Will God and Jesus ever stop loving me? Can someone lose their salvation while on earth?

KingJ said:
a & b. Thats not the point though. A guy who thinks of a woman lustfully can also come to his senses before he actually does the deed.
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Looking at a woman lustfully IS a deed...

Not every bad thought that enters your mind is a sin. The flesh is constantly warring against the Spirit. This is a reality of our Christian walk. We need to reject the impulses of the flesh, kill it's deeds, and bring our body and thoughts into subjection to the obedience of Christ. Yet the thoughts will come. It's what we do with those thoughts that can kill us.

We can either bring our thoughts into submission or we can put ourselves into submission/bondage to them.
 
KingJ said:
a & b. You not making sense. You said Eve entertained it. What do you think the guy in Matt 5:28 does? A guy who thinks of a woman lustfully can also come to his senses before he actually does the deed.
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The point is that instead of casting out the original thought that comes naturally ("Oh, what a lovely looking woman!") to mulling it over and continuing with the eyes ("Hmmm...I wonder..."), one steps over into the realm of sin---according to Jesus Himself.
 
Euphemia said:
The point is that instead of casting out the original thought that comes naturally ("Oh, what a lovely looking woman!") to mulling it over and continuing with the eyes ("Hmmm...I wonder..."), one steps over into the realm of sin---according to Jesus Himself.
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Exactly. And even when one steps into the realm of sin with their eyes, they don't have to remain there. The Holy Spirit will convict them, and then their part is to turn from it and confess it to God. If they do not turn from it, it will cause seperation and bondage.

When Eve lusted after the fruit, she could have at any time come to her senses and run away. In that case, I do not think she would have died.

This is not to say we should entertain wicked thoughts and think it's Ok if we don't do the deed or to premeditatively entertain it and toy with it. That would indeed be sinful
 
Euphemia said:
The point is that instead of casting out the original thought that comes naturally ("Oh, what a lovely looking woman!") to mulling it over and continuing with the eyes ("Hmmm...I wonder..."), one steps over into the realm of sin---according to Jesus Himself.
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You liked Glads post but I am wondering if you actually read it. She said ''a. Yes, Eve did entertain it. But at any time before she ate the fruit, she could have come to her senses and fled, and would not have died if she did.''
 
KingJ said:
You liked Glads post but I am wondering if you actually read it. She said ''a. Yes, Eve did entertain it. But at any time before she ate the fruit, she could have come to her senses and fled, and would not have died if she did.''
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Yes, because what did God say? You shall not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for the day you eat of it you will surely die. He didnt say anything about being tempted to eat it.

This kind of debate is probably going to end up fruitless. We can agree that if someone deliberately plays around with temptation, then they are sinning. If they are caught in temptation, and fighting it resisting, they have not sinned. That pretty much covers everything.
 
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KingJ said:
You liked Glads post but I am wondering if you actually read it. She said ''a. Yes, Eve did entertain it. But at any time before she ate the fruit, she could have come to her senses and fled, and would not have died if she did.''
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What's wrong with it?

I have good reading skills.
 
You two are distinguishing between thought and deed, then just thought and thought....as though its the same thing.

The point is that these actions committed by Adam and Eve.... even the hearts intent / action perhaps of the devil.... all started in the mind. When they started in the mind they did not result in immediate death.

Please both of you go and read Matt 5:32 with Matt 5:28. Matt 5:28 is sin. But it is not a sin that results in divorce. Matt 5:32 says actual adultery is. Relating thoughts here to thoughts with Adam, Eve and the devil line up perfectly if we consider them to be venial sins that do not lead to death. But that then the ultimate deed, eating the fruit, actual literal fornication and in the devils case an extreme thought / deed perhaps of wanting a seat higher then God = death.

IE, we have not and never will have ''perfect'' spirits. We are eternally sealed by Jesus.
 
Temptation always involves lust or desire. If we didnt desire it, it wouldnt be a temptation. But God always provides a way of escape from the temptation so that we may not sin.

Can we all agree at least on this?
 
KingJ said:
You two are distinguishing between thought and deed, then just thought and thought....as though its the same thing.

The point is that these actions committed by Adam and Eve.... even the hearts intent / action perhaps of the devil.... all started in the mind. When they started in the mind they did not result in immediate death.

