said:
And right there is "the" problem we have in Christianity today!
Click to expand...
Yes it is THE problem and it causes so much damage.
and the Catholic teachings are only the FIRST of many... I think the WoF movement basically started with Kenneth Hagin... and then Kenneth Copeland took over... now anything that is on "Christian" television is THAT stuff.
It's a real stew of MESS... but what gets me is the people that flock to bad theology.... WHY IS THAT? That is the part that bothers me is that people like my aunt.... she is not only legalistic... but she also is WoF... so it's just so sad... and she has not had a victorious or joyful Christian life... but still she believes as she does. It's heart breaking is what it is.
 
Musicmaster said:
If you say, "Yeah, but they ALL believe that they are following the right Jesus," then you would be correct; disregarding those that have no desire to lay claim to similarity to Christ Jesus.
Click to expand...
I agree that no one knowingly believes something that is incorrect. That would be insanity.

Let us assume sincerity on the part of the believer and at least some minimal level of rational justification for their belief. This said, how can you know you are not falling into the same trap as they? In other words, what makes your evidence superior to theirs?
 
Major said:
Now.....What would YOU call a group of people who follow the "traditions" of men over the Word of God???
Click to expand...
You act as if people knowingly follow traditions of men. They don't. Each believes they are following the teachings of God. Each believes they are correct and you are wrong. How do you know you aren't both right, or aren't both wrong?
 
LearningToLetGo said:
I agree that no one knowingly believes something that is incorrect. That would be insanity.

Let us assume sincerity on the part of the believer and at least some minimal level of rational justification for their belief. This said, how can you know you are not falling into the same trap as they? In other words, what makes your evidence superior to theirs?
Click to expand...

Excellent question.

2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

My experience with those of what many will call "other Christian faiths," is that they inevitably point to other things as proofs for their beliefs, such as traditions, historic teachings, creeds, statements of faith...et al, as if those things add to the scriptures what is not explicitly taught in the very word of God. ALL of them.

Are there some who don't appeal to extrabiblical sources for their beliefs? Yes, but they are easily seen for their departures from historic and proper hermeneutics and lingual conventions that are known within the constellation of manuscripts and the evidence behind them. The majority of those follow a man or a woman who started their schism, and point to books written by those individuals, etc.

So, where it's true that many just absolutely love pointing out the variety of flavors in doctrinal content among the plethora of religious groupings who lay claim to historicity, as if antiquity ever made anything true, they ultimately betray their true sourcing for the foundations for their beliefs are people and/or things that are external to the inspired writings we call the Bible. Leaning upon all those posts out there that are external to the Bible is akin to the belief that the cannon is not closed. That crowd of people are not so hard to figure out their maladies.

MM
 
Musicmaster said:
My experience with those of what many will call "other Christian faiths," is that they inevitably point to other things as proofs for their beliefs, such as traditions, historic teachings, creeds, statements of faith...et al, as if those things add to the scriptures what is not explicitly taught in the very word of God.
Click to expand...
Good observation.
Musicmaster said:
The majority of those follow a man or a woman who started their schism, and point to books written by those individuals, etc.
Click to expand...
Another good observation.

Where would one find a clean church then, clean as in sola-scriptura without extraneous statements of faith, creeds, or other add-on teachings?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top