Please both of you go and read Matt 5:32 with Matt 5:28. Matt 5:28 is sin. But it is not a sin that results in divorce. Matt 5:32 says actual adultery is. Relating thoughts here to thoughts with Adam, Eve and the devil line up perfectly if we consider them to be venial sins that do not lead to death. But that then the ultimate deed, eating the fruit, actual literal fornication and in the devils case an extreme thought / deed perhaps of wanting a seat higher then God = death.

IE, we have not and never will have ''perfect'' spirits. We are eternally sealed by Jesus.
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All sin starts in the mind, but we as believers have the added power and responsibility under God now to cast out the thoughts that lead to sin---because we now have the insight of God to see beyond the thought to where it can lead us.
 
Glad4Mercy said:
Yes, because what did God say? You shall not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for the day you eat of it you will surely die. He didnt say anything about being tempted to eat it.
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He didn't because any thought about the tree would never result in death. They had to actually eat of it.

Just like you don't divorce your spouse for lustful thoughts.
 
KingJ said:
You liked Glads post but I am wondering if you actually read it. She said ''a. Yes, Eve did entertain it. But at any time before she ate the fruit, she could have come to her senses and fled, and would not have died if she did.''
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Notice: Eve did not cast down the thought of eating from the tree God commanded them not to eat from, but kept entertaining that thought which allowed sin to conceive in her heart, and then went through doing it.

Gen 3:6.. And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
 
KingJ said:
He didn't because any thought about the tree would never result in death. They had to actually eat of it.

Just like you don't divorce your spouse for lustful thoughts.
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...and God doesnt throw His children away because they struggle with temptation. (Don't sin deliberately though, that's bad, bad, bad)..

It is my experience that if a young lamb is striving to walk pleasing to the Lord, and they fail at some point (not deliberately) they need to get up and start walking or running again...and God is there cheering them on and encouraging them as a proud Father. That's if they are sincerely striving to do the things that please Him in all things.

Did you get mad at your baby child when he was learning to walk and fell down, or did you pick him back up and cheer him on
 
Timothy, if you're still reading...

I noticed you said you pray to God for protection and for forgiveness everyday. That's a good thing. It is also very helpful to get into the habit of thanksgiving and praise. Thank God for everything on a daily basis. You could spend a good ammount of prayer thanking God for all that He's done. I thank Jesus for dying for me, for rising, for ascending to be my High Priest and Heavenly advocate. I thank God for all of His provisions, I thank God for my wife, children, and grandson, I thank God for my job, etc. In doing this, you are giving God the thanks that He deserves, and you are also gaining a fresh perspective on the positive things that God is doing, instead of thinking about fears and doubts.

Also, if you havent done so already, get in the habit of praising God. Some people find it difficult to praise God because of how they feel or their circumstances, but we don't praise God because we feel good, we praise Him because He is worthy to be praised. God INHABITS the praise of His people.

Dedicate a time during the day (maybe in the morning) where you just spend time praising and thanking God, (and not asking for anything). Perhaps after you've laid all your burdens at His feet, you can spend time AGAIN praising and thanking Him.

Get involved in intercessory prayer. Pray for the lost, the wandering Christians who have kind of drifted away, the sick, your pastor, the leaders in your church, etc. This is a tremendous ministry, and it takes your eyes off your doubts and puts them on the needs of others.

...and look for ways to serve in your church. When I first came back to the Lord, we didnt have holders for the hymnals, so I would bring out the hymnals and put them on the chairs on Sunday for the worshippers. The church I attend now has a Crew for setup of events, a group called the Watchmen that provide security in the parking lot during services and functions (taking turns of course), people that clean the church, ushers, teachers, worship team, etc. Pray and ask God where He wants to use you.

You may already be doing all of these things, but I am just putting them out there as possible suggestions. These are ways that we take our eyes off our fears and put them on God.
 
TimothyHonorGod said:
Sometimes I feel unloved and forsaken. I pray everyday to Jesus for protection and for him to forgive me of all my sins. At times I even think that I am hopeless and am condemned already. Does he still love me and want me to go to heaven?
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If you are struggling I suggest praying for wisdom and guidance. likely you are filling condemned because he is trying to teach you something that you want to know but just arn't getting it. For example when you pray for patients he usually putts you in situations where you have to be patient. I have found that when I Prey to give God thanks for my struggle and to reveal what it is I am to learn form this so that i can grow in him and get throw the struggle that I'm currently going threw.
 
